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  1. #26
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    Perhaps!...just sayin!
    love my ludditespeed!

  2. #27
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    I have never thought of "flexy" and "comfortable" as the same. A bike can be designed to not transmit every bump while still not flexing too much in tracking (fork, for example) or power transmission (bottom bracket, for example).

    The design of a bike takes into account many factors. Most bikes are a combination of absorption of energy and transmission of energy. As an example, a good road racing bike for longer events will be designed differently than a bike made primarily for criterium races. Neither is "flexy;" yet they will differ in comfort and stiffness.

  3. #28
    Fred the Clydesdale
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    Quote Originally Posted by rgordin View Post
    I have never thought of "flexy" and "comfortable" as the same. A bike can be designed to not transmit every bump while still not flexing too much in tracking (fork, for example) or power transmission (bottom bracket, for example).

    The design of a bike takes into account many factors. Most bikes are a combination of absorption of energy and transmission of energy. As an example, a good road racing bike for longer events will be designed differently than a bike made primarily for criterium races. Neither is "flexy;" yet they will differ in comfort and stiffness.
    I have read here in the Forums that the most "give" is from tires and air pressure. Most frames are pretty firm. Yes, there is a different feel associated with the different frame materials (steel, aluminum, titanium, and carbon). Regardless, the design of any frame is what determines its stiffness. I have an aluminum frame that had a pretty harsh feel to it, until I put on 25mm tires @ 90 psi. I felt every bump on that one with 23 mm tires @100 psi. I also have a steel framed bike that has a wonderful feel to it (Soma Smoothie). I started with 25 mm tires on that one.

    The bottom line is changing the tires is the single most impact on ride smoothness. The tires are the first to give and take from the road.
    Member of Team Collin, a group of ordinary moreons going to extraordinary levels of awesome in the fight against cancer.

    Love conquers all. God is love. Jesus is love personified. Figure it out.

  4. #29
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    The prior owner had the litespeed "arenberg" bike from new and he is a bike shop owner and knows a helluva lot more than ever will about all the tech stuff with bikes. He's a clydesdale also and he road this bike many a country roads of oregon and not complaint did i hear from him and i believe most of us at this wgt. are'nt too concerned about bike wgt.,oh sure i could throw on a set of high end super carbon wheels and hope for something too happen,but the only real change will be to my bank acct. so i'll ride my (made in usa) 10yr. old Litespeed "wonderbike" with it's mavic (cosmic elites) and enjoy havin some bucks to stop and have brews.

  5. #30
    coast to coast
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    '......stop and have brews.' Now that's a good atTItude! Riding my new Seven around crater lake this spring. Def be stopping for some good Oregon craft beer!

  6. #31
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    I had a mid 90's de Rosa titanio. I fell in love with it's uniqueness and everything that a nos de Rosa can bring....until i rode it.
    It's geometry was perfect but small dia tubes couldn't resist my 80kg weight the way i like. I had a tst made ti frame before the de Rosa which was one of the best frames I've had but a bit too big.
    Both are gone now though.
    I suggest sell the litespeed and get what you're looking for or you'll question every ride on it.

  7. #32
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    De rosa..now there's a name out of the past...cool!..yeah it's always a good idea to get past the look of a particular bike and get to the nuts and bolts of the thing. Back in the good old 80's/90's when the usa. was gettin into cycling (ala) tour de france and watching Lemond and later you know who,the bike companies were probably scrambling for the bike with the latest innovations and hence began the trickle down effect of technology....just my opinion!..but if true!..most appreciated.
    As for my Litespeed,i have some serious $$'s invested in it and in order to come out of the expierience with a sense that it's not a waste because it does'nt climb or sprint very well is NOT! important,at my age and outlook of cycling i will ride the bike as though it were any other ride and YES! i will climb with it and well maybe not Cavendish it too much,but i will enjoy it for what it is and not second guess it.
    It is what it is............FUN!!!

    I need to start a Litespeed.."Arenberg"....love club.

    feel free to throw your saddle in the ring...LOL!

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by rider9 View Post
    I have read here in the Forums that the most "give" is from tires and air pressure. Most frames are pretty firm. Yes, there is a different feel associated with the different frame materials (steel, aluminum, titanium, and carbon). Regardless, the design of any frame is what determines its stiffness. I have an aluminum frame that had a pretty harsh feel to it, until I put on 25mm tires @ 90 psi. I felt every bump on that one with 23 mm tires @100 psi. I also have a steel framed bike that has a wonderful feel to it (Soma Smoothie). I started with 25 mm tires on that one.

