Why isn't the Enron trial getting any play? Are we just over it, or have we accepted all this crap as natural?

Everyone was pissed not too long ago, now it's nowhere to be found.

I haven't had much time to go through this site: http://blogs.chron.com/enrontrialwatch/


But if anyone knows of any particular good ones, leme know.





joe

64 million and 41 million plus annually.wasn't good enough. they had to rob their employees of their retirements as well. Info came out yesterday that lay knew it was tanking and lied to the company saying everything is fine. Hold on to your stock,buy some more. He even froze Enron Stock in their 401K's all the while dumping his.

64 million and 41 million plus annually.wasn't good enough. they had to rob their employees of their retirements as well. Info came out yesterday that lay knew it was tanking and lied to the company saying everything is fine. Hold on to your stock,buy some more. He even froze Enron Stock in their 401K's all the while dumping his.
Great movie on this called The Smartest Men in the Room--The Enron Story. I learned lot about this that I hadn't known. Bottom line--it was robbery by all levels and their were all types of losers in this. The rolling blackouts in CA? Thank Enron for that.

Great movie on this called The Smartest Men in the Room--The Enron Story. I learned lot about this that I hadn't known. Bottom line--it was robbery by all levels and their were all types of losers in this. The rolling blackouts in CA? Thank Enron for that.

you said the magic phrase. yeah and the State of CA's PUC has to subpoena Cheney for the notes from his secret FERC/Enron meetings which he refuses to give up for Nat'l Security Issues. I mean I dislike Bush but friggin Cheney, hate that man.

you said the magic phrase. yeah and the State of CA's PUC has to subpoena Cheney for the notes from his secret FERC/Enron meetings which he refuses to give up for Nat'l Security Issues. I mean I dislike Bush but friggin Cheney, hate that man.
Did you know Schwarzenegger was at that meeting? Gee...you think that he had any inside info on Grey Davis after that?

I wouldn't get too overzealous by 'fact' presented in 'The Smartest Guy in the Room'. Though entertaining, and probably true in a lot of regards, it's historical accuracy left a lot to be desired. The California Energy Crisis was nearly a year old when George Bush became President. The crisis actually subsided quickly after GWB came into office, though not because of him, the state finally taking action that it sorely had needed to take for 8 months plus improved hydro-electric conditions took the bite out. As I mentioned in another thread, I work in energy. Daily, Secretary of Energy Bill Richardson would sign an order requiring all electrical entities in the west to offer any and all unloaded capacity to California Utilities. Enron made a lot of money at Californians expense, but the thought that it was the cause or the major crook in the California Energy Crisis I find hilarious.

was all a well orchestrated coup d'etat cause Cheney hates us libbies out west. Create a coup in hopes of Delay-izing CA, and at the same time fatten your buddies wallets. Arnold was picked in advance as he occupies that Uber Male Stereotype that the cons have found so popular among voters, plus the 'outsider' mystique (which was a lie). Can you imagine, he does a redisricting and bam we're in the same mess as Texas. (which was a Dem state before Delay)

that's why he claims Nat'l Security.If the American Public knew what these SOBs were up to they'd be strung up from the nearest tree

who started the ball rolling with 'create the fake shortage'. look it was a bunch of Cons in the Cal State PUC that unregulated energy in our state and a bunch of Cons that took advantage of the situation that even a non econ major could figure out wouldn't work.
was it going on prior to W, yes? Did ole Dicky Boy and Kenny devise a nice plan out of it, yes.

Enron owned no physical facilities in the State of California, you tell me how they could create a shortage? They were a TRADER. While they owned Portland General Electric, Portland General is in...dun, dun, da...Portland, they had no physical facilities in the State of California.
The California Legislature deregulated electricity...by unanomous vote. That Legislature was Democratically controlled. They still have not fixed Californias energy problems, in fact most of the rules used to extract large amounts of $$$ from the California ratepayers are still in effect today!!!
Sorry, I had a front row seat for the California Energy Crisis, your conspiracy theories aren't going to fly by me.
That said, I hope they send both those bastards, especially Skilling, to fry. Unfortunately, even if they do, the real bandits, are still untouched and likely never will be.

Great movie on this called The Smartest Men in the Room--The Enron Story. I learned lot about this that I hadn't known. Bottom line--it was robbery by all levels and their were all types of losers in this. The rolling blackouts in CA? Thank Enron for that.Yup, I also saw this movie, it was very very well done, and very informative. The audio of the traders talking was just chilling.

How'd da do dat?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis

Market manipulation

As the FERC report concluded, market manipulation was only possible as a result of the complex market design produced by the process of partial deregulation. Manipulation strategies were known to energy traders under names such as "Fat Boy", "Death Star", "Forney Perpetual Loop", "Ricochet", "Ping Pong", "Black Widow", "Big Foot", "Red Congo", "Cong Catcher" and "Get Shorty".[4] Some of these have been extensively investigated and described in reports.

Megawatt laundering is the term, analogous to money laundering, coined to describe the process of obscuring the true origins of specific quantities of electricity being sold on the energy market. The California energy market allowed for price distinctions between electricity produced in-state and out-of-state. It was therefore advantageous to make it appear that electricity was being generated somewhere other than its true origin.

Overscheduling is a term used in describing the manipulation of transporting electricity along power lines. Power lines have a defined maximum load. Lines must be booked (or scheduled) in advance for transporting bought-and-sold quantities of electricity. "Overscheduling" means a deliberate reservation of more line usage than is actually required and can create the appearance that the power lines are congested. Overscheduling was one of the building blocks of a number of scams. For example, the Death Star group of scams played on the market rules which required the state to pay "congestion fees" to alleviate congestion on major power lines. "Congestion fees" were a variety of financial incentives aimed at ensuring power providers solved the congestion problem. But in the Death Star scenario, the congestion was entirely illusory and the congestion fees would therefore simply increase profits.

