when buying from a LBS, how many % off msrp is considered a good deal?

None. If you're buying a bike I think most places will knock 10% off accessories or throw in some bottles and cages, but bike shops are just retail stores like everyplace else. If you're buying a new bike some places will on occassion take a bit off, especially at the end of the season, but that would be on a case by case basis. I don't think too many places will drop prices on random things just because you want them to do so.
Many people here would have you believe it's your obligation and duty to put the LBS owners kids through school, and would chastise you for even thinking of a discount. I disagree, but think it depends on what you're buying. A bike, ask, other things, it's not worth being a cheap ass to save $1.26. Thats what the 20% Nashbar codes are for.

Three simple rules for staying happy with your LBS:

1 - Forge a long-term relationship with the store. Drop by once in a while when you don't need anything, don't ask for discounts on the little items such as tubes and bottles, discuss your long-term buying plans.

2 - Be flexible when shopping for the big items. This means being open to different products as well as timing your purchases. If you're not happy with the deal, be ready to wait. It's only hardware...

3 - Remember that there's more to a good deal than a great price and try to maximize the overall value. Good LBSes can and will offer service that you can't get mail-order, and they'll often give labor freebies to their regulars.

If the LBS is staffed by good people, that should be all you need; otherwise, you might want to try a different store. Perhaps my LBS is unusual, but they have been taking good care of me for a long time and always offer good prices without any pressure. When I bought my Jamis in September 2005, I got a new 2004 model with more than 30% discount.

When I got back into biking about 3 years ago most of the local shops simply knocked about 5% off without me even asking. They were all giving 10% off accessories with a bike purchase.
More recently, I purchased a "new" 2004 leftover and I asked how much would he take off retail, he came back with how much you willing to pay--I named my price, he said sold and we both walked away happy. I ended up saving 30% and he probably got most of his money back as I did a few upgrades before leaving.
Recently had my adjustments done for free over a year later. So it paid to go the LBS route.

i am considering buying a bike and want to know how much lbs are willing to discount. but it seems like it depends. i'll probably go check them out and like hammersandwich said, may have to wait til they have sales on older models.

krusty46, when did you buy your '04 model bike?

btw, which jamis did you get, hammersandwich?

when buying from a LBS, how many % off msrp is considered a good deal?
10% is what I get @ the cash register. That's not counting the free advice, and service.

It was actualy March of last year. It was very early in the season of 2005. He had new stuff coming in and just wanted to get rid of old inventory.

The first bike I bought was in August of 2003. Was on vacation in upstate NY and kept seeing all these riders going on these long stretches of road and I just kept saying to myself, boy I wish I had a bike. Walked into the local shop and the guy gave me and my brother 20% discounts if we each got a bike. Sold.

btw, which jamis did you get, hammersandwich?
An Eclipse, and I really like it.

Three simple rules for staying happy with your LBS:

don't ask for discounts on the little items such as tubes and bottles, for the big items ... be open to different products ... It's only hardware...

Buy the highest markup items in the store at full price. Buy what the LBS has, even if it's not quite what you had in mind, and be prepared to wait for the privilege?

Man, that doesn't sound like a good deal at all.

Buy the highest markup items in the store at full price. Buy what the LBS has, even if it's not quite what you had in mind, and be prepared to wait for the privilege?

Man, that doesn't sound like a good deal at all.
Ask not what your LBS can do for you, but what you can do for LBS. Some guy decided he wanted to open a bike shop, so now it's your responsibility to compromise and throw away your money to keep his dream alive.
I'm not anti bike shop at all, I buy stuff all the time, but there is no way if there is something I know I want and they don't have it I'm going to be open to different products. My LBS of choice has a limited selection of almost everything, and that's their choice and their loss.
Also, if I need a tube fast I'll swing by, but $6 a pop? Please, it's like they're coming into my house, breaking my vase and kicking my dog. Insulting.

Sounds like you've dealt with some crummy shops, Argentius. But, while I understand your point, let's think about this a little more.

Buy the highest markup items in the store at full price.
Yes, yes, yes (if you want a discount on more expensive items later)! The goal is to win the war, not each and every skirmish. If a tube or Polar bottle costs me $3 more, that's $3.18 after tax, and no shipping. Compare that to the $800+ discount on my bike.

Buy what the LBS has, even if it's not quite what you had in mind...
Do you always know exactly what you want or need? How much research did you do? How certain are you that the product "you had in mind" is the only item that will make you happy? Walking into the shop thinking I must have a new set of Ksyriums is a great way to waste money when Eastons are on sale.

...and be prepared to wait for the privilege?
You've never bought a car, have you? The will to walk away from a deal is key to getting a good price.

Argentius, have you even tried following Rule 1? Or do you see visiting the LBS as an occasionally necessary evil and ride them about the price every time you buy something? If so, they probably are equally happy to see you.