    The bottom line is changing the tires is the single most impact on ride smoothness. The tires are the first to give and take from the road.
    There are many carbon seatposts that have upwards of a half inch of deflection.

  9. #34
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    Well i've learned a little more from the forum guru's now than i did say a month or two ago,and for that i'm thankful!...all the hype about one bike or the other being either more stiff or more compliant is up to the owner/rider for the most part...it seems to be the main advertising sales pitch used once a dealer finds out your specific needs and what you'd like the bike to do for you.All of the ideas for a better ride do have to do with its frame layout and what it's built to do best. Like i stated in earlier responses,this Litespeed "02" arenberg frameset is only going to do what it's designed to do,which is soak up crappy roads and let you ride all day...it's NOT! a crit.bike and never will it be....i'm cool with that!...besides i'll just have to go out and find a bike that is stiffer for those leg burning climbs and short sprints. You can never have too many bikes!

  10. #35
    grizzly moderator
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    Litespeed.."Arenberg" why so flexy?

    Quote Originally Posted by rgordin View Post
    I have never thought of "flexy" and "comfortable" as the same. A bike can be designed to not transmit every bump while still not flexing too much in tracking (fork, for example) or power transmission (bottom bracket, for example).

    The design of a bike takes into account many factors. Most bikes are a combination of absorption of energy and transmission of energy. As an example, a good road racing bike for longer events will be designed differently than a bike made primarily for criterium races. Neither is "flexy;" yet they will differ in comfort and stiffness.
    Exactly! A bike designed for the rider's weight with progressive stiffness from the top tube to the down tube and then to the chainstays would be the stellar example of the absorption and then the transmission of the rider's energy.
    With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important.

  11. #36
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    Exactly!.....that'll work...!

  12. #37
    Juanmoretime
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    I had an Arensburg it was a decent frame. I upgraded to a Vortex and it was a much stiffer and responsive frame. I think you need a Vortex with larger and shaped tubes at your weight.
    For my next trick I will now set myself on fire!

  13. #38
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    I have a Serotta titanium-carbon mix, aka the Ottrott; it's a "comfort" bike. Top tube, down tube, seat stays are carbon. Seat tube and chain stays are ti.

    I'm under 130 lbs, and about 5'7". My frame is a 50cm (so small frame). I can't flex this frame even if I wanted to! Although I'm under 130 lbs, I can sustain 270-280W for an hour on an all-out hellish climb, and I can "feel" that the bike is flexing a bit. However, when I tried the same climb using a much stiffer crit-like bike (Cyfac Nerv), my time is saved by less than a minute. We're talking about a 1-hr all-out climb.. saved by less than 1 minute. Now if this was a race, then 1 minute would be significant, but 1 minute means nothing to me if I'm training.

    But I can tell you this, on the way home from such a hellish effort, I'd take the soft Ottrott anyday over the much harsher Cyfac Nerv. Reason is because when your body and mind is tire, the last thing you want to brace your teeth for bumps and cracks. The Ottrott eats them up. And my pedal stroke when I'm in a tempo is smooth, I don't punch the pedals, so flexing a non-issue. But I do see a lot of big guys always trying to use brute then they pedals with their slow cadene. If pedal like a brute, then yer gonna flex lots of Ti frames.

    Having said this, I think at your weight (even if you may not be producing the same wattage over an hour as my measly legs).. you still probably can produce more peak strength (not wattage) than me, and therefore will flex the Ottrott. So I do not recommend you getting an averagely built Serotta Ottrott.. unless you custom it and have it overbuilt by Serotta.. but then this would make the Ottrott not an Ottrott anymore.

    If I were you, I'd keep the Lightspeed, and buy a used super stiff used carbon bike if you so desire (eg, Kestrel frames are cheap and they are STIFF. I would not buy a Kestrel for this reason, but you at 220# is ok).

    ** There is a Russian cutom Ti maker called "Titan". He is discussed more on the mtbr.com forum. He makes custome Ti frames for trial bikes and mountain bikes, and now is starting to expand into roadie world. If you want burly Ti road frame, then look him up. It won't be light, but you won't be able to flex his frames either.
    Last edited by aclinjury; 02-15-2013 at 09:58 AM.

  14. #39
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    I'm searching as we speak....always on the prowl!......thx's!

