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  1. #1
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    Yet another Ti thread. FireFly or Moots

    I'm in the market for "bike of you life" - 50th birthday. I like the look of the Firefly guys (and I'm local enough to go to the shop for fittings - but I know Moots is fantastic. Anyone have any guidance, experience of either... or opinions?

    Ydris

  2. #2
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    Before you sink too much time on deciding between the two look into what Firefly's wait list time is. That might rule them out.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    Before you sink too much time on deciding between the two look into what Firefly's wait list time is. That might rule them out.
    OP is local to Firefly. I'd say that's worth at least a 6-month wait time minimum, assuming he doesn't need a bike like right now.

  4. #4
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    I was very pleased with my firefly build. I did not wait six months. my wait time was several weeks. It's an option but you pay extra for it. In my case I didn't want to wait a year and the pay-up was reasonable in my view.

    Personally my choice was between Seven and Firefly. I think they both make great bikes. What distinguishes the two are the finishes. Seven just looks nicer and will do things Seven will not such as anodized treatment or nicer drop-outs. Both ride great and the welds and frame construction are top notch

    Firefly does the majority of its bikes custom. Moots does the majority of its bikes spec. Very different process , very different design philosophy. Both are good builders, but I think Firefly and even a Seven which I threw in are a bit more special. The way they approach bike building is a little more focused on working with the customer
    Last edited by Trek_5200; 02-09-2018 at 08:13 AM.

  5. #5
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    Buy local, think globally.

  6. #6
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    If you're local, then Firefly all day.

    Its my 50th next week and while I recently built up my ti 'bike for life', my present is going to be an even lighter wheelset; carbon this time

    Happy hunting!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trek_5200 View Post
    I was very pleased with my firefly build. I did not wait six months. my wait time was several weeks. It's an option but you pay extra for it. In my case I didn't want to wait a year and the pay-up was reasonable in my view.

    Personally my choice was between Seven and Firefly. I think they both make great bikes. What distinguishes the two are the finishes. Seven just looks nicer and will do things Seven will not such as anodized treatment or nicer drop-outs. Both ride great and the welds and frame construction are top notch

    Firefly does the majority of its bikes custom. Moots does the majority of its bikes spec. Very different process , very different design philosophy. Both are good builders, but I think Firefly and even a Seven which I threw in are a bit more special. The way they approach bike building is a little more focused on working with the customer
    That's pretty much my understanding of the difference between the two also.

    I'm local to Firefly and considered them but in the end choose Seven. I probably would have anyway but the wait time difference made the decision a lot easier.

    Seven is also local to Boston. Which, because they sell though shops may not mean a lot. But if you were to buy at Ride Studio Cafe in Lexington or Ride Headquarters in Sherborn you're essentially working directly with Seven. The questions I had were answered by the owner of Seven for example because he puts in hours at those shops. And regardless, once the measurements and stuff is done there is communication directly with the factory, if you want.

    Not trying to push Seven over FF on you. But I think they should be in the conversation. More so than Moots I think. Not that I know or have ever heard anything negative about Moots though.

  8. #8
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    There backlog is 15 months at the moment.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ydris View Post
    There backlog is 15 months at the moment.
    deal breaker for me. Waiting is one thing.....but that's a full year's less use you get out of the bike compared to a Moots or Seven.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ydris View Post
    There backlog is 15 months at the moment.
    for a small fee you can jump to the front of the line. i paid it

  11. #11
    Adorable Furry Hombre
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    deal breaker for me. Waiting is one thing.....but that's a full year's less use you get out of the bike compared to a Moots or Seven.
    Yea....15 months I can understand out of a one-man artisan operation like Potts or Zinn....

    But over a calendar year? Out of a studio maker? There cannot be THAT many people wanting one at the $4000+/frame price point. Which leaves either manpower or supply or sheer capital issues. Either that or they're just tooling customers to get them to pay more to jump an imaginary line.
    "Refreshingly Unconcerned With The Vulgar Exigencies Of Veracity "

  12. #12
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    Firefly for a small fee lets you get a frame much sooner than 15 months

  13. #13
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    Thank you all. I will ask them about queue jumping.

