Just heard one of your leaders, George Mitchell, on Fox News running through the litany of allies who are talking about troop withdrawal, soon. Italy is pullijng out and he said Blair is talking about '06. Then there was a quick line about information the President had planned a large withdrawal prior to the next american elections. Given the acknowledged duplicity of Republicans and the open and bipartisan nature and intent of Democrats, could the appearance of this latest sh*t storm seeming to be an attempt to steal the administrations thunder with that withdrawal be mere concidence? I know, given their open and honest nature that they would NEVER try to position themselves to take credit for any success of the failed policies of this administration..............would they?

Just heard one of your leaders, George Mitchell, on Fox News running through the litany of allies who are talking about troop withdrawal, soon. Italy is pullijng out and he said Blair is talking about '06. Then there was a quick line about information the President had planned a large withdrawal prior to the next american elections. Given the acknowledged duplicity of Republicans and the open and bipartisan nature and intent of Democrats, could the appearance of this latest sh*t storm seeming to be an attempt to steal the administrations thunder with that withdrawal be mere concidence? I know, given their open and honest nature that they would NEVER try to position themselves to take credit for any success of the failed policies of this administration..............would they?
Nah. You give the Dems way too much credit for thinking strategericly. They'd get brain bends if they had to think THAT little ploy through to a year from now. Sheesh.

Nah. You give the Dems way too much credit for thinking strategericly. They'd get brain bends if they had to think THAT little ploy through to a year from now. Sheesh.
Although I do wonder what our other leader, Michael Moore, says about that.

Although I do wonder what our other leader, Michael Moore, says about that.

Well, George does have a bit more legitamacy at this point. It does sound like a very twisted plot and difficult to follow but it falls in line with the predeliction for secrecy from this administration and Democrats desperate need to at least stay even on some level. this way, when George "surprises" the nation with his success and brings some troops home, Dems. can say it was because of the pressure they exerted. A pox on both their houses.

If anything, the pressure of the 2006 mid-term election, will make Repubs pressure the administration to bring our troops home by 11/06.

Problem is, besides the Brits, we never had true allies on this.

For GWI, the cost was 60 billion dollars, and it was largely paid for by our allies. For GWII, it's already cost 400 billion, and the American taxpayers are footing the bill AND taking the brunt of the casualties and coming home wheelchair bound. So much for the administration's promises that Iraqi oil would pay for it.

If anything, the pressure of the 2006 mid-term election, will make Repubs pressure the administration to bring our troops home by 11/06.

You're missing the point and spirit of this thread, my friend. Perhaps your handle gives a clue? Slow down a bit. We aren't rehashing the whole thing, just discussing, while observing, the current political throat cutting and blood letting as the two forms of hypocracy meet head on.

You're missing MY point. It's democracy in action, my friend. The people's representatives, from both parties, are hearing from their constituents and seeing the mid-term election on the horizon.

Take a look at Santorum's recent behavior, as an example.

You're missing MY point. It's democracy in action, my friend. The people's representatives, from both parties, are hearing from their constituents and seeing the mid-term election on the horizon.

Take a look at Santorum's recent behavior, as an example.

You are so quick to analize your opposition but you never seem to be able to see the duplicity and undercurrents in your own party. You may as well be blind. Of course it is democracy at work, both sides have legitamate views and both sides pursue them, often through deception. We are supposed to try to see through that deception from both sides. What is taking place today is positioning for the coming elections and both sides are going to get bloodied in the process. This is the nastiest I have ever seen politics get, maybe I just missed it before, but this seems to be no holds barred. Your guys are dealing in the mud as well. Everybody is going to need a bath when this is over. Don't lecture me about character and standards till the people you support display some.

If this administration wasn't deaf, dumb, and blind (and can't even play a mean pinball)pinheads, it wouldn't be playing out the way it is.

It's about time that the Dems responded with toughness to the partisan way the Bush administration and the Republican Congress have been running this country into the ground.

Where'd you get it from? If it were the case, you'd have to hand it to the Dems. Quite astute wouldn' t you say? If it were true, and you're asking me to say that it some how is in poor form, you better go looking somewhere else. This would be one good POLITICAL shennanigan.

BT

Where'd you get it from? If it were the case, you'd have to hand it to the Dems. Quite astute wouldn' t you say? If it were true, and you're asking me to say that it some how is in poor form, you better go looking somewhere else. This would be one good POLITICAL shennanigan.

BT

I was watching an interview with George Mitchell yesterday, a passing line was to the effect that the Bush administration planned a troop withdrawal just before the next elections here. Aha, it started to make sense. I have never said the Dems weren't astute or duplicitous. They are politicians for cryin' out loud. They are also fighting on the ropes and are dangerous. :) (That would also be a very sneaky trick on the part of the neocons)

If you watch more than Fox News, you'd have heard a whole bunch of astute people saying variations of the same theme.

If you watch more than Fox News, you'd have heard a whole bunch of astute people saying variations of the same theme.

Well gee, what can you expect from th great unwashed? I watch FOX and I shop at Walmart.

Well apparently you missed the horde of people making the same prediction Mitchell was making so either "Fair and Balanced" is your only source for news or???

No, you're clued in and the two-thirds of the country that disapproves of GWB and the 80+% that disapproves of Cheney are clueless.

As if their Iraq plan had a clue...

Well apparently you missed the horde of people making the same prediction Mitchell was making so either "Fair and Balanced" is your only source for news or???

No, you're clued in and the two-thirds of the country that disapproves of GWB and the 80+% that disapproves of Cheney are clueless.

As if their Iraq plan had a clue...

Did that sting?

Snake, is this administration snakebit? Do you have the antidote?

Snake, is this administration snakebit? Do you have the antidote?

We're currently killing the snakes.......some of us are. ;)

I guess that means that you don't have the antidote.

All of those who warned that Iraq wouldn't a "cakewalk," that we wouldn't be greeted as "liberators"--as this administration repeatedly claimed--have been proved right. But this administration, wrong on every count, wants more carte blanche to increase violence, regional instability, and global terrorism.

I guess that means that you don't have the antidote.

All of those who warned that Iraq wouldn't a "cakewalk," that we wouldn't be greeted as "liberators"--as this administration repeatedly claimed--have been proved right. But this administration, wrong on every count, wants more carte blanche to increase violence, regional instability, and global terrorism.

You're not only speedy, you're relentless, I'll give you that.;)

You're not only speedy, you're relentless, I'll give you that.;)I'm still waiting for a few examples of insurgencies that have been defeated by an occupying power.

I'm still waiting for a few examples of insurgencies that have been defeated by an occupying power.

The Germans did a pretty fair job of it in France, not failing until after Normandy. The Soviets kept their thumbs on a multitude of groups during their reign. Tito kept the lid on the Balkans until the demise of the old Union. The United States suppressed a rebellion in the Phillippines during our colonial experiment. It happens from time to time. Not all uprisings are successful. In the olden days, when Ed and I were still children, Rome put down an uprising in Israel, in fact, they managed to put them down all over the known world. there was that Spartacus thing that is pretty well known.

The Germans did a pretty fair job of it in France, not failing until after Normandy. The Soviets kept their thumbs on a multitude of groups during their reign. Tito kept the lid on the Balkans until the demise of the old Union. The United States suppressed a rebellion in the Phillippines during our colonial experiment. It happens from time to time. Not all uprisings are successful. In the olden days, when Ed and I were still children, Rome put down an uprising in Israel, in fact, they managed to put them down all over the known world. there was that Spartacus thing that is pretty well known.
Now your next challenge--insurgencies that have been put down without crucifying a few thousand persons as an example.

Now your next challenge--insurgencies that have been put down without crucifying a few thousand persons as an example.
Damn and I was going to bring up Pugachev!!!

Damn and I was going to bring up Pugachev!!!

Again, the Phillippines comes to mind. We did pretty much what we are doing now. Crucifying was out but we did shoot a few insurgents who went amok.

The Germans did a pretty fair job of it in France, not failing until after Normandy. The Soviets kept their thumbs on a multitude of groups during their reign. Tito kept the lid on the Balkans until the demise of the old Union. The United States suppressed a rebellion in the Phillippines during our colonial experiment. It happens from time to time. Not all uprisings are successful. In the olden days, when Ed and I were still children, Rome put down an uprising in Israel, in fact, they managed to put them down all over the known world. there was that Spartacus thing that is pretty well known.Excellent models for success. Way to go starting out with Hitler!

Excellent models for success. Way to go starting out with Hitler!

There's more, China, Saudi Arabia, North Korea and lets not sell our old friend Saddam short either. He could quell a rebellion as well as any of them.

There's more, China, Saudi Arabia, North Korea and lets not sell our old friend Saddam short either. He could quell a rebellion as well as any of them.Smart, then, that we ousted SH without a freakin' plan to provide security and stability to the country ASAP. Also these latest examples are not really foreign occupiers suppressing insurgencies.

