Results 1 to 19 of 19
  1. #1
    E Plurbus Elvis
    Reputation: ElvisMerckx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    1,079

    Campy 11-Speed with Disc Brakes?

    Is there any way to run Campy 11-speed with disc brakes?

    -- 100% of the currently available disc brake hubs use Shimano-specific freehubs.
    -- I cannot find any 11-speed conversion cassettes.
    -- I've found 3 manufacturers [DT Swiss & Royce] who make both road and disc hubs with interchangable Campy/Shimmy freehubs, but I can't confirm either works with 11-speed (their tech manuals state 9/10 speed).
    -- In the case of DT, I cannot confirm that their "340/540 Campagnolo freehub conversion kit" will work with their 340 disc hubs. The kits appear to be road-hub specific (and, DT uses different part numbers for Shimano freehubs for their road and mountain hubs).

    Help.

  2. #2
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    1,937
    The DT Swiss Campy freehub works just fine with 11sp. That I know for a fact as I have one.

  3. #3
    E Plurbus Elvis
    Reputation: ElvisMerckx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    1,079
    Quote Originally Posted by JoelS
    The DT Swiss Campy freehub works just fine with 11sp. That I know for a fact as I have one.
    Yes, but on a disc hub? DT road and disc hubs use different freehubs.

  4. #4
    Steaming piles of opinion
    Reputation: danl1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    10,526
    Curious for the application in question. For example, 'cross on 11s seems sketchy, Record on commuter seems silly. What you want is what you want and that's all cool. but for me, the conditions that make me value discs aren't the conditions conducive to the relative finickiness of campy 11s.

    Plus, there's the question of discs. We're pretty much limited to Avid mechanicals, and really, why bother?

    If you're not happy with your braking, there are more forceful calipers than Campy, and with some good pad choices things get pretty good in most conditions.

    Not at all to incriminate your choices, just saying that I'm not seeing the driving force behind this 'solution' - which may answer why there aren't more options available.
    A good habit is as hard to break as a bad one..

  5. #5
    E Plurbus Elvis
    Reputation: ElvisMerckx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    1,079
    Quote Originally Posted by danl1
    Curious for the application in question.
    Commuter / all rounder, but I'm a tinkerer, so bear with me.

    Quote Originally Posted by danl1
    For example, 'cross on 11s seems sketchy, Record on commuter seems silly. What you want is what you want and that's all cool. but for me, the conditions that make me value discs aren't the conditions conducive to the relative finickiness of campy 11s.
    For 2011, Campy's top 5 groups are all 11 speed (SR, Record, Chorus, Athena, and Centaur). Campy also offers an 11-speed 'Cross-specific crank this year. So why would a Centaur commuter be silly?

    When I build a new bike I expect to ride it for 10 or more years. So, over the next decade, I want to be able to replace parts without replacing the entire drivetrain.

    I seem to recall lots of naysayers when it came to using 'finicky 10 speed for 'cross,' and before that, 'using finicky 9 speed for cross.' But, I do agree with you, I see lots of people on these forums making silly choices with their own bikes. In a world where fat guys and old guys buy ceramic bearings, carbon tubular rims, and $10,000 Treks, I wouldn't expect my request for a compatible hub to even raise an eyebrow.

    Quote Originally Posted by danl1
    Plus, there's the question of discs. We're pretty much limited to Avid mechanicals, and really, why bother?
    Patience. Industry will offer more options very soon. I expect Shimano and SRAM road discs to be released within a year. Campy within 3.

    Quote Originally Posted by danl1
    Not at all to incriminate your choices, just saying that I'm not seeing the driving force behind this 'solution' - which may answer why there aren't more options available.
    It's timing. In a few years set-ups like the one I'm describing will be very common.

    So, can anyone offer a solution without questioning my sanity?

  6. #6
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    10,126

    centaur 10 speed...

    Only Athena and above are 11 speed. Athena uses a Chorus cassette that costs quite a bit more than a Centaur 10.

    There's no reason that the DT cassette body wouldn't work. I can't imagine that they'd change the relation between the right spoke flange and cassette, just because the hub is made for a disc. All that said, it seems like a pricey hub for a commuter.

    Wheels manufacturing does make an 11 speed conversion cassette.