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by tidi View Post
    I had a tst made ti frame
    TST=best ti frames ever.
    No framebuilder is going to have the resources that Sandvik could draw on.

  16. #41
    Formosan Cyclocross
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    I always think my ti bike is too soft on climbs... soaking up all my energy and not stiff enough in the rear triangle and BB... until I actually start getting back into shape and focus on my climbing, and then I remember that is was simply my crappy legs at fault. The hills I did this week felt amazingly different than when I rode them last week. No energy transfer problems today. Funny that.

  17. #42

  18. #43
    pmf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juanmoretime View Post
    I had an Arensburg it was a decent frame. I upgraded to a Vortex and it was a much stiffer and responsive frame. I think you need a Vortex with larger and shaped tubes at your weight.
    Or an Ultimate. I've been riding one since I bought it in 2000. I've gotten up to 200 lbs and its definitely not a flexy frame. I love my Ludditespeed as well.

  19. #44
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    Yeah the Ultimate is the one i used to stare at in the colorado cyclist catalog and drool all over the pages....kinda like bike porn,but in a good way!,but a ultimate did not fall in my lap like this Arenberg did..which according to many on here is not as bad a frame as some make it out to be.Yeah i'll agree that is is a comfort frame and not a climb up the Alps kinda machine,but then i'm not a alps climbing kinda rider.Gonna try a set of 50mm carbon aero wheels on it from Vuelta and see if there is any ride differences good or bad. I'll probably ride it this year and analyze the feedback i get or don't get and maybe make a move in the off season....i never planned on riding this bike ballsout...so to speak! that's not how i ride any bike,so with it's in the saddle all day comfort it may just be the right machine for me....we'll see!...it's all good!

  20. #45
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    My new Litespeed, also known as the Lynskey Cooper, is plenty stiff with just the right amount of comfort for my 180 pounds. I also have the 1 and 1/8 inch Easton EC90 fork, Dura Ace cranks, and Boyd Vitesse wheels which are pretty stiff with the extra spoke count I opted for. The Cooper I believe would have shaped and maybe fatter tubes compared to your bike.

  21. #46
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    I hope a stiff wheel set will solve your problem. I also recently purchased a beautiful used 2004 Litespeed Vortex. I took a sharp turn going about 25mph and the bike started to wobble pretty bad. Does anyone know what Litespeed has reccommended for this problem? The bike rides stiff on straight aways and have decended down hill at a rate of about 45mphs. No problems with the wobble. I read years back that some thought it was the integrated headset. Others thought it was the fork or the flex in the BB. Has anyone heard anything new to correct this problem.
    Last edited by patsport89; 03-01-2013 at 06:39 AM.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by patsport89 View Post
    I hope a stiff wheel set will solve your problem. I also recently purchased a beautiful used 2004 Litespeed Vortex. I took a sharp turn going about 25mph and the bike started to wobble pretty bad. Does anyone know what Litespeed has reccommended for this problem? The bike rides stiff on straight aways and have decended down hill at a rate of about 45mphs. No problems with the wobble. I read years back that some thought it was the integrated headset. Others thought it was the fork or the flex in the BB. Has anyone head anything new to correct this problem.
    I have read that a needle bearing/roller bearing headset helps with shimmy. But good luck finding one.

  23. #48
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    Sorry to hear about that,but through all of this thread it seems the general concensus is that this is a in the saddle all day kinda ride. If you push this frame it sounds like it pushed back with a little warning of Hey! don't do that.I'm also thinking that the integrated headsets are nice when new,but like alot of things do...when they get on in time they tend to weaken easily...but you know what?...it's still a work of art in design.
    exploit what it does best!,and keep it under 25mph's in the turns!

  24. #49
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    I have an Arenberg and will never sell it. It is silky smooth and has over 16k miles on it. It is the Caddy for a long ride once in a while instead of the Shelby with the coil over racing package where you can feel every pebble on the road. If u have room for it in the garage there is no reason to sell it. At least keep it for a rain bike. My guess is that the bike shop owner who sold it to u is jonesing for selling it but he will never admit that to u. The newer big frame litespeeds are nice but they aren't cruisers like the Arenberg. I did have to strip off the yellow lettering and replace with crazy skulls, however.

  25. #50
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    I have an Arenberg and I weigh 210 and the bike rides very smooth and stiff and not flexy at all. The ride is similar to 853 steel but lighter .

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