New to forum. What timeframe matches this forum? What counts as vintage? :confused:

Easiest question EVER:

If its not a current model and you like it, it's 'classic'.

If you are selling a bike and want to get top dollar for it, it's 'vintage'.

If you are buying a bike and trying to talk the seller down, it's 'old'.

:thumbsup:

Sorry to say, but cratz2 is pretty right on in his assessment. To me, a lot of the stuff that's called classic or vintage are just a bunch of cheap old college bikes gone to seed. Despite many attempts to define what is classic, vintage or plain old old, none of these attempts genuinely gains traction.

Yup, Cratz2 got it right- it depends on whether you're buying of selling.

New to forum. What timeframe matches this forum? What counts as vintage? :confused:

"Vintage" is sometines defined as pre-1984 (no index shifting) lugged steel, usually top-of-the-line Campy, with Reynolds 531 double-butted or the best Columbus tubing, and sew-ups, and 10 or 12 speeds. The kind of bike that won more Grand Tours than anything ever has or probably ever will.

Classic is much more vague.

Easiest question EVER:

If its not a current model and you like it, it's 'classic'.

If you are selling a bike and want to get top dollar for it, it's 'vintage'.

If you are buying a bike and trying to talk the seller down, it's 'old'.

:thumbsup:

LOL!! Great answer! As I suspected after long hours on eBay...

Now a specific question: I recently bought a NOS frame advertised as "Colnago Master Olympic." It's gorgeous, of course, but I wonder about the Mapei colors -- was there really a Master Olympic released in Mapei strip? Most of the Master Olympics I've seen are finished in a Deco scheme. It doesn't really matter -- all the Master series were about the same whether called Master, Master Light, Master XL, or Master Olympic. When was the last Master Olympic released?

BTW the built-up bike is sweet, but definitely not vintage. Mavic Helium with Tufo tubulars, Colnago Precisa fork; but full DuraAce 7800, Easton bars and stem, Fizik Arione, Speedplay X1s.

Kan i stil play in this forum?? :cool:

For argument's sake, why not make the cut-off 1985? My Somec of that year has beautiful lugs. They're veritably festooned with cut-outs. Sure, it's got a fade paint job, but would that really disqualify it? :cryin: Or for that matter make the cut-off 1989, the year that's held up in another thread as containing the most beautiful bikes in the TdF. It was still a time before index shifting, too.

Why not confine vintage to the days before investment cast bottom brackets; the days when bottom brackets were welded together from two pieces? How about to the days before braze-ons, when everything from water bottle holders to cable guides were held on by clips?:rolleyes:

If you ask Mr. Rivendell, bikes stopped being worth a damn when the makers went from making frames equipped for standard reach brakes to ones demanding short reach brakes.:thumbsup: Now there's a cut-off date if there ever was one!:aureola:

In other words, you can put the cut-off dates anywhere you want.

Sorry. I'm a little bit cranky. I was rooting for Rasmussen.

If you ask Mr. Rivendell, bikes stopped being worth a damn when the makers went from making frames equipped for standard reach brakes to ones demanding short reach brakes.:thumbsup: Now there's a cut-off date if there ever was one!:aureola:


I had never read that before but to be honest, I've actually thought that very thing.

For argument's sake, why not make the cut-off 1985? My Somec of that year has beautiful lugs. They're veritably festooned with cut-outs. Sure, it's got a fade paint job, but would that really disqualify it? :cryin: Or for that matter make the cut-off 1989, the year that's held up in another thread as containing the most beautiful bikes in the TdF. It was still a time before index shifting, too.

Why not confine vintage to the days before investment cast bottom brackets; the days when bottom brackets were welded together from two pieces? How about to the days before braze-ons, when everything from water bottle holders to cable guides were held on by clips?:rolleyes:

If you ask Mr. Rivendell, bikes stopped being worth a damn when the makers went from making frames equipped for standard reach brakes to ones demanding short reach brakes.:thumbsup: Now there's a cut-off date if there ever was one!:aureola:

In other words, you can put the cut-off dates anywhere you want.

Sorry. I'm a little bit cranky. I was rooting for Rasmussen.

There are pretty strict and somewhat arbitrary definations for vintage and classic autombiles, and these terms have some meaning. If you don't apply some time periods and features to the definition of vintage or classic racing bikes, the terms become meaningless. I'm basing my definition on the Rose Bowl Vintage Bicycle ride, which is one of the Premier vinatge rides. They use a 1985 cutoff date, with no stinking click shifters.

A more succint defination might be--If it doesn't look like a bike Eddy raced on, it's not a Vintage Racing Bicycle.

My definitions for racing bikes, take them or leave them:

Antique--Diamond frame racing bikes before derailleur with downtube shifters.
Vintage--High-end racing bikes From about 1950 to 1985, Lugged steel, clips and straps, sew-ups, friction shifting.
Classic--High end racing bikes from the end of the vintage era up to the onset of Brifters.
Modern--Racing bikes with Brifters.

New to forum. What timeframe matches this forum? What counts as vintage? :confused:

I would say vintage would need to be 25 years old or more.

Classic would have to be at least 15 years old and memorable in some way, either by history, design, or aesthetics.

Old is anything that doesn't fetch more than $150 on ebay.

Reynolds.

I like your definitions.

This is perhaps the most difficult area to define when it comes to dealing with old things...

An item's vintage refers to it's year or period of production and can have nothing to do with the items level of quality whereas a classic only becomes a classic by virtue of it's outstanding design, appeal, and influence on similar products.

For an object to be considered an antique it generally has to be 50 years old and things don't tend to be identified as being classic until they're at least 25 years old and have stood the test of time.

Retro speaks to new designs that draw heavily on the appeal of those classic designs from many years past.

In relation to bikes and I'll use my own as examples...

My 1978 Raleigh Superbe 3 speed is a classic bike... everyone seems to know someone who rode one or owned one themselves and it is a design that still receives wide appeal since it is what a bike should like like to many people.

We can't get enough of these bikes at our shop as the demand is so high.

My 1955 Raleigh Lenton and 1955 Peugeot PLX10 Grande Tourisme are antiques with the Lenton being the classic British fixed gear club bike from a time when derailleur gears were still uncommon.

The Peugeot is an amazing bike as it's basically a racing bike in touring drag... the frame is very light and the Simplex gruppo isn't the cheap and fragile plastic models we see in 60's bikes but rather, has a rare Simplex JUY543 and Competition shifter.

My 1933 and 1940 CCM coaster bikes are definately antiques and what most people also consider your classic (Canadian) coaster bikes. The design of the 1933 was carried forward through the 40's with very few changes while the 1940 is a less common frame with a double top tube.