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  1. #26
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    The coating manufacturers use is not, nor intended to serve, as a lubricant. Is only serves to prevent corrosion.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matador-IV View Post
    The coating manufacturers use is not, nor intended to serve, as a lubricant. Is only serves to prevent corrosion.
    Mixed messages. Some people say leave it, while others say to remove it. What to do?

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matador-IV View Post
    The coating manufacturers use is not, nor intended to serve, as a lubricant. Is only serves to prevent corrosion.
    Wrong

    Should a new chain be degreased before use?
    SRAM’s Nate Newton: No. Our factory lube is the highest quality chain lube available, not just a coating for shipping. Because it is applied with a sophisticated industrial process, it does not come with the inherent compromises of chain lubes in a bottle that have to balance performance properties with ease of application.

    The Take Away: Leave that new chain alone! Install it on a clean drivetrain and go ride your bike.
    Custom Di2 & Garmin/GoPro mounts 2013 SuperSix EVO Hi-MOD Team * 2004 Klein Aura V

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    Wrong

    Should a new chain be degreased before use?
    SRAM’s Nate Newton: No. Our factory lube is the highest quality chain lube available, not just a coating for shipping. Because it is applied with a sophisticated industrial process, it does not come with the inherent compromises of chain lubes in a bottle that have to balance performance properties with ease of application.

    The Take Away: Leave that new chain alone! Install it on a clean drivetrain and go ride your bike.
    SRAM is at least clear about it.

    Shimano's (new) chains are coated in what appears to be useless light fish oil that does little. Campag packs their chains in what seems to be cosmoline that is a 200% dirt magnet...and neither are that firm in whether to clear/lube or just ride.
    "Refreshingly Unconcerned With The Vulgar Exigencies Of Veracity "

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmason898 View Post
    Mixed messages. Some people say leave it, while others say to remove it. What to do?
    Who cares. I promise your life will be unaffected either way. It just a bike chain. Use it, when it makes noise lube it.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    Wrong

    Should a new chain be degreased before use?
    SRAM’s Nate Newton: No. Our factory lube is the highest quality chain lube available, not just a coating for shipping. Because it is applied with a sophisticated industrial process, it does not come with the inherent compromises of chain lubes in a bottle that have to balance performance properties with ease of application.

    The Take Away: Leave that new chain alone! Install it on a clean drivetrain and go ride your bike.
    Thank you tlg. That really helps.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmason898 View Post
    Mixed messages. Some people say leave it, while others say to remove it. What to do?
    Welcome to the internet, LOL!

    The immortal Sheldon Brown says this:

    https://www.sheldonbrown.com/chains.html

    Factory Lube

    New chains come pre-lubricated with a grease-type lubricant which has been installed at the factory. This is an excellent lubricant, and has been made to permeate all of the internal interstices in the chain. The chain and this lubricant need to be warmed during application.

    This factory lube is superior to any lube that you can apply after the fact -- well, unless...see below.

    Some people make the bad mistake of deliberately removing this superior lubricant. Don't do this!

    The factory lubricant all by itself is usually good for several hundred miles of service if the bike is not ridden in wet or dusty conditions. It is best not to apply any sort of lube to a new chain until it is clearly needed, because any wet lube you can apply will dilute the factory lube.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  8. #33
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    Yeah, it's grease. I would say unless you are a Chain-L or hypoid gear lube affectionado, remove it because it one-ups those lubricants on the disgusting scale of lubricants index, unless also you are an incessant wipe-a-holic, which can best be described as excessive-compulsive behavior in its own right.

  9. #34
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    my SOP is to purchase KMC chain, wipe it down, install, ride until noisy (usually ~300 miles), apply Chain-L, ride ~800 miles, reapply.
    the 45th POTUS is inept, corrupt, and a pathological liar. and those may be his better qualities...

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by mfdemicco View Post
    remove it because it one-ups those lubricants...
    +1. the lube that comes on a new chain is far better than the bottled wax i normally use, and that's just not right for a whole host of reasons, not the least of which is my great fear of the unknown. and, look, it's just way too quiet! is my chain on the bike or not? jeez! so i use a whole can of wd-40 to rid that stuff, then apply way too much of the cheap wax. i can rest easy now.
    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

  11. #36
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    Meh at "St. Sheldon" refeences. Sticky factory lubes pick up grit and will cause some accelerated initial wear on your drivetrain. Obviously not much, but I don't mix lubes anyway. The brand of lube I use (Dumonde Tech) instructs its customers to remove the factory lube since its own stuff has to polymerize against the metal. Any leftover factory lube would be detrimental and cause the new lube to wick off.

    Also don't effin' use wax based drip lubes on your road bikes. I tried Squirt for all of one week and it was simply awful. Like Dumonde Tech, they instruct you to full degrease your chain, let it dry, apply a first coat, let it dry, and then apply a second coat, letting that dry too. When you do this, the chain becomes very stiff an it's covered in a milky/translucent wax. If you start turning the pedals, wax immediately starts chunking off. I went on several long rides with Squirt and my drivetrain would start making gritty noises at the 40mi mark every time. When I asked Ned Overend at Sea Otter if this was normal, he said that's about what you should expect with road grime/grit. He said the solution is to just bring a small bottle of Squirt and relube the chain midride...

