Vino is one of the strongest riders in the peleton, and one of the most exciting riders to watch. In the past, his attack-at-any-cost method would sometimes cost him the next day. But he always seemed to attack anyway, no matter the risk.

Yesterday he fell back on Mont Ventoux. So what happened?

1. The strong TT performance on the previous day put him in deficit on Ventoux.

2. The "new" Vino saved his matches for for another day.

He drained some blood as part of his Tour prep.

He drained some blood as part of his Tour prep.

+2 rep points :thumbsup:

I resent the implication that Vino is doping or doing anything illegal.
Vino has never tested positive. His victories are part of a determined and focused training plan.

The idea that Vino could be doping is absurd.

:p

yeah, other than being a former Telekom rider, Ullrich's training partner, and a member of Saiz's Liberty Seguros team, he's clean as a whistle.

Don't forget he started on the Casino team - cleaner than clean they were...

Or the missed doping at control at last year's Vuelta

Ok then! We are a jaded lot, aren't we?!

It looks as if I should have posted in this the Doping Forum.:D

JSR

Ok then! We are a jaded lot, aren't we?!

It looks as if I should have posted in this the Doping Forum.:D

JSR

Euro procycling, doping, what's the difference. I still have some slight hopes that there are good domestic pros that are clean, but maybe I'm just stupid.

yeah, other than being a former Telekom rider, Ullrich's training partner, and a member of Saiz's Liberty Seguros team, he's clean as a whistle.

He's failed the same number of tests as Lance.

Zero.

All you haters can shove it. Vino is doing this on pure heart and determination. Plus his lungs, xyphoid process are bigger than those of most humans.

And he takes 3 shots of Jack Daniels a night.

Vino rules.

no hating from me-even if he is jacked up, at least he uses it to ride aggressively, in a Chiappucci or Pantini death or glory kind of way. By the way, does he happen to have a dog (the kiss of death for Puerto)?

Don't forget he started on the Casino team - cleaner than clean they were...

don't forget he started riding as an amateur for an eastern bloc country in the 80's

and cleaner than clean were they

He's failed the same number of tests as Lance.

And the same number of tests as Museeuw, Pantani, Millar, Basso, Ullrich...

Euro procycling, doping, what's the difference. I still have some slight hopes that there are good domestic pros that are clean, but maybe I'm just stupid.

I'm willing to bet that a lot more domestic pros might be doping than euro pros. There aren't too many doping controls in the US at most big NRC races, and not many are pulled for out of competition testing. Don't be fooled. Doping is rampant in the US peloton no doubt about it.

don't forget he started riding as an amateur for an eastern bloc country in the 80's

and cleaner than clean were they

Don't forget he is an olympic medalist - and cleaner than clean were they
Don't forget he is a cyclist - and cleaner than clean were they
Don't forget he is a professional athlete - and cleaner than clean were they
Don't forget he is from planet Earth - and cleaner than clean were they
Don't forget he is a hydrocarbon-based life form - and cleaner than clean were they

I'm willing to bet that a lot more domestic pros might be doping than euro pros. There aren't too many doping controls in the US at most big NRC races, and not many are pulled for out of competition testing. Don't be fooled. Doping is rampant in the US peloton no doubt about it.

i dont disagree, i just wonder how they can afford it. most us pro's are pretty broke/have a small job as well.....doping is very costly. im not saying the us peleton is clean, in fact, i think its alot dirty-er than most, but i just wonder how its all paid for.

it's do-it-yourself, getting stuff from the Internet (China), Mexico etc. Scary.

His scrotal testosterone patch became dislodged during the ascent?

:p

it's do-it-yourself, getting stuff from the Internet (China), Mexico etc. Scary.

This isn't like Puerto doping, it's more like do it yourself (as you said above), and experiment with things until you see some sort of improvement. If you live near Mexico, or make trips to Southern California a lot, it's easy to roll into el Pharmacia, and ask for EPO, and it ain't that pricey. Then there are a multitude of websites out there that describe, in various levels of detail, what to do with it once you've got it.

So it's not that hard to figure out to do, and if you can get yourself to Mexico, it's not that hard to acquire.

I like Vino, but is he a new man? Hmm... hard to say, considering how most of the competitors he couldn't handle before are gone. But then again, he cracked Valverde last year.

I like Vino, but is he a new man? Hmm... hard to say, considering how most of the competitors he couldn't handle before are gone. But then again, he cracked Valverde last year.

Vino is getting old. It's going to be probably now or never to win le Tour for him. We'll see what shakes loose. I don't think he's going to do it myself, but that's just me.

I also enjoy the fact that Astana really are only Liberty with a new name and minus Saiz - all the back up personnel, the soigneurs and docs are the same old same old - and surely we don't believe Saiz had all those doping products for his mother in law/dog/they were planted on me honest guv - do we?

Is Saiz really gone?

Today when Inglinsky was away going for the win somebody was shouting "Venga, Venga, Venga..." at the top of his lungs and it sounded like it was coming from the team car :)

I also enjoy the fact that Astana really are only Liberty with a new name and minus Saiz - all the back up personnel, the soigneurs and docs are the same old same old - and surely we don't believe Saiz had all those doping products for his mother in law/dog/they were planted on me honest guv - do we?

Except no OP riders this season. Details, details.
Who knows maybe the new docs will reveal something, but right now, Astana deserves the same kid glove treatment fans gave to US Postal. Nobody's tested positive for anything.

I guess if a TV camera bike is forced off the road by that team car we'll know for sure Manolo has returned.

Sans serious testing EPO can be done on $3K per year, and that's at US pricing, so it's not a bad bang for the buck.

1. Vino is still the nutty attacker.
2. Those who said he is a doper, and therefore irrelevant, were absolutely right.

Bumped for irony

Bumped for irony

+2 pts

Bumped for irony
sad but true :mad: