http://www.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/diet.fitness/02/03/lowcarb.pizza.ap/index.html

This ain't pizza folks...this is crap. Proof that the Atkins fad is evil.

Amen to that, Bocephus! That diet is such a load of bullcrap! :mad:

I can't stand seeing all the junk on TV and all the celebrities who use Atkin's saying how great that diet is. I wish I could afford to do an infomercial to show how dumb the Atkin's actually is and instead show how important exercise is to the equation. Only problem is that the Atkin's diet does work and that's why it's so popular. The problem with it is that it screws with your TCA Cycle. In my opinion, anything that messes with your metabolism is not worth it when the same results can be seen by dedicating yourself to an exercise program while practicing healthy eating patterns.

And why pizza is getting a bad rap is just beyond me. Pizza is great! It has carbohydrates, calcium, protein, and fat (not the best fat always, but still) among other things. BUT, everyone eats WAY to much of it and then blames the weight gain on the carbs, not on their lack of motivation to do something about their lifestyle.

Atkins is evil that works, but just how it works is also evil. There is nothing good about Atkins except that it can get you over that hump to weight loss. Maybe using it as a starting point would be great just to get the motivation to loose more weight...and I mean starting point as in 1-2 weeks TOPS...not for months and months like people usually do.

That article is proof that our overweight nationis still looking for the "quick fix" when it's been staring them in the face for centuries. Physical activity is the key, but I don't know what it's going to take to get people/media/celebrities to see that and to change their minds.

Just my two cents
;)



http://www.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/diet.fitness/02/03/lowcarb.pizza.ap/index.html

This ain't pizza folks...this is crap. Proof that the Atkins fad is evil.

Hmm... Pizza. It's what to eat in the offseason.

This is just as stupid as low carb (or low fat) candy, ice cream, milk shakes, etc..

It's junk food. Either don't eat it, or indulge (once in a while) and enjoy the real thing.

Ben

Glad to see that at least the cyclist population doesn't seem to be falling for this Atkin's craze. Like Ben said, it's junk food and you have the choice to eat it, but that's the beauty of being a cyclist. We probably all train enough to "enjoy" ourselves every once in a while ;0)

It just sucks to see inactive people "enjoying" themselves too while not participating in any regular activity (or the appropriate activity). They're the ones who fall for this "magic pill" (i.e. Atkins) to weight loss. How the hell are they going to be able to exercise (assuming they actually do eventually start) when their carbohydrate stores are so low and their bodies have turned to only using fat and ketone bodies for energy production. I can tell you right now, they won't be the fast ones in the peloton and certainly won't be winning any sprints.

Actually, me and GF just started Atkins this week. We're both active (running and biking clubs) and not even overweight really (uh, 5' 8" and 176 and 5' 5" and 125?). Probably combined, we'd like to lose maybe 25 pounds total.

Anyway, just read the whole book and there really isnt anything in there about the active types. He says there will be lots of energy on Atkins. I was passing out asleep the other night for lack of carbs. Supposedly that passes after a few days.

I guess no one here knows if Atkins works for the avid rider, but if you have any personal experience on energy loss/gain with low carb diets, I'd like to hear about it.

That passing out that you were doing because of a lack of carbohydrate is because your body needs carbs for nearly every bodily function. The brain alone relies almost 100% on carbohydrates (up to 150 grams/day) for energy. The liver needs carbohydrate stores for success in endurance exercise. When your stored liver glycogen (and muscle glycogen) is gone, your body has no other place to turn to for energy besides muscular triglyceride (fat) stores, and perhaps eventually protein.

That's the reason why nothing is in the Atkins book about active people...it's not good for you guys. I mean, if you can stand not having carbs for the first week or so, then your body will adapt and you'll loose the weight, but I would bet the farm that you won't perform as well as you like in a race, etc.

Carbohydrate is your bodies quickest source of energy for activity (besides ATP/PC), and then comes fat and protein. Carbohydrate is extremely available and breaks down quickly through glycolysis. If you pretty much rid your body of carbohydrate, you're going to feel tired and will be passing out because your body is now lacking it's most important quick energy source. Once you deplete that, it has nothing else to rely on other than fat and protein. So it turns to fat. Your body goes into a ketotic (using ketone bodies for energy) state and this puts a lot of stress on your liver and kidneys (especially the kidneys). It backs up your TCA Cycle (another cycle used for producing energy), and anything that messes with your metabolism like that can't be good.

Just out of curiosity, how did you guys come up with the 25 pound weight loss? How much are you trying to loose individually?

As for having lots of energy on Atkins, I'm not sure about that. But like anything, your bodies will adapt. That's the beauty of the human body - its ability to adapt to different situations. The problem is that you shouldn't have to make your body adapt to using only fat as an energy source, especially if you're a cyclist. You absolutely need carbs in your diet to act as a quick energy source, and if you eat the right type of carbs and eat everything else in the right amount, then you can easily loose weight without having to artificially change your metabolism.

There is a simple way to lose weight....burn more calories than you eat. At 5'3" about 10 years ago, I was 200 pounds. In college, I started walking and cutting back on junk food like candy, cakes, and fried foods. I lost about 40 pounds. Soon after that college graduation in 96, I got into cycling and was quickly bitten by the racing bug. Within a year and a half, I'd dropped another 30 pounds and was down to about 130. (final weight of 125 but impossible to hold that weight). After a few months of going up and down, my body settled down to 135 for a few years. Last year, I let my "diet" lapse and started eating too much junk again. I gained about 8 pounds, which I've lost again since Sept. Once again, just no junk food. Plenty of food, not all of it good...just no candy, cake, cookies, ice cream, or sweets. I do allow myself one "free" weekend a month to eat whatever crap I want, so that I don't feel deprived. Special occasions like Christmas and Valentine's Day are also "free" days. I also have chosen to eat a lower fat diet that is high in carbs. As a former vegetarian, I don't eat much meat to begin with. I also have a family history of heart disease and heart attacks, so I really watch my trans fat and hydrogenated fat intake. The latter is easy to do; buy organic snack foods instead of traditional snack foods like Lays or Doritos.

It's really all about the math--burn more calories than you eat.

You hit the nail on the head. It's all about the caloric equation -

calories in = calories out --> you maintain your weight
calories in > calories out --> you gain weight
calories in < calories out --> you loose weight

simple as that. Atkins sucks, exercise is good, and that's it. :)

I wish everyone thought like you did, Sadlebred! We would have a fit, healthy nation and all those friggin' infomercial companies would be out of business!


There is a simple way to lose weight....burn more calories than you eat. At 5'3" about 10 years ago, I was 200 pounds. In college, I started walking and cutting back on junk food like candy, cakes, and fried foods. I lost about 40 pounds. Soon after that college graduation in 96, I got into cycling and was quickly bitten by the racing bug. Within a year and a half, I'd dropped another 30 pounds and was down to about 130. (final weight of 125 but impossible to hold that weight). After a few months of going up and down, my body settled down to 135 for a few years. Last year, I let my "diet" lapse and started eating too much junk again. I gained about 8 pounds, which I've lost again since Sept. Once again, just no junk food. Plenty of food, not all of it good...just no candy, cake, cookies, ice cream, or sweets. I do allow myself one "free" weekend a month to eat whatever crap I want, so that I don't feel deprived. Special occasions like Christmas and Valentine's Day are also "free" days. I also have chosen to eat a lower fat diet that is high in carbs. As a former vegetarian, I don't eat much meat to begin with. I also have a family history of heart disease and heart attacks, so I really watch my trans fat and hydrogenated fat intake. The latter is easy to do; buy organic snack foods instead of traditional snack foods like Lays or Doritos.

It's really all about the math--burn more calories than you eat.

Aktins is the latest panacea for the gullible.

More exercise and better food choices is the key, as stated here. But, personal resposibility never sells well.

Last winter after a month off due to a pulled muscle in my back (shoveling fricken snow- Oy, I must be getting old. . .) and excessive food related good times my weight went up to 198. Ouch. After alot of road miles and suffering to get back in shape (and homemade fruit smoothies with Endurox rather then big dinners twice a week after rides) my weight was down to 189. With continued training and reasonable food choices (I still eat pizza, burritos and drink beer though- just not every night), my weight is at 184-185 and my body fat is pretty good for a 36 year old. I signed up with CTS and am training hard this off-season too. My new goal is around 182 with a lower body fat percentage- that will help alot on the climbs. This year I plan on handing out some suffering on the group rides (and then getting it back at the races- circle of life and all. . . ).

:D

...and not even overweight really...

I guess no one here knows if Atkins works for the avid rider, but if you have any personal experience on energy loss/gain with low carb diets, I'd like to hear about it.

Do a bit more research or ask your doctor. Actually, just go for a ride!

You summed it up pretty much like the Atkins book, good analysis.

I have to confess, Im more doing it because shes doing it, and since we eat a lot of meals together, its easier to do the diet together. Id like to lose about 10 pounds and she, perhaps, 15 or so. You're right about the books target audience, too. Its totally written for the obese, the compulsive eaters, and the desperate. But I know one guy who did Atkins while he was adventure racing. He said he lost lots of weight and carbed up before training or a race and was okay.

You might already know, there is a two week "induction" phase in which only 20 grams of carbs are permitted per day. Then its increased gradually until weight is maintainable. For now, Im forced into vegetables I wouldnt normally look at, which is a trait I hope to keep. But I suspect that I'll go back to a more convensional diet as time goes on. Lets just call this an experiment. BTW, we had bacon wrapped portobello mushrooms and cheese omlets for dinner last night and were craving fruit or something after. Felt kinda gross, too.

Im riding today, all weekend. Will post back with thoughts/impressions regarding diet and energy if anyone's interested.

Great story! Good luck with that! How's CTS going for ya?

Glad to see that at least the cyclist population doesn't seem to be falling for this Atkin's craze. Like Ben said, it's junk food and you have the choice to eat it, but that's the beauty of being a cyclist. We probably all train enough to "enjoy" ourselves every once in a while ;0)

It just sucks to see inactive people "enjoying" themselves too while not participating in any regular activity (or the appropriate activity). They're the ones who fall for this "magic pill" (i.e. Atkins) to weight loss. How the hell are they going to be able to exercise (assuming they actually do eventually start) when their carbohydrate stores are so low and their bodies have turned to only using fat and ketone bodies for energy production. I can tell you right now, they won't be the fast ones in the peloton and certainly won't be winning any sprints.

My mom is constantly harping on me for "eating too many carbs." I finally just told her "enough." I don't care what the newest fad diet is, I've been happy with eating less and exercising more since the late 80s.

I'm not as diligent as I could be. I like junk food: hamburgers, french fries, etc. I have ice cream Fri and Sat nights and that's it. The rest of the time, I usually don't eat Twinkies and Ho-Hos, etc.

Could I eat better? Yup. More veggies, fewer french fries would be a start.
Do I really WANT to? Well, maybe.

Moderation in all things is good...

Mike

You hit the nail on the head. It's all about the caloric equation -

calories in = calories out --> you maintain your weight
calories in > calories out --> you gain weight
calories in < calories out --> you loose weight

simple as that. Atkins sucks, exercise is good, and that's it. :)

I wish everyone thought like you did, Sadlebred! We would have a fit, healthy nation and all those friggin' infomercial companies would be out of business!

Way to go Saddlebred! A great inspiration to those who struggle with weight issues & you can sock it to the Subway Jared along with the infomercial crowds like Tony Little.

Every one should exercise in one form or another, lifting a fork to your mouth does not count as exercise. As much as I exercise, weight training (5''-7", 153lbs) all year & ride in spring/summer/fall (too much snow/ice/hidden potholes/dumb drivers in a Montreal, Canada winter), I try to eat healthy but still, I cheat a little otherwise I can't do it. Can't beat beer & chips during the Super Bowl, a milkshake on a hot day, pizza & beer after playing hockey, hamburgers & fries after a CX race. Priceless.

If everyone was to eat in moderation as opposed to SUPER-SIZE junk food, then America would be a healthier looking nation, & by extension, so would Canada. Everyone has seen this, people who order EVERYTHING on the menu & then, a diet drink. I really don't understand the diet drink part. Might as well get a normal soda because it's wwaaaayyyy to late!

I guess no one here knows if Atkins works for the avid rider, but if you have any personal experience on energy loss/gain with low carb diets, I'd like to hear about it.

Both my GF and I have been on Atkins for 18 months. I have lost about 45 lbs and am now at 175 lbs at 5'11". Initially I did feel I had much energy, but now I can ride for significantly longer times at a much higher heart rate than when I was doing the low-fat (hogh carb) thing. I was worried about bonking on long rides due to running out of carb stores, but that never happened. I believe that I am burning more fats at higher energy outputs than previously.

I know that I am not the only cyclist who has reduced carbs and improved performance. I was reading the book "The Paleo Diet" by Loren Cordain, and it contains quotes from Joe Friel (author of numerous training books for cyclist and triathletes) on his results on the lower carb Paleo Diet. He too had loss of energy for the first two weeks. During the third week, he felt much better and in the forth week he trained for a longer time than he had in ten years. Without going off this diet, Joe finished third at the U.S. national championship and qualified for the U.S. team for the World Championships. He says that he had a stellar season, one of his best in years. He continues on the diet to this day.

Once your body adjusts from a carb burning machine to a fat burning machine, I am sure that you will be pleased with your cycling performance.

Initially I did feel I had much energy, but now I can ride for significantly longer times at a much higher heart rate than when I was doing the low-fat (hogh carb) thing. I was worried about bonking on long rides due to running out of carb stores, but that never happened. I believe that I am burning more fats at higher energy outputs than previously.

During the third week, he felt much better and in the forth week he trained for a longer time than he had in ten years. Without going off this diet, Joe finished third at the U.S. national championship and qualified for the U.S. team for the World Championships. He says that he had a stellar season, one of his best in years.


That raises another question as well. With these low-carb diets, you have to wonder how controlled the "study" was for that person or group of people to all of a sudden feel better after two weeks. We all know what we're supposed to feel after being on those diets for a few weeks, but how much of it is due to a placebo effect and/or a training effect (whether we're training better or harder) seems to be unknown.