    Just...no. On top of the low mileage, dark gray wax started building up all over the drivetrain. In the derailleur cage, in between cogs, in between the chainrings, etc. You need a stiff brush to clean the wax off. MTBers may find the added protection fine for their usage...wet/damp, low mileage.

    If you're doing short race like crits and enjoy washing your bike, then yes paraffin wax dipped chains can spare you a watt. I'll just stick to Dumonde or Rock n Roll Gold for the easy wipedowns.
    Last edited by ceugene; 08-30-2017 at 10:10 PM.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceugene View Post
    Meh at "St. Sheldon" refeences. Sticky factory lubes pick up grit......
    Which is precisely why I wipe the OUTSIDE of the chain with a WD-40 soaked rag. The good factory lube stays on the INSIDE where it is doing some good while being removed from the OUTSIDE where it only serves to pick up dirt. Newsflash: Any lube left on the OUTSIDE of the chain serves no purpose other than being a dirt magnet.

    Quote Originally Posted by ceugene View Post
    The brand of lube I use (Dumonde Tech) instructs its customers to remove the factory lube since its own stuff has to polymerize against the metal. Any leftover factory lube would be detrimental and cause the new lube to wick off. .
    Whoa, what a great way to increase sales of Dumonde Tech!

    Quote Originally Posted by ceugene View Post
    I tried Squirt for all of one week and it was simply awful. Like Dumonde Tech, they instruct you to full degrease your chain, let it dry, apply a first coat, let it dry, and then apply a second coat, letting that dry too.
    Lather, rinse, repeat. Remember the one word on shampoo bottles that doubled sales?

    Quote Originally Posted by ceugene View Post
    I went on several long rides with Squirt and my drivetrain would start making gritty noises at the 40mi mark every time. When I asked Ned Overend at Sea Otter if this was normal, he said that's about what you should expect with road grime/grit. He said the solution is to just bring a small bottle of Squirt and relube the chain midride......
    A chain lube you need to re-apply in the middle of long rides?? Yikes! That is worse than White Lighning!
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Which is precisely why I wipe the OUTSIDE of the chain with a WD-40 soaked rag. The good factory lube stays on the INSIDE where it is doing some good while being removed from the OUTSIDE where it only serves to pick up dirt. Newsflash: Any lube left on the OUTSIDE of the chain serves no purpose other than being a dirt magnet.



    Whoa, what a great way to increase sales of Dumonde Tech!



    Lather, rinse, repeat. Remember the one word on shampoo bottles that doubled sales?



    A chain lube you need to re-apply in the middle of long rides?? Yikes! That is worse than White Lighning!
    40,000 stiction points OMG!

    UFO Drip might be the fastest chain lube ever | VeloNews.com


    And *only* $75 per 4oz bottle.
    "Refreshingly Unconcerned With The Vulgar Exigencies Of Veracity "

  14. #39
    tlg
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceugene View Post
    I went on several long rides with Squirt and my drivetrain would start making gritty noises at the 40mi mark every time. When I asked Ned Overend at Sea Otter if this was normal, he said that's about what you should expect with road grime/grit. He said the solution is to just bring a small bottle of Squirt and relube the chain midride...
    Ned is wrong. The solution is... never use that lube in the first place. Who in their right mind is going to stop a couple times on a ride to lube their chain?

    If a lube can't last 40mi, it's not doing a good job protecting your chain in the first place.
    Custom Di2 & Garmin/GoPro mounts 2013 SuperSix EVO Hi-MOD Team * 2004 Klein Aura V

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    40,000 stiction points OMG!

    UFO Drip might be the fastest chain lube ever | VeloNews.com

    And *only* $75 per 4oz bottle.
    There's one born every minute. 3 to 4 watts won't even be noticeable.

    More training will make you even faster and it's much cheaper too.
    Last edited by Lombard; 08-31-2017 at 05:40 AM.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    40,000 stiction points OMG!

    UFO Drip might be the fastest chain lube ever | VeloNews.com


    And *only* $75 per 4oz bottle.
    From the same company that offers $1,000 jockey wheels.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Which is precisely why I wipe the OUTSIDE of the chain with a WD-40 soaked rag. The good factory lube stays on the INSIDE where it is doing some good while being removed from the OUTSIDE where it only serves to pick up dirt. Newsflash: Any lube left on the OUTSIDE of the chain serves no purpose other than being a dirt magnet.

    Whoa, what a great way to increase sales of Dumonde Tech!
    And this is precisely why I remove the factory lube completely. The lube on the pins/rollers eventually makes it back onto the outer links and chainring/cog teeth. With lighter lubes like Dumonde, I can wipe it all off with one pass of a dry rag at the end of every third ride and the chain will look it was just degreased.