    I wouldn't expect bike parts to remain the same for 10 years either. Campy has made 10 speed available since 2000, so it's run exceeds that, but that's rare. The shifters have now been offered with four different internal mechanisms.

  7. #7
    cs1
    cs1 is offline
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: cs1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    1,170
    Quote Originally Posted by ElvisMerckx
    When I build a new bike I expect to ride it for 10 or more years. So, over the next decade, I want to be able to replace parts without replacing the entire drivetrain.
    Don't buy Campy if you need a 10 year lifespan. Campy in notorius for discontinuing parts once they intorduce a new group. I had that problem when I was using 8 sp on my bikes. Plus Campy changes actuation ratios all the time. First it was 8/9 sp then post 2000 9/10 sp now 11 sp. Shimano uses 1 actuation ratio, with the exception of DA until they went 9 sp.

    Personally, I like Campy but Shimano is more backwards compatible. I can take any current Shimano 10 rear der and use it on an indexed 6 sp and it will work. Campy has used 3 standards since 1995. None works too well on previous groups. That's why 8 sp rear derailleurs are so expensive on ebay.

    Right now I'm looking to build another 10 sp bike and all the new shifters Campy has in 10 sp are the dumbed down versions. If I want rebuildable I have to use older or used shifters which are climbing in price.
    1995 Waterford 1200
    1999 Waterford RSE-11
    Plus a host of old bikes too many to list.

  8. #8
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    1,158
    Quote Originally Posted by cs1
    Don't buy Campy if you need a 10 year lifespan.
    I've been using the same Campagnolo gruppo for the last fifteen years. I can still get shifter G-springs.

    I did replace freehub bodies in the late 1990s when the 8-speed cassette selection dropped and shift index disc.

    Cones and cups are still available.

    If I were using Shimano I couldn't get shifter parts (apart from the nameplate), would have needed a whole new pair of brifters to upgrade to 9 speeds, and would have to buy a new hub and rebuild a wheel if I ever wore out a cup. Even the bad new Campagnolo will sell you a $100 repair assembly including everything but the mounting hardware/brake lever/hood.

    Plus Campy changes actuation ratios all the time. First it was 8/9 sp then post 2000 9/10 sp now 11 sp. Shimano uses 1 actuation ratio, with the exception of DA until they went 9 sp.
    I have gear selection ADD and haven't managed to wear out a rear derailleur in 15 years. Admittedly I'm a low mileage user (October will be my first 400 mile month in a very long time); your mileage may vary.

    That's why 8 sp rear derailleurs are so expensive on ebay.
    8 speed and old 9 speed have the same ratio. Jtek has ratio converters.

    That said, Campy's new small parts policy, hub offerings, and move away from class silver (never goes out of style and still looks good once you scrape off the anodizing because you ride your bike more than you look at it) all suck.

    I guess they got tired of the competition from their own older products.
    Last edited by Drew Eckhardt; 10-27-2010 at 10:36 AM.

  9. #9
    Get off my lawn
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    542
    Originally Posted by ElvisMerckx
    Patience. The Industry will offer more options very soon. I expect Shimano and SRAM road discs to be released within a year. Campy within 3.

    It's timing. In a few years set-ups like the one I'm describing will be very common.
    sooner rather than later.

  10. #10
    woz
    woz is offline
    Madcow
    Reputation: woz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    114
    Yes it's possible but it's not as simple as just buying a kit. I was able to do this on a bike for a customer last year. We used a DT hub that we built from scratch using parts from both road and mtb hubs internally. You have issues with getting enough space so the large cog doesn't contact the spokes, spacers and lacing patterns can help here. You also have to start with an mtb shell but end up with 130-131 OLN. Then there are issues with caliper and disc alignment which can be dealt with by the use of spacers and adapters as well.

    So yes it's certainly possible and while it's time consuming trying to get all the pieces to fall into place just right, it's not difficult. You just need a good assortment of parts to work with and the patience.

    It won't even be too much longer that you have to stick to cabled calipers either. The doppelmoppel should be available to consumers before too much longer.

  11. #11
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    33
    try mavic speedcity wheels and swap out the fw body

  12. #12
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    2,492
    Wheels Manufacturing now makes a 11 speed cassette that fits on SOME Shimano compatible hubs. So there you go.

    Taking such expensive chains and components into conditions that require disc brakes seems rash. Campy got out of the MTB market for a reason. But I like to tinker too - just not with components that cost so much.