In a letter sent from David Fabian to Senator Boxer in 2002, it was alleged that:

"There is a single connection between northern and southern California's power grids. I heard that Enron traders purposely overbooked that line, then caused others to need it. Next, by California's free-market rules, Enron was allowed to price-gouge at will."

How'd da do dat?

"Death Star": Enron would overschedule its expected power transmissions to create the illusion that the state's grid would be overloaded, then receive state payment for "relieving" the congestion. The beauty of this con, the company's memos noted, is that "Enron gets paid for moving energy to relieve congestion without actually moving any energy or relieving any congestion." It's the sort of protection deal that would make Tony Soprano proud.

"Fat Boy": This scam (aka "Inc-ing") also involved overscheduling power transmission -- for example, to a company subsidiary that didn't really need all of it. Then Enron would sell the "excess" power to the state at a premium.

"Ricochet": Also called "megawatt laundering" (by analogy to money laundering), Ricochet was the power equivalent of a real-estate land flip: buy in-state power cheaply, flip it out-of-state to an intermediary, then re-sell it to California at a highly inflated "imported" price.

Thank you for the lesson on TRADING scams, I'm overwhelmed at your ability to cut and paste and not understand the difference between financial games and physical shortages.

and colluded with their competitors to take energy suppliers off-line for 'un-needed' maintenance. Energy Production sites were 'closing or shutting down' specifically to create shortages and drive the prices up. There has already been info released showing them telling plants in the PNW to shut down on such and such a day. They created a false energy shortages so they could manipulate the price period.

Thank you for the lesson on TRADING scams, I'm overwhelmed at your ability to cut and paste and not understand the difference between financial games and physical shortages.
Of course it was a scam. What's up with the attitude lately? Having a bad week?

Thank you for the lesson on TRADING scams, I'm overwhelmed at your ability to cut and paste and not understand the difference between financial games and physical shortages.


Thank you and you're welcome

are what has been released by FERC. There are oodles that Cheney refuses to let the state PUC examine.

Suddenly, everything that FERC says is gospel... :D

so everything they say that isn't 'forced out' is suspect. I got peeps in the CA PUC, you would not believe their frustration at the logjam ole dick has created. the FERC has been forced toadmit the delaings that have been made public. The fact that Dick met with the perps during and after and hides the minutes under nat security blanket is a tad suspect don't ya think?

my guess is these minutes will disappear the same way his e's the day of Plame'soutings and the teleconfrences on D-Day of katrina.

Let me guess, you hang out with Loretta Lynch (thankfully X-CPUC)...now why wouldn't that surprise me :rolleyes: .

but I guess since you don't like Loretta (whom I think I have met but don't know) was she an ALJ?
and seem to have a grudge against the CPUC so you are all in favor of what Cheney and Lay and Co. did to the state. I never really thought someone would defend an outright robbery, but I guess it takes all kinds. You think price gouging is good business?

it was Wilson's Republican Appointees who started the energy deregulation in the first place. A bunch of folks from the ProBusiness Party thinking that deregulation would help. Uh deregulation energy only created more middlemen, not more producers. the increase in demand by new middlemen and competition for unchanged amount of energy resulted in a smallrise in profits. When the producers (Enron and the likes) saw this, they started messing with the supply to extend their profits.
funny how a bunch of Supposedly Savvy Republicans can have such a horrid grasp on the concept of supply and demand and it's effect on price. Wow, lets increase the demand at the wholesale level without changing production.That'll be huge savings at the retail end!!!!!

absolutely incompetent or corrupt

You're just priceless! I guess statements such as "That said, I hope they send both those bastards, especially Skilling, to fry. Unfortunately, even if they do, the real bandits, are still untouched and likely never will be" do show how much I think price gouging is good business. :rolleyes: Actually for all her faults, Loretta and the CPUC forced rate increases (abeit a little too late) down Gray's throat which curtailed consumption and was very key to getting the crisis under control. Who would think, supply and demand theory actually works.

it was Wilson's Republican Appointees who started the energy deregulation in the first place. A bunch of folks from the ProBusiness Party thinking that deregulation would help. Uh deregulation energy only created more middlemen, not more producers. the increase in demand by new middlemen and competition for unchanged amount of energy resulted in a smallrise in profits. When the producers (Enron and the likes) saw this, they started messing with the supply to extend their profits.
funny how a bunch of Supposedly Savvy Republicans can have such a horrid grasp on the concept of supply and demand and it's effect on price. Wow, lets increase the demand at the wholesale level without changing production.That'll be huge savings at the retail end!!!!!

absolutely incompetent or corrupt
You're in way over your head...

sorry I missed your blasts from the earlier post. when the PUC forced such down Grays throat the damage had already been done. would it matter? It wouldn't have existed at all if CA had never deregulated and /or energy producers didn't illegally take advantage of it.
Kinda like blaming the victims of a crime. "Your fault honey for wearing that dress". Look deregulation of the phone system worked here in CA because it created more on the production end. Some meatheads without thinking it through (or because they were getting whispers from the energy industry) tried to apply the same logic on energy. What they failed to factor in was, no one upon regulation is going to throw up a hydro-electric dam, coal or nuke plant or windmills. Deregulation of energy had no effect on the production end and was thus doomed to failure.

I just wish for all white collar crimes they'd do zero tolerance like drugs.sieze all their assets and throw them into real jail.


was it the rate increases that curtailed consumption or the fake rolling blackouts. again none of this would have existed without the scam.