    Also degreasing a chain once is a pretty terrible ploy to make people buy more lube. They in fact say the chain never has to be degreased again after that. TBH, Dumonde has probably been the most cost effective lube for me in a long time because a 4oz bottle lasts so long and because it picks up very little dirt on rides, prolonging the life of the drivetrain.

  18. #43
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    Installed a new Ultegra chain last night, wiped down the sides, went for a 40 mile ride today with perfect shifting and no noise. Came home, eyeballed and cleaned the bike, went about life.

  19. #44
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    never ceases to amaze how worked up people get over a $35 wear item.
    the 45th POTUS is inept, corrupt, and a pathological liar. and those may be his better qualities...

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    never ceases to amaze how worked up people get over a $35 wear item.
    mine's $10!

    but i apply $70 worth of wax each ride.

    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    never ceases to amaze how worked up people get over a $35 wear item.
    It's a religious thing, you know.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by mfdemicco View Post
    It's a religious thing, you know.
    IMO it's more that I don't want to deal with the potential mess of mixing up random chemicals into a potentially gunky or congealed mess that performs worse than either on its own. Also I don't want to wait 3-4 applications before the lube of my choice and the solvent it's suspended in cleans out the last of the factory lube, all the while having a dirtier than normal chain.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceugene View Post
    Meh at "St. Sheldon" refeences. Sticky factory lubes pick up grit and will cause some accelerated initial wear on your drivetrain. Obviously not much, but I don't mix lubes anyway. The brand of lube I use (Dumonde Tech) instructs its customers to remove the factory lube since its own stuff has to polymerize against the metal. Any leftover factory lube would be detrimental and cause the new lube to wick off.

    Also don't effin' use wax based drip lubes on your road bikes. I tried Squirt for all of one week and it was simply awful. Like Dumonde Tech, they instruct you to full degrease your chain, let it dry, apply a first coat, let it dry, and then apply a second coat, letting that dry too. When you do this, the chain becomes very stiff an it's covered in a milky/translucent wax. If you start turning the pedals, wax immediately starts chunking off. I went on several long rides with Squirt and my drivetrain would start making gritty noises at the 40mi mark every time. When I asked Ned Overend at Sea Otter if this was normal, he said that's about what you should expect with road grime/grit. He said the solution is to just bring a small bottle of Squirt and relube the chain midride...

    Just...no. On top of the low mileage, dark gray wax started building up all over the drivetrain. In the derailleur cage, in between cogs, in between the chainrings, etc. You need a stiff brush to clean the wax off. MTBers may find the added protection fine for their usage...wet/damp, low mileage.

    If you're doing short race like crits and enjoy washing your bike, then yes paraffin wax dipped chains can spare you a watt. I'll just stick to Dumonde or Rock n Roll Gold for the easy wipedowns.
    I know I'm a bit behind.. but what?!?!?

    I use squirt mainly because the road lubricants don't stack up on dusty mountain bike rides, but this is crazy.

    I get at least a few hundred miles out of squirt lube on the road bike (I've used it exclusively for about three years)

    Sorry dude, but it's user error.

    You can definitely prefer other lubricants, but saying squirt only lasts 40 miles makes me think you didn't read the back of the bottle.

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  24. #49
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    I agree. I use squirt, along with the occasional hot bath in Molten Speed Wax. I'm usually good for 200 miles or before re-applying. And it's not like re-applying is some kind of hassle. It literally takes a minute or less to put a drop of the stuff on each roller. Very little if any cleaning is ever required.

  25. #50
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    Except you didn't even read my post carefully since the Squirt instructions are in my reply. I followed them about as well as you possibly could.

    1) I degreased a brand new chain in an ultrasonic cleaner with Simple Green Extreme Aircraft/Precision formula (to prevent hydrogen embrittlement)
    2) I wiped away the excess and transferred the chain to an old water bottle filled with distilled water. I shook it up, removed the chain and patted it down with rags.
    3) I let it dry overnight.
    4) I also fully cleaned/degreased my cassette and chainrings, and removed excess grease from the derailleur cages.
    5) After installing the bone dry chain, I dripped Squirt on each roller on the "inside" of the chain. I backpedaled a few more revolutions to let the still fluid wax penetrate the pins/rollers. I let it dry for a couple of hours.
    6) I then applied a second coat, a single drop per roller as instructed and let it dry overnight.

    Upon getting the gritty noises at the 40mi mark the first time, I decided to try again, but with one change. I had seen a YouTube video of a guy massaging the Squirt into each roller assembly with his fingertips. I tried that too. No real change. Every time I applied new Squirt, I let it dry overnight.

    Maybe it's dust, maybe it's power/torque...it definitely isn't user error. Squirt simply doesn't work under my riding conditions. The only other thing I can think of is that I need to use it for several weeks for the wax to fully penetrate between the pins and rollers.
    Last edited by ceugene; 09-03-2017 at 09:15 PM.

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