  13. #13
    Touring Biker
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    32
    Ahhh! We have the same idea .... but not for now, since im bulding my Roubaix
    Velocity make road disk hubs:
    http://www.velocityusa.com/default.asp?contentID=570
    http://www.velocityusa.com/downloads...-campy-500.jpg
    Last edited by Mauro Brazil; 10-27-2010 at 03:53 PM.

  14. #14
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    10,126

    well...

    You're right that the actuation ratio was changed, but only once in 2000, when 10 speed was introduced. The newer RDs all have the revised "B" screw location, making it easy to tell the difference. It stayed the same until 2009, when 11 speed came out. 10 speed RDs all remain compatible will all older 10 speed shifters.

    There is a difference in the actuation ratio with 11 speed, but it's so small that most users can install an 11 speed RD with an old 10 speed shifter and not notice. I've also used a 10 speed RD with 11 speed, but I do feel that it's worth the effort to modify the cable clamp bolt to slightly increase the actuation ratio.

    Campy 10 RD with 11 speed drivetrain

  15. #15
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    159
    Quote Originally Posted by Mauro Brazil
    Ahhh! We have the same idea .... but not for now, since im bulding my Roubaix
    Velocity make road disk hubs:
    http://www.velocityusa.com/default.asp?contentID=570
    http://www.velocityusa.com/downloads...-campy-500.jpg
    I'm on the same page as you and ElvisMerckx - have added a front disc to my Argon18 Platinum road bike, but will have to get a different frame to add a rear disc.

    Great to see rthat road disc hubs are now available, can't wait to see what the next gen of either cable calipers throws up, or even hydro STI's

  16. #16
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    602
    I don't mean to raise the dead...

    But 135mm DT Swiss 340 disc rear hub with the Campy conversion kit has an OLN of 135mm.

  17. #17
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    4,400
    Quote Originally Posted by cs1 View Post
    Don't buy Campy if you need a 10 year lifespan. Campy in notorius for discontinuing parts once they intorduce a new group. I had that problem when I was using 8 sp on my bikes. Plus Campy changes actuation ratios all the time. First it was 8/9 sp then post 2000 9/10 sp now 11 sp. Shimano uses 1 actuation ratio, with the exception of DA until they went 9 sp.

    Personally, I like Campy but Shimano is more backwards compatible. I can take any current Shimano 10 rear der and use it on an indexed 6 sp and it will work. Campy has used 3 standards since 1995. None works too well on previous groups. That's why 8 sp rear derailleurs are so expensive on ebay.

    Right now I'm looking to build another 10 sp bike and all the new shifters Campy has in 10 sp are the dumbed down versions. If I want rebuildable I have to use older or used shifters which are climbing in price.
    Thats why I can still get parts to rebuild my Campy 9 speed shifters but not shimano. It's also why I could use my Campy 10 speed hub with 11 speed but won't be able to with Shimano 11 spd. Uh huh.

    The one main advantage with campy is that you can still keep rebuilding their old stuff and the parts can still be sourced off ebay. It's one of the reasons I still have 10 year old Centaur on by Cross bike. I rebuilt the shifters once so far. That would not have happened with Shimano. So while when first bought it was a little more expensive I saved myself from needing to by new STI shifters by rebuilding Ergopower. Btw not quickshift. They still source the original ergopower internals.
    Last edited by badge118; 08-05-2012 at 07:59 PM.
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

    Theodore Roosevelt

  18. #18
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    509
    Quote Originally Posted by strathconaman View Post
    I don't mean to raise the dead...

    But 135mm DT Swiss 340 disc rear hub with the Campy conversion kit has an OLN of 135mm.
    and FWIW

    Hubs-Road
    Hubs-CX

    cheers

    MrC

  19. #19
    cs1
    cs1 is offline
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: cs1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    1,170
    Quote Originally Posted by mrcreosote View Post
    and FWIW

    Hubs-Road
    Hubs-CX

    cheers

    MrC
    Great link, where was it 3 years ago? Just kidding, thanks for posting it.
    1995 Waterford 1200
    1999 Waterford RSE-11
    Plus a host of old bikes too many to list.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Hot Deals

Contest

Tour De France

Latest RoadBike Articles


Latest Videos

RoadbikeReview on Facebook