Why after a hard ride do I smell ammonia when I breath in....especially when I'm in the shower. Does it mean I'm really out of shape?

Steve

Your sweat will smell like ammonia only if an excessive amount of amino acids are being used for energy, or you are not receiving adequate water. Eat some more carbs during the workout and/or drink more water.

It's due to muscle damage from a high level of exertion. The amino acids that enter your bloodstream make you smell ammonia. Don't have a source, but other posters should be able to give you more information.

Silas

Why after a hard ride do I smell ammonia when I breath in....especially when I'm in the shower. Does it mean I'm really out of shape?

Steve

It means your body ran out of carbs and started to burn some protein.

Don't worry, I smell it all the time, and I eat PLENTY of carbs. Sometimes I smell it on my easy days. :confused:

I don't think it has anything to do with being out of shape, because I've smelled it more this year than I did last year... and I'm in much better shape.

Oddly, while I agree with everything posted here, I've yet to find any scientific data to support this. Has this NOT been researched? There are all sorts of anecdotal info on bodybuilding and running sites, but that is about it.

Oddly, while I agree with everything posted here, I've yet to find any scientific data to support this. Has this NOT been researched? There are all sorts of anecdotal info on bodybuilding and running sites, but that is about it.

I believe if you look up Ketosis you might find something. I never notice it too much with exercise, but I certainly notice it if I'm trying to lose weight and I am going hungry.

I believe if you look up Ketosis you might find something. I never notice it too much with exercise, but I certainly notice it if I'm trying to lose weight and I am going hungry.

That would make sense. If you're cutting calories, your body will break down fat and protein for energy, causing ketosis. :)

That would make sense. If you're cutting calories, your body will break down fat and protein for energy, causing ketosis. :)

Right, as I understand it the ammonia smell is a by-product of accelerated protein metabolism. I'm not sure if that defines Ketosis per se, but it is one of it's characteristics.

Right, as I understand it the ammonia smell is a by-product of accelerated protein metabolism. I'm not sure if that defines Ketosis per se, but it is one of it's characteristics.

ketosis could be from protein breakdown (maybe?), but i think fat metabolism is much better at making ketone bodies. ketogenesis makes you smell like acetone (nail polish remover), not so much like ammonia.

Physiologically and anatomically, sweat glands are somewhat similar to filtration tubules in kidneys. There are often minute amounts of urea, the final breakdown product of protein metabolism, in sweat. With profuse amounts of sweating, there is enough urea in sweat to make you and your clothes smell like used baby diapers. This is totally normal and not a matter for concern. The crude little kidneys ( sweat glands ) in your skin are simply doing their job.

ketosis could be from protein breakdown (maybe?), but i think fat metabolism is much better at making ketone bodies. ketogenesis makes you smell like acetone (nail polish remover), not so much like ammonia.

Gee, maybe its the brand nail polish remover I use? It all began when I started shaving my legs.............

Steve

ketosis could be from protein breakdown (maybe?), but i think fat metabolism is much better at making ketone bodies. ketogenesis makes you smell like acetone (nail polish remover), not so much like ammonia.

I had my smells mixed up, I meant that acetone smell is what I experience when I am going hungry, not ammonia.

I had my smells mixed up, I meant that acetone smell is what I experience when I am going hungry, not ammonia.

Here's the story on ketosis, for those who care:

Fat metabolism produced acetyl-coA, which normally enters the citric acid cycle by combinding with oxaloacetate to form citrate, and off the cycle goes. However, oxaloacetate is synthesized from pyruvate, a product of carbohydrate metabolism, so if you're not eating carbs, no oxaloacetate is formed. Furthermore, if you're really fasting, what oxaloacetate there is gets consumed to produce glucose to keep your brain working, via the glucogenic pathway (the brain pretty much runs only on glucose). The upshot is that all that all that acetyl-coA has no place to go, so the body turns it into acetoacetate and acetone, also known as ketone bodies, which can be smelled on the breath of people fasting or eating much more fat than carb.
I have me doubts that this is what you smell following exercise, as you have to be pretty damned starving to activate this pathway. I do, however, have a PhD in biochemistry, so it gratifies my fragile ego to spew out otherwise useless information with little prompting.

I had my smells mixed up, I meant that acetone smell is what I experience when I am going hungry, not ammonia.

how regularly do you smell acetone?
i never have, but i have gotten the shakes from low blood sugar at the end of a ride. it is something that you noticed more as you were better conditioned- i am still quite a novice.

Interesting stuff, that.

Now I'm not fasting and I'm also not eating more fat than carbs, but I am trying to cut calories to lose weight. I'm not sure if it's ammonia I smell or acetone, but I smell something funky, almost metallic. It's not on my clothes or on my skin, so it's not sweat. The smell is actually IN my nose, not on something... if that makes sense. If I inhale deeply after a ride or if I haven't eaten enough that day, I smell it. It almost burns my nose a little.