So by your intelligent reckoning, democracy can be the result of an occupier behaving like the worst tyrant. Didn't GWB say he was against tyrants? And that the purpose of our excursion was to spread democracy throughout the ME? How does that jive with tyrannical behavior?

Smart, then, that we ousted SH without a freakin' plan to provide security and stability to the country ASAP. Also these latest examples are not really foreign occupiers suppressing insurgencies.

So by your intelligent reckoning, democracy can be the result of an occupier behaving like the worst tyrant. Didn't GWB say he was against tyrants? And that the purpose of our excursion was to spread democracy throughout the ME? How does that jive with tyrannical behavior?

He is against tyrants, that's why he isn't acting like one which in turn, explains the difficulty we are having with the insurgents. It takes a little longer to do it the right way. Patience, Grasshopper.

He is against tyrants, that's why he isn't acting like one which in turn, explains the difficulty we are having with the insurgents. It takes a little longer to do it the right way. Patience, Grasshopper.It's pretty clear he was only against a certain tyrant who happened to be sitting on a whole heck of a lot of oil and against whom he held a personal grudge. It's hard to argue that botched incompetence is "the right way."

Furthermore, much of what they asserted prior to the invasion proved to be false. The tactics in Falluja, the activities in Abu Ghraib, throwing out the Geneva Convention, etc., are not fine examples of our democratic principles. And you're advocating that we escalate it further.

It's pretty clear he was only against a certain tyrant who happened to be sitting on a whole heck of a lot of oil and against whom he held a personal grudge. It's hard to argue that botched incompetence is "the right way."

Furthermore, much of what they asserted prior to the invasion proved to be false. The tactics in Falluja, the activities in Abu Ghraib, throwing out the Geneva Convention, etc., are not fine examples of our democratic principles. And you're advocating that we escalate it further.

No, your side keeps calling for more troops. I'm willing to let the administration finish the job as they see fit. They are not advocating escallation at this point.

Which means that the GWB administration don't want to win or don't know how to.

Which means that the GWB administration don't want to win or don't know how to.

Or it could mean the sky ain't fallin'.

The libs really give Bush too much credit. Whether or not it is successful, they believe he knows how to strategize a battle plan and doesn't need the brain trust in the Pentagon. The same Pentagon that would strategize a war if a lib, um I mean Dem was in office. The same Pentagon that went through the Iraqi army like a hot knife through butter. Same one that defeated the Taliban in similar fashion and the Russians couldn't defeat in ten years of battles. Man Bush sure gets a lot done in 24 hour days :)

They were wrong about everything else, but trust them on this one.

Another poor strategery brought to you by GWB.

The libs really give Bush too much credit. Whether or not it is successful, they believe he knows how to strategize a battle plan and doesn't need the brain trust in the Pentagon. The same Pentagon that would strategize a war if a lib, um I mean Dem was in office. The same Pentagon that went through the Iraqi army like a hot knife through butter. Same one that defeated the Taliban in similar fashion and the Russians couldn't defeat in ten years of battles. Man Bush sure gets a lot done in 24 hour days :)
And still with time to choke on pretzels

Most Presidents accept final responsibility for what happens under their watch as Commander-in-Chief. For some reason GWB and his supporters only accept credit for the little that goes right.

Things are a little rocky in Afghanistan too.

Most Presidents accept final responsibility for what happens under their watch as Commander-in-Chief. For some reason GWB and his supporters only accept credit for the little that goes right.

Things are a little rocky in Afghanistan too.

Say what you will, I don't recall George Bush trying to blame anyone for anything. He usually just remains silent and does whatever he needs to do. He doesn't apologice for breathing and that DOES cause a great deal of frustration on your side.

Who says he's wrong on this? I know you want it done in a New York minute, but these things take time. No quick fixes here. I never knew libs were so impatient. How do you know this won't change the course of history for the better? You don't.

I still don't understand why libs support terrorism. I guess it must be something they breath in the air. We are killing redicals and they want us to stop. Makes sense.

His surrogates blame.

He breathes?

Nazis, Soviets, Holy Romans.... What do all three have in common?

Nazis, Soviets, Holy Romans.... What do all three have in common?



Hmmm, short mustachioed leaders........?

Their empires went kaput.

Their empires went kaput. Due to the effects of everyone being a homos*xu@l...well wait sec...oh well....close enough.:rolleyes:;)