The one place that I find to be a sticky spot is the burning fat at higher intensities. Your body can only efficiently burn fat up to a certian point, and beyond that point it absolutely has to burn carbohydrate (with some fat still being used, but not nearly as much as at lower intensities) to be able to fuel the muscles as quickly as they need the energy. When you're cycling along at a leisurely or endurance-type pace, you're primarily burning fat, and maybe with those low-carb diets you can see your body become better at burning the fat (maybe more efficient?). But as you increase the intensity (i.e. the respiratory quotient gets closer to 1.00 and especially above), then your body has no choice but to switch to using mainly carbohydrate for fuel for the simple reason that it's able to be metabolized much much faster than fat or protein. You need to take in a lot more oxygen to burn the fat than you do to burn carbohydrate, and the last thing you want to do when exercising at higher and higher intensities is have to take in more oxygen than you need. The less you have to work at those intensities, the better. So if your body was actually working to burn primarily fat, then it would have to work overtime, and that's why it makes that switch to carbohydrate energy sources and eventually anaerobic metabolism.

Some of those diets are interesting, but I think we also have to look at them more closely to see if it is a placebo effect or if there are (and this is where i'd put my money if I were a betting man) uncontrolled variables that would contribute to the improved cycling performance.

You hit the nail on the head. It's all about the caloric equation -

calories in = calories out --> you maintain your weight
calories in > calories out --> you gain weight
calories in < calories out --> you loose weight

simple as that. Atkins sucks, exercise is good, and that's it. :)

I wish everyone thought like you did, Sadlebred! We would have a fit, healthy nation and all those friggin' infomercial companies would be out of business!

I followed the rules above "calories in< calories out --> you loose weight
I lost 25 lbs. in 2 and half months 190 to 165, and have maintain this for the past 4 months. I cut out all sodas, no junk food ,went home for lunch ,more fruit and veggies.
Ate 3 meals a day, just smaller portion and go to bed alittle hungry. Now I'm able to climb
faster, and my average speed has gone up. :cool: Only weigh 10 lbs more then I did in high school, that was 29 years ago. :)

Nice! Did you see the special on CNN about a month ago? I think it was CNN, but maybe one of the other major news stations (ABC maybe?). They did a test to see which type of diet was the best for loosing weight. There were, I think, 6 volunteers who joined and each one was assigned to a different diet. They were all well overweight and had quite a bit of weight to loose.

I think they had Atkins (obviously), Slim Fast, Jenny Craig, hypnosis, self-help tapes, and vigorous exercise. Long story short, the top two were Atkins (unfortunately, because it actually does work) and the intense exercise (the lady was training for a marathon in Hawaii I think). So those were 1 and 2, and the rest worked somewhat, but not as good as 1st and 2nd place. But guess which one got 1st place?

The intense exercise!! ;) She lost the most weight out of the group, and the best part, in my opinion at least, is that she also became the most fit out of the group as well. Even though Atkins came in a close second place, the person who was on that is probably not even close to being as fit as the lady who participated in the intense exercise.

That's 1 for exercise and a sound diet and a big ZERO for Atkins!

I think we can accept Atkins as a diet for fit people when we see someone win a medal at the Olympics and/or win a Pro championship in an endurance event and be able to show they really were on Atkins.

If it really worked *for fit people* the whole Pro Peloton would be on it, even if it was bad for their hearts, etc.. (The health risks of EPO, etc.. don't stop them, Atkins wouldn't either.)

I don't really buy the "I can ride longer on it than I could before" thing. Of course you will percieve to have more cycling endurance/power on Atkins at 175lbs then you did on no diet at 235lbs. That is such a huge weight loss your cycling will be utterly transformed. The Atkins exercise examples always have the person start at "staggeringly unfit". If Jan Ulrich went on it and crushed the hell out of Lance Armstrong this summer and won by 20 minutes then maybe it might be a little more believable.

There is still the health issue, the "fit person" examples in Atkins' book still have much higher cholesterol, etc.. than I do.

Ben

Both my GF and I have been on Atkins for 18 months. I have lost about 45 lbs and am now at 175 lbs at 5'11". Initially I did feel I had much energy, but now I can ride for significantly longer times at a much higher heart rate than when I was doing the low-fat (hogh carb) thing. I was worried about bonking on long rides due to running out of carb stores, but that never happened. I believe that I am burning more fats at higher energy outputs than previously.

Thats interesting. Im in the first week and so far have felt weak at cycling and running. My legs felt like lactic acid burn as soon as I started pedaling. I pushed through it but felt weak and light headed the rest of the day. The diet is a diuretic (sp?), as in, I have to pee a lot more, so I may also have been dehydrated. Running today felt awful too, and I quit early. The GF did a half marathon today and totally bonked. I wasnt there, but she told me that she felt so bad she totally broke down and ate bananas and oranges. I dont blame her. So far, the diet is sort of difficult to do, as I want some carbs when Im hungry.