  14. #14
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    15 months wait time is a deal breaker for me too. I understand that you can pay a small fee to jump to the front of the queue, but that just rubs me the wrong way. Unless your heart is set on FF, or you can wait the 15 months, I'd look into other local builders like the aforementioned Seven, Independent Fabrications, or Geekhouse.
    Wake me up when it's alarm green.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tachycardic View Post
    but that just rubs me the wrong way.
    I try to avoid morals and scruples as they get in the way... Iíll check the cost - but I will check the other guys as well!

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trek_5200 View Post
    for a small fee you can jump to the front of the line. i paid it
    yeah we got that that first couple times.

    They have one welder thus one queue and to the best of my knowledge don't advertise that there is a rush fee available.
    So while some view the rush fee opportunity as a positive it can also be viewed as: If you are a commoner who figures $4200 for a frame is enough already or you don't think to ask you can expect to be bumped back by palm greasers.
    My opinion of that practice wouldn't be so negative if they disclosed it was going on but either way I wouldn't deal with it personally.

  17. #17
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    Four guys in the operation altogether. Iíll head up there soon and report back if it would be helpful.

  18. #18
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    OP Anything against Independent Fabrications? Didn't most New England Ti guys work there at some stage? Are you looking for aesthetics or performance although if you are like me at over 50 maybe the looks are getting more and more important? I love my Carl Strong bikes.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwisimon View Post
    OP Anything against Independent Fabrications? Didn't most New England Ti guys work there at some stage? Are you looking for aesthetics or performance although if you are like me at over 50 maybe the looks are getting more and more important? I love my Carl Strong bikes.
    I don't think so but the one that definitely did is Tyler at Firefly. FF started when Indy Fab moved to NH and a few guys decided not to go and instead stayed in Boston to start FF.

    There's a lot connections between all the Boston area builders current and past. The company that kind of started the whole thing and spawned others is Fat Chance.

  20. #20
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    I'm not a ti guy and have little interest in ever owning one but the finish options on the fireflys are damn sexy. Didn't see anything similar on the Seven site.

  21. #21
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    ugh 15 months? adios for me. Lots of things can transpired in 15 months. Something might happen to me to make me stop cycling all together, then what? 6 months is my cutoff time. Plenty of other reputable builders around. FireFly is nice, but not "15 months of waiting" nice. Hell no

  22. #22
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    Unless you currently don't have a bike to ride what is the problem with waiting a bit longer for the one that looks exactly what you want it to look like? Don't get me wrong, 15 months isn't ideal in any way, but if I ever get to the point where I want a Ti bike I will likely already own several carbon bikes and the ti bike would just be a luxury and I would want it to look like something along the lines of the firefly ones given the choice.

    Yet another Ti thread. FireFly or Moots-35879968526_eeb1d836ea_o.jpgYet another Ti thread. FireFly or Moots-35080998214_4f9ed27f2c_o.jpg

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    yeah we got that that first couple times.

    They have one welder thus one queue and to the best of my knowledge don't advertise that there is a rush fee available.
    So while some view the rush fee opportunity as a positive it can also be viewed as: If you are a commoner who figures $4200 for a frame is enough already or you don't think to ask you can expect to be bumped back by palm greasers.
    My opinion of that practice wouldn't be so negative if they disclosed it was going on but either way I wouldn't deal with it personally.
    So if folks are paying to jump the queue and you are are in the regular queue, what are the chances that you literally never move forward in the queue? I personally find this practice a bit unethical

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    So if folks are paying to jump the queue and you are are in the regular queue, what are the chances that you literally never move forward in the queue? I personally find this practice a bit unethical
    hence the current 15-month waiting queue?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    hence the current 15-month waiting queue?
    they clearly have demand. they can either do a two tier system or raise everyone's price or see the backlog grow even more. like i said i gladly paid the fee and got a bike in six weeks. i could have paid more and gotten it sooner than that. firefly does a great job, not only in building the bike but in working with the buyer.

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