Not sure if that's what the other poster was referring to (I assumed it was), or if that makes a difference. It's definitely related to being down on calories, if not carbs.

Interesting stuff, that.

Now I'm not fasting and I'm also not eating more fat than carbs, but I am trying to cut calories to lose weight. I'm not sure if it's ammonia I smell or acetone, but I smell something funky, almost metallic. It's not on my clothes or on my skin, so it's not sweat. The smell is actually IN my nose, not on something... if that makes sense. If I inhale deeply after a ride or if I haven't eaten enough that day, I smell it. It almost burns my nose a little.

Not sure if that's what the other poster was referring to (I assumed it was), or if that makes a difference. It's definitely related to being down on calories, if not carbs.
The only time I noticed that smell was during ultra-hard efforts when I was dieting, doing lots of strength training and eating more protein than carbs. I believe smelling this should be a sign that you need more carbs and/or water in your diet.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/ammonia.htm

Interesting stuff, that.

Now I'm not fasting and I'm also not eating more fat than carbs, but I am trying to cut calories to lose weight. I'm not sure if it's ammonia I smell or acetone, but I smell something funky, almost metallic. It's not on my clothes or on my skin, so it's not sweat. The smell is actually IN my nose, not on something... if that makes sense. If I inhale deeply after a ride or if I haven't eaten enough that day, I smell it. It almost burns my nose a little.

Not sure if that's what the other poster was referring to (I assumed it was), or if that makes a difference. It's definitely related to being down on calories, if not carbs.

that sort of makes sense. the acetone bubbles out of the blood and exits as gas in the lungs. Ask someone else to smell your breath for you if you are concerned (no kidding)?

it is an adaptation to starvation - you may not be getting enough carbohydrate for your activity level, so when you run out the liver makes more glucose to feed the brain, the rest of the body gets to eat ketones. although this seems kind of acute for ketosis, i think it occurs on the orders of days to weeks. vigorous excercise could be different or i could just be wrong.
keep in mind that i am not a doctor and don't know if there are any diseases that mimic this.

the north american anectdote is that if you go into a room full of models and close the door the whole place will reek of nail polish remover in a few minutes. my apologies to all of the models who don't smell.

it does sound like ketosis. however it should not be confused with diabetic ketosis or ketoacidosis. we diabetics have to deal with variations of this stuff all the time. i suggest if you have concerns do a google search for 'diabetic ketosis' or check with your physician.:)

you said "almost metallic"... I don't think ammonia or acetone smell metallic at all. HOWEVER, I frequently smell something metallic on my skin while exercising, and I TASTE it, too. Someone here sent me to this website, and altho it's about horses, it seems to me the same science could apply to humans. I haven't found any info anywhere about EIPH in humans. The metallic taste/smell could be from the iron in your blood...

http://www.equinehospital.net/EIPH.htm

here is a very helpful article i found concerning this ammonia smell which i too get from time to time. be sure to read the entire article as the conclusions are a bit different than most of those posted in this thread.
http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/cms/article-detail.asp?articleid=326

Why after a hard ride do I smell ammonia when I breath in....especially when I'm in the shower. Does it mean I'm really out of shape?

Steve


try using a deodarant soap when you shower

Why after a hard ride do I smell ammonia when I breath in....especially when I'm in the shower. Does it mean I'm really out of shape?

Steve

You're body is breaking down lean muscle ... which you don't want. With maximal sustained efforts, you can't avoid it to a degree...

see http://www.planetultra.com/training/born4.html

This is a good outline of what's going on.

-D

here is a very helpful article i found concerning this ammonia smell which i too get from time to time. be sure to read the entire article as the conclusions are a bit different than most of those posted in this thread.
http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/cms/article-detail.asp?articleid=326

the article mentions gluconeogenesis and production of ketone bodies from amino acids and fat. this is exactly the same stuff that has been discussed above. conclusions are not significantly different.

you said "almost metallic"... I don't think ammonia or acetone smell metallic at all. HOWEVER, I frequently smell something metallic on my skin while exercising, and I TASTE it, too. Someone here sent me to this website, and altho it's about horses, it seems to me the same science could apply to humans. I haven't found any info anywhere about EIPH in humans. The metallic taste/smell could be from the iron in your blood...

http://www.equinehospital.net/EIPH.htm

Nope.
Unless your name is Armstrong, Ullrich or Indurain EIPH will flat out never apply to you. And probably not to them either. You can't push the limits of your pulmonary circulation until you have an obscene cardiac output (like a thoroughbred horse no less). I'd bet my house no one on here has that CO, if you did you'd be training in the pyrenees right now.

This has been the subject of study by really brilliant lung physiologists and physicians, and it just isn't credible in humans.