We are sticking with the diet and will see what happens in the later weeks. Thanks for the post!

That weakness and bonking is because of a lack of carbohydrates to your muscles, liver, brain, red blood cells, etc. The light headedness is because of that lack of carbs. Your body is begging for quick energy. Your liver glycogen (stored form of carbohydrate) and muscle glycogen is nearly completely depleted, so any energy that you would be able to produce with stored glycogen is just not there because the glycogen is not available. I'm sure in another week or so that will go away, but do you really want to mess with your metabolism like that and MAKE your body only burn fat? And eventually only use fat and ketone bodies as energy? Once your body adapts, you'll feel fine, but it's not the appropriate way to go about loosing weight.

Your red blood cells only function via anaerobic metabolism, meaning they only use carbohydrate. In the absence of carbs, they have no other choice but to use ketones (they certainly can't use fat or protein). The high amounts of ketone bodies your body will begin to produce through this diet can really overwork your kidneys, leading to problems there. Also, you mentioned that the diet is a diruetic...it is in a sense. The only way to get enough calories to stay full throughout the day is to take in not only fat, but protein as well. This can also lead to kidney problems because there will be so much nitrogen and excess protein that will have to be excreted via the urine (hence your constant peeing). The glomerulus (the apparatus responsible for filtering material before entering the kidneys) will work too hard, can become damaged, and allow things like protein and blood to get into your urine, which of course isn't good either.

There are just too many things that Atkins does wrong with this diet. It's just not natural in the way that it "backs up" your aerobic metabolism pathway (TCA Cycle)...modifying your caloric intake while keeping the right amount of each nutrient in your diet is the way to go. Pairing that with regular, appropriate exercise will give you success in weight loss, while still allowing you to ride and run while feeling just as good.

I think we can accept Atkins as a diet for fit people when we see someone win a medal at the Olympics and/or win a Pro championship in an endurance event and be able to show they really were on Atkins.

If it really worked *for fit people* the whole Pro Peloton would be on it, even if it was bad for their hearts, etc.. (The health risks of EPO, etc.. don't stop them, Atkins wouldn't either.)

I don't really buy the "I can ride longer on it than I could before" thing. Of course you will percieve to have more cycling endurance/power on Atkins at 175lbs then you did on no diet at 235lbs. That is such a huge weight loss your cycling will be utterly transformed. The Atkins exercise examples always have the person start at "staggeringly unfit". If Jan Ulrich went on it and crushed the hell out of Lance Armstrong this summer and won by 20 minutes then maybe it might be a little more believable.

There is still the health issue, the "fit person" examples in Atkins' book still have much higher cholesterol, etc.. than I do.

Ben

I was at 185 lbs before my doctor put me on a low-fat diet( for high cholesterol.). It was on this diet that I gained all the weight. I was cycling about 3300 miles per year during this time and lifting weights twice a week, so i don't think that I was "staggeringly unfit". My energy now seems to be greater than when I was at 185 also. The weight should only be a problem when climbing and at my max weight I did little climbing.

My doctor (as a result of the negative effects of the low-fat diet on most of his patients) became a believer of low-carb lifestyles for health reasons. Six months after he switched me to the low-carb diet, my blood cholesterol went from poor to great. My triglecerides dropped by a factor of 4 to less than 70 and my HDL doubled to 75. My ****cysteine level dropped and my CRP went way down. According to my doctor, my blood chemistry results put me in the lowest group for heallth problems. The studies done comparing the low-carb diet to low-fat diets in the last few years have also shown that the low-carbers had significantly improved blood chemistry. Every attempt by the health establishment to prove that low-carb is unhealthy have been unsuccessful, although this has not stopped it from continuing to claim that low-carb is unhealthy.

Great thread!!!!

I understand the passion regarding the Atkins diet, and I am perfectly aware of the weight-loss equasion. But I really really need some good, sound advice here!

I'm 6', sitting at 200 lbs for the last 2 years, rode around 3000 miles last year, have been riding nearly daily for about an hour, with perhaps once a month doing longer rides (50 - 100 miles). This winter I have been stuck on the trainer, and ride for about an hour, dripping sweat, and feeling in the legs like a pretty fast ride. Since Jan 1 I've stopped eating pie (2 - 3 pieces a day in the staff cafeteria!), stopped eating after 6 (well, mostly), cut down on the junk, which I didn't eat that much of anyway, drink 6 - 10 glasses of water a day (been doing that for years), and I STILL CAN'T LOSE THE GUT!!!

