View Full Version : Joe Lindsey on Floyd


Fredke
05-25-2007, 07:53 AM
A nice account of the whole Landis trial from Joe Lindsey (http://boulderreport.bicycling.com/2007/05/which_way_out.html):At the Floyd Fairness Fund roadshow, a major point of Dr. Arnie Baker’s PowerPoint presentation was given over to supposed sample contamination. None of that was introduced at trial. We were told that the science behind the tests was not nearly as bulletproof as its proponents claimed. At trial, the bedrock science of the test was never seriously challenged, only whether the lab personnel accurately ran the test. We were told that USADA had willfully – possibly even criminally – obstructed Landis’ access to documents. None of that information was ever the focus of testimony at trial, although it was the sniping point of a number of objections by Landis’ lawyers. We were told that Landis’ independent observers were barred from observing some of the proceedings at the testing of Landis’ other B samples from the Tour de France. This particular allegation was so incendiary that it was the subject of its very own press conference just weeks prior to the hearing. At trial, Paul Scott, one of those experts, did not testify. The other, Simon Davis, did, but not on that count. What we did hear was Cynthia Mongongu, one of the IRMS technicians at the lab, testify that she felt so pressured by the observers that she felt compelled to slap down a piece of tape and admonish them that they were not to cross it. Finally, we were given the bomb that USADA had tried to coerce Landis to give up information on an athlete “he could only infer was Lance Armstrong” in exchange for a lighter sentence. At trial, the only time Lance Armstrong came up was during Howard Jacobs’ attempted cross-examination of Greg LeMond, who refused to answer the questions.

That’s what we expected to see, but didn’t. Both sides were limited to 23 hours of direct- and cross-examination of witnesses, but since Landis spent three experts talking almost solely about lab practices like manual versus automatic calibration and identifying peaks, it’s hard to argue he simply ran out of time to discuss these issues which seemed so important before.
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Floyd has done nothing to materially convince me of his evidence. He might win a narrow technical victory, but all he’s done then is to show that the authorities were competent enough to find something weird in five of his eight samples, but incompetent enough to be unable to prove conclusively that it was synthetic testosterone. Legally, a win’s a win, but saying that someone can’t prove you did it is a far cry from proving that you didn’t.

For that, Landis relied on a character defense – he wouldn’t cheat to win the Tour because it would be a hollow, meaningless victory. Sorry, no dice. Such a statement – even under oath – is about as authentic as the Cinco de Mayo menu at the Applebee’s in Minnetonka.
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But if Landis became collateral damage from his own public relations strategy, he also scored a direct hit on the anti-doping system, which is showing its fallibility. The all-important question – an issue of arguably greater importance than the outcome of this trial – is what we do about it.

I credit Floyd’s trial for exposing these problems; in doing so, he’s actually done the sports world a service. Should Landis win, he may try to press his luck - anything from suing USADA to trying to pressure Congress to slash its budget. And the agency – the entire anti-doping movement – needs change. It may also need some new people running that change.

The anti-doping world needs to change, but the cycling world does too. But I no longer believe that Floyd is in this for anything other than his own narrow purposes, whatever high-minded rhetoric he has about making the system fair to athletes; as such, I want Floyd nowhere near any reform efforts.

mohair_chair
05-25-2007, 09:21 AM
I'm not sure this guy gets it. This criteria for winning the case is very specific, and that is what Landis' team went after. Their case wasn't flashy and sensational (unless you understand the science and how labs are supposed to work). All the character stuff made for good press (in a bad way), but it was irrelevant to the case.

As far as Landis not bringing up things discussed before the trial, they didn't know what USADA was going to present during testimony, and with limited time (they used it all), they had to be able to react to the USADA and present the important parts of their case. If this were an open-ended hearing with no time limits, I'm sure we would have heard a lot more about contamination and USADA plea bargains. It wasn't. There is inevitably going to be another hearing, so maybe it will all come out then.

Fredke
05-25-2007, 10:14 AM
I'm not sure this guy gets it. This criteria for winning the case is very specific, and that is what Landis' team went after. Their case wasn't flashy and sensational (unless you understand the science and how labs are supposed to work). All the character stuff made for good press (in a bad way), but it was irrelevant to the case. Suh spent his time arguing that the tests were done poorly. If he could have shown that the science was bad, then the tests would be useless regardless whether or not they were done properly, so attacking the scientific basis would be a far stronger argument.

Similarly, if Landis could argue that the samples were contaminated then even the science of the tests would be irrelevant, so this would be the strongest argument of all. By focusing on whether the tests were performed carefully, Suh implicitly stipulates USADA's contention that the urine was Floyd's and that the scientific foundation of the tests is solid.

Lindsey agrees with you completely that the character stuff is irrelevant, which is why it's interesting that Suh used a fair bit of time putting Floyd on the stand to talk about his character and wanted to use further time to cross-examine Lemond about his character instead of using those hours to challenge the integrity of the urine samples and the scientific basis of the MSIR tests.

mmoose
05-25-2007, 10:44 AM
Such a statement – even under oath – is about as authentic as the Cinco de Mayo menu at the Applebee’s in Minnetonka.

hey, just cause we are on the other border, doesn't mean that we all have bland Scandanavian tastes....oh wait, we do.

Fredke
05-25-2007, 10:58 AM
hey, just cause we are on the other border, doesn't mean that we all have bland Scandanavian tastes.You do if you go to Applebees for Mexican!

Bocephus Jones II
05-25-2007, 11:09 AM
You do if you go to Applebees for Mexican!

LOL...sounds like my father in law. Put more than a pinch of pepper in anything and he freaks. Forget anything more exotic than salt and pepper though. No garlic. I think he seasons everything with salt and butter and that's about it.

blackhat
05-25-2007, 11:34 AM
hey, just cause we are on the other border, doesn't mean that we all have bland Scandanavian tastes....oh wait, we do.


Ive eaten at that applebees, its in a mall IIRC. there's nothing authentic there.

lindseys on a tear, he's got 2 other blog entries following that one.

rocco
05-25-2007, 01:52 PM
LOL...sounds like my father in law. Put more than a pinch of pepper in anything and he freaks. Forget anything more exotic than salt and pepper though. No garlic. I think he seasons everything with salt and butter and that's about it.


It seems like he's probably either from one of those north central states like Iowa, North Dakota, Wisconsin or Minnesota.