And please note that I wrote "rules for staying happy with your LBS," not "rules for spending 100% of your cycling dollars at the LBS." My LBS does a great job, but I still order from Nashbar once or twice a year. When I do, it's because they have an incredible deal on a product that will meet my needs. IOW, I buy stuff from the web that may not be quite what I originally had in mind, and I wait until it's heavily discounted. Imagine that!

All the LBS I've been to sell their merchandise at MSRP or just slightly (5-10%) below it. Thats a very high profit margin compared to things like electronics and clothing where everyday prices are like 50% below MSRP. However, bike shops sell things in very low volumes and also offer free services for bikes they sell, so such pricing policy is justified for them. Thats why I think popular online retailers like Nashbar are able to offer heavy discounts - large selling quantities + no need to maintain a shop.

From my experience you can bargain at LBS for items priced above $500, because while they might have the same profit margins percentage-wise, its a lot more profit for them cash-wise. It never hurts to ask. If you are looking at a $2000 bike (assuming its not already a discounted model but somewhere near MSRP) tell them that you'd be willing to purchase it for $1500 (25% off). Chances are you won't get it that cheap, but you set a good starting point for negotiations and will probably meet the owner somewhere in the middle. Also be prepared to walk away - they might change their mind as you approach the door or when you come back in the next few days. Let them think about it, its not like they are gonna lose money by selling you at a discount, they'll just make less.
I think it should be easier to bargain for an expensive component, like a set of wheels, because unlike bikes it doesn't require much follow up service from the LBS.

Now I am sorry if I offended anyone who subscribes to LBS is a charitable organization philosophy, but I just don't see it that way.

It's easy to get a discount on wheels if you upgrade when you buy the bike. Plus you can get the trade in credit from the stock ones. So even if they don't knock so much off the bike outright, maybe you can get a deal on some new shoes for the new ride.

it's getting a bit heated.

since i'm not a big fan of ebay because i don't trust the sellers, so i need to go through the lbs route. i don't want to pay msrp plus tax but it doesn't sound like lbs would discount much. let's hope there are some '05 models closeout sales because i don't want to wait til next spring for a sale on a '06 bike.

man, i was hoping that lbs would discount 15-20% off. that's wishful thinking.

As others have noted, and HammerSandwich put it well, it all depends. The thing most of us can agree on is if you build a long-term relationship with your LBS, the deals will be offered to you so you won't even need to ask. Some shops might not work this way, but most of the ones I've dealt with do. I've built such a great relationship with my LBS that I _never_ need to ask for a deal.

When I bought my road bike this year, which was my 3rd bike from him, he gave me a free saddle bag, cages, ~30% off shoes, ~40% off pedals, free computer he had laying around, free tube, and probably something else. The bike was already discounted very well from a sale so I wasn't hurt that he didn't knock anything off the bike. I came back to get a road helmet a couple of weeks later and I got a great deal on that too...about 20% off.

So like I said...it's all about the long-term. I don't get discounts on tubes or water bottles, but those aren't the items that you can save big on. Getting a $30 computer for free or a $15 saddle bag for free is easily better than saving $2 on a tube here or there. :)

- Chris

It really does depend on the shop and what kind of relationship you have w/ them. If you do some price comparisons, sometimes they'll match (although not to web prices).
Even after I moved away from my LBS ( an hour and 15 min), I still go back to them for many things because they actually know what they are doing and their prices are much more reasonable, not like the yahoo's where I'm living now, who 1) charge a fortune, 2) take forever to do anything and 3) screw it up half the time (or more)

Let them think about it, its not like they are gonna lose money by selling you at a discount, they'll just make less.

That is the first rule of economics. An LBS owner with business training would likely recognize that. If the bike is one they can replace from the manufacturer right away, the logical thing to do would be to make the sale, and reorder. That way you inventory stays the same and you make money you otherwise wouldn't have made.

When I worked at a music store, I regularly sold high ticket ($2k and up) special orders for 40% off. Why? Because it closed the sale, and all I had to do was make a phone call and place the order. The profit from making the phone call was easily worth the effort it took. Also, if I didn't give the discount, another store would and I'd lose the customer forever.

If the major bike manufacturers allowed internet sales and shipping, the LBS would have no choice but to discount things. If you think bike shop guys can be cranky now, imagine if they had to match web prices on bikes.

Shop around for the best price, then ask your local shop to match or beat the price. I have found that you can almost always find a cheaper price somewhere.

I would recommend not getting to cheap and trying to worry about a few dollars. A good shop will fit you and stand behind their product. This could mean the difference between waiting for a warranty replacement for weeks and getting out and riding immediately.

Finding a good price is important, but finding the right balance of service and price is priceless!