I've got this nice deposit of fat sitting right on the belly, perhaps 10 - 15 lbs worth. Underneath is this great six pack 8^), but I can't get the fat to burn off. HELP!!!!

Great thread!!!!

I understand the passion regarding the Atkins diet, and I am perfectly aware of the weight-loss equasion. But I really really need some good, sound advice here!

I'm 6', sitting at 200 lbs for the last 2 years, rode around 3000 miles last year, have been riding nearly daily for about an hour, with perhaps once a month doing longer rides (50 - 100 miles). This winter I have been stuck on the trainer, and ride for about an hour, dripping sweat, and feeling in the legs like a pretty fast ride. Since Jan 1 I've stopped eating pie (2 - 3 pieces a day in the staff cafeteria!), stopped eating after 6 (well, mostly), cut down on the junk, which I didn't eat that much of anyway, drink 6 - 10 glasses of water a day (been doing that for years), and I STILL CAN'T LOSE THE GUT!!!

I've got this nice deposit of fat sitting right on the belly, perhaps 10 - 15 lbs worth. Underneath is this great six pack 8^), but I can't get the fat to burn off. HELP!!!!
Stick with it. You might try weight training if you aren't doing that already. That will turbocharge your weight loss. Sometimes it takes the body a while to drop pounds. And if you are like typical guys the gut is the first to put weight on and the last to get weight off. You gotta be below 10% body fat for most guys to see the 6-pack. I've done that, but it takes real discipline and I don't see how most mortals could maintain that year round. I tend to vary between 10-15% bf depending on the time of year and what I'm eating a drinking. For me the key was cutting way down on beer drinking and snacking and eatinng smaller portions more often during the day.

Easy things to do without going on a real "diet".

1. Make your own lunch and eat it in your office, that will force you to skip the cafeteria pie. (Also it will save you some time to ride) I don't know about your cafeteria, but the one where I work manages to put at least 2x as many calories in a sandwhich as I do if I make it at home. Everything has been super sized. Huge pieces of bread, larger serving of meat, cheese, etc.. Hell a "small" sandwich at a place like subway is still 2x as large as a sandwich you make yourself at home. No way you need that kind of lunch if you're working a desk job.

2. Beer & alcohol are easy things to cut out.

3. Skip butter on things like pancakes, sandwiches, etc.. you can put sharp cheese or veggies in a sandwhich to make up the taste. Mayo is also really nasty stuff if you're on a diet.

4. Ice cream, pie, desert, etc.. easy way to cut massive calories out. Skip soda and junk food as office snacks, etc.. If you shop for yourself you can cut this stuff out at the grocery store. It's a hell of a lot easier to avoid it when you have to make a special trip out to get it. (Kind of tough if someone else is buying your food) These super size sodas, etc.. that they are pushing now (16-20oz in the machines, etc..) have almost as many calories as a powerbar!

5. Avoid having seconds at dinner, etc..

6. Eat at home as much as possible and don't go out. Everyone jokes about "super size" at McDonalds, but as far as I can tell 95% of restaurants are serving supersize portions at this point. Meat portions pushing 1lb, huge potatoes with tons of butter in them, etc.. Enough french fries for 3 people, etc..

I lost about 12lbs since new years. I was already skipping most of the junk food and alcohol, for me it was skipping seconds and just reducing my portions a little that did it. I didn't have a whole lot to lose though. I'm 6'1, I'm going to end up racing around 170 this year which will make me very happy I think. I also stopped having a powerbar, etc.. before my workout. As the season progresses I'm guessing I'll have to start eating those again though. I've been weight lifting like crazy too.

Ben

Great thread!!!!

I understand the passion regarding the Atkins diet, and I am perfectly aware of the weight-loss equasion. But I really really need some good, sound advice here!

I'm 6', sitting at 200 lbs for the last 2 years, rode around 3000 miles last year, have been riding nearly daily for about an hour, with perhaps once a month doing longer rides (50 - 100 miles). This winter I have been stuck on the trainer, and ride for about an hour, dripping sweat, and feeling in the legs like a pretty fast ride. Since Jan 1 I've stopped eating pie (2 - 3 pieces a day in the staff cafeteria!), stopped eating after 6 (well, mostly), cut down on the junk, which I didn't eat that much of anyway, drink 6 - 10 glasses of water a day (been doing that for years), and I STILL CAN'T LOSE THE GUT!!!

I've got this nice deposit of fat sitting right on the belly, perhaps 10 - 15 lbs worth. Underneath is this great six pack 8^), but I can't get the fat to burn off. HELP!!!!

Bocephus hit the nail on the head with his comments. Real weight loss takes time. Not the crap that Atkins promises...that'll make you loose weight, but it's not natural.

Maybe your training needs to be taken to the next level. If you've been doing the same type of riding (about 1 hour daily and 1 longer ride per month) for the past 2 years, you had to have already reached your plateau and the only way to see further gains (which would include weight loss) is to switch things up. Your body responded to the stress you've been applying to it and it responded to a point where riding for an hour or so each day won't have any more benefit than to maintain what you already have. Have you ever talked with a coach or signed up with a coaching company? That might be something to look into. Not only can your cycling take a step up, but you can combine that with a sound nutritional plan to see better results.

Stopping with the pie (2-3 pieces per day is a lot) and reducing junk food are perfect ways to get yourself on the road to weight loss. Adding in strength training, like Bocephus said, is another excellent weight loss tool. Muscle burns fat, so the more muscle you have, the more metabolically active you can make that muscle. Substitude a lot of refined sugars for complex carbohydrates and switch up saturdated fats for mono and polyunsaturdated fats too. In my opinion, the training will play a major major role in your weight loss.

Keep it up! ;0)

Thanks all for the suggestions and encouragement! I've put more time on the trainer this winter than ever before, started rowing (on an old hydraulic rowing machine) 2-3 x/week, and cut out most of the junk. I don't drink pop or alcohol (neither agree with my digestive tract 8^P), and have seriously reduced the sugar intake (pie, cookies, candy bars, etc.). I guess time is the biggest factor left,eh? 'Course I'd like to see the fat just melt off in a couple of weeks, and it's been six weeks with virtually no change in weight...

I'll check into a training program - I'm planning on a major trip this August (800 miles in 6 days), so I'd probably do better with professional advice...

I'm just bummed because of the zero weight loss...

Man, I'd LOVE to hit 170! I'd be happy to float between 170 ~ 175! That'd put me back to wedding weight...

Wife/Delicate Flower asked me to post this:
"Very very interesting

Please post this for me.

I have been on atkins since last september. I lost 30 pounds before
christmas.
Yes only 20 carbs for the first two weeks, then you increase carbs, complex
carbs to any amount that still
keeps you losing. If you find yourself eating too many carbs and weight
comes back on you drop down till you
begin losing again. and Yes exercise is very important. Atkins is firm
about that. I do pilates 3 times a week, tai chi everyday, and go to curves
gym 3 times a week. My husband, the rider, wants me to ride with him and
for that I need more carbs so I eat more carbs when I ride. But to say
Atkins is terrible is wrong. There is something out there for everyone, and
for those of us who are way overweight,(I still have 50 pounds to lose),
atkins is good because it is a good motivator and it starts people out
eating healthfully. But you people should really be sure of what atkins is
about before spouting off. Atkins does believe one should increase complex
carbs as you lose weight and become more active. Atkins really just wants
one to cut out the junk food and sugar. Healthy carbs are terrific and
should be incorporated into ones diet. I am feeling great, have lots of
energy and when my activity increases so do my carbs.
thanks for sharing and listening."

Wife/Delicate Flower asked me to post this:
"Very very interesting

Please post this for me.

I have been on atkins since last september. I lost 30 pounds before
christmas.
Yes only 20 carbs for the first two weeks, then you increase carbs, complex
carbs to any amount that still
keeps you losing. If you find yourself eating too many carbs and weight
comes back on you drop down till you
begin losing again. and Yes exercise is very important. Atkins is firm
about that. I do pilates 3 times a week, tai chi everyday, and go to curves
gym 3 times a week. My husband, the rider, wants me to ride with him and
for that I need more carbs so I eat more carbs when I ride. But to say
Atkins is terrible is wrong. There is something out there for everyone, and
for those of us who are way overweight,(I still have 50 pounds to lose),
atkins is good because it is a good motivator and it starts people out
eating healthfully. But you people should really be sure of what atkins is
about before spouting off. Atkins does believe one should increase complex
carbs as you lose weight and become more active. Atkins really just wants
one to cut out the junk food and sugar. Healthy carbs are terrific and
should be incorporated into ones diet. I am feeling great, have lots of
energy and when my activity increases so do my carbs.
thanks for sharing and listening."
For significant weight loss, Atkins isn't that bad. I'm not opposed to it being used to get people over that hump just to get the weight loss going. It absolutely works, but the manner in which it works is what I have a problem with. The first two weeks when you quit almost cold turkey with carbs is when your body makes that switch to primarily fat metabolism. That's where your Citric Acid Cycle gets all messed up and your body begins producing large amounts of ketone bodies.

Just out of curiosity, what's your typical diet like now that you've been on it for a while? Are you planning on continuing on the diet after you reach your weight loss goal?

Another thing to consider is the level of cyclist. In your case, it seems like you're a recreational cyclist and the need for carbohydrate may not be as great as compared to a racer who routinely rides/races at extremely high intensities. If you're riding recreationally, you're probably going to be burning primarily fat anyway and will only need carbohydrates for the first few minutes of exercise.

Atkins has its place. For people who have significant weight to loose, it's a good starting place for exactly the reasons you mentioned. For other people who need to drop a couple of pounds, I think there are better ways to do it than to mess with your body's metabolic pathways. There's a reason that they perform the way they do - they've been doing it for long enough, so they should have found the most efficient way to metabolize fuels. Messing with something that has worked for so long just doesn't seem right when it happens for such a long period of time.

Thanks for the comments. This is a great discussion

wifey responds:
"I was up til this morning eating 65 to 70 carbs per day, but that has made me stall in losing weight so I am kick starting my body again with 3 days of < 20 carbs per day.I hope this works, it's been 6 weeks since I've lost any weight. The increase in exercise may be part of it. Building muscle. Not sure, but I am trying. Mostly I think people who are greatly overweight and who have yo-yo dieted most of their life and who have already screwed up their metabolism really like the fast results from atkins. Anyway great thread, have a great day.

We Americans can't do ANYTHING in moderation, or so it seems. We went from carbo-loading to Atkins in a surprisingly short period of time. Even Burger King has Atkins-friendly stuff, now. We either go to one extreme or the other. The best eating plan-a well-balanced meal-carbs(veggies, fruit, whole grains), protein (lean meats, soy, dairy products) and some fat, preferably those with low-saturated fat. It ain't rocket science, but few people catch on. It makes me nuts. :confused:

Amen to that brotha'. The day America as a whole does something in moderation, hell should probably be about ready to freeze over. Now, the carb-loading thing is good for competition, but it seems like Americans are carb, fat, and protein loading nearly every day of the year with their supersize this and biggie size that. This whole nation is supersizing itself and health-wise it's going right in the crapper. Not sure what the numbers are looking like now, but last I heard it was about 60% of our nation that's overweight, and of that 60% overweight, about 30% is obese. That's gotta say something about what we're eating.

But the other side of it is exercise. I personally think that's the biggest part about it. Everyone wants those friggin' ab blasters or thigh toners, or butt this and tricep arm flap that - whatever the machines are called. God forbid we actually take time out of our busy-ass days to actually work out for longer than 5 minutes. All the products out there and all of the new technology, while fun and innovative, is making us more sedentary as a whole. Top that off with cheap supersize meals, and it's a recipe for disaster. 6-minute abs - c'mon! Do we EVER see commercials promoting ACSM's exercise recommendations???? NO - At least 30 minutes of exercise on most if not all days of the week. How hard is it??? But we need to substitute 30 minutes of walking/jogging with our dog, or an afternoon of cycling in the great outdoors for 6-minute abs or 8 minutes of some other torturous-looking exercise device that confines us to our houses because we're too damn lazy to get off our asses and do something about it.

I'm not even that upset with the Atkins diet anymore. It's the lack of physical activity that leads to things like the Atkins diet and the South Beach Diet, or any other fad diet for the simple fact that we are becoming a more sedentary nation as a whole.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/02/10/atkins.widow.ap/index.html

258 pounds at 6 feet tall? The guy was fat and had heart problems. Evidently his diet wasn't effective for him.

I wonder what Dr. Atkins exercise routine throughout life was like.

[QUOTE=MikeBiker] I was cycling about 3300 miles per year during this time and lifting weights twice a week, so i don't think that I was "staggeringly unfit".

I've been following this thread and decided to add my 5 cents. Please don't take it the wrong way.

1. 3300 (or 3000) miles a year (round it to 3650 for easier math) probably isn't enough to really loose weight. I don't want to offend anyone, but..... 3650 miles is only 10 miles per day. as BowWow said he is riding an hour a day (every day), avg speed would only be 10 mph ;-( given flat terrain and decent equipment, i can't imagine anyone not riding less than 15mph. and if you do a few longer rides, that average would be lower still. My Excel tells me that if you did 450 miles in long rides, you would only ride about an hour a day, 4 days a week the rest of the year. That is probably fine for maintaining current weight, or if you very heavy, but once your body adapts to the load, you need to increase the load for more adaption. This is very close or almost under the ACSM guidelines for general fitness.

2. I meet recreational runners (10-30 mpw) on atkins almost every other week, and without fail, every one comlains about low energy when running. Not scientific, but obvious and, so far, without exception.

3. I believe Runners world or Peak Performance reported on a study that tried to predict health and life expectancy. The number one predictor of health into old age was physical activity, not wieght. You can be very thin but not healthy.

4. "Atkins really just wants one to cut out the junk food and sugar." File that one next to the "Pet Rock" and Elmo under stuff-i-should-have-marketed. I actually think that as Michelob and Subway start to have more Atkins crap, the benifts will start to be lost - pound a sixer of beer every night and only get 120 carbs - kinda defeats the purpose.

I've wasted enough of everyones time,
Thanks and Keep posting
Tim