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  1. #26
    Fini les ecrase-"manets"!
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    But are the dropouts parallel?

    Haven't you just pulled your dropouts out of parallel? Step 2 of properly cold-setting a steel frame is using a set of dropout alignment tools to get the dropouts lined back up. I don't know what your disc adaptors are like, but if they attach to the dropouts you may find you have substantial alignment issues. Could be shifting issues too.

  2. #27
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeboy389
    Haven't you just pulled your dropouts out of parallel? Step 2 of properly cold-setting a steel frame is using a set of dropout alignment tools to get the dropouts lined back up. I don't know what your disc adaptors are like, but if they attach to the dropouts you may find you have substantial alignment issues. Could be shifting issues too.
    I seriously doubt it, but I will let you know. - TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  3. #28
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    Don't give in to the engineers...

    TT,
    Don't give in to the metalurgists!!! The history majors out here are in awe of your very ballsy move!! I only wish you had video taped the proceedings. Watching you ratchet the come along to bend that beautiful ti frame...sort of like going to the Coliseum to watch the lions eat the Christians!! You just can't look away... Hope it all works out (it most likely will). MacGyver'd be proud.

    SPG

  4. #29
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moosedryvr
    TT,
    Don't give in to the metalurgists!!! The history majors out here are in awe of your very ballsy move!! I only wish you had video taped the proceedings. Watching you ratchet the come along to bend that beautiful ti frame...sort of like going to the Coliseum to watch the lions eat the Christians!! You just can't look away... Hope it all works out (it most likely will). MacGyver'd be proud.

    SPG
    They aren't engineers - I'm the engineer. Engineers get things done within useful tolerances. - TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  5. #30
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    I think you cold set the trees a bit as well... the tree angle looks different in the last image.

  6. #31
    RoadBikeReview Member
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    One Question... 5 days have passed, why is it that he still hasn't put a wheel in it?

  7. #32
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by matanza
    One Question... 5 days have passed, why is it that he still hasn't put a wheel in it?
    You weren't asking me, but I suppose it is OK to answer anyway since nobody else would know the answer.

    I have had a wheel in it off of the Appalachian (see pick), but haven't built the wheels for this one yet.

    Any particular reason you needed to see this?

    TF
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Coldsetting Ti:  Two Trees, Come-a-long and Guts...-disc-install-1-800.jpg  
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  8. #33
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    winstonc - rack/fender question: Since I needed pictures for Mr. matanza, I took a couple to show the rack/fender mount. Yes it is the Litespeed adapter from their web site.

    In picture 1, you can see the the two bolts on the right hold the adapter on the drop out. The one on the left doesn't do anything (bolt is there to keep the threads clean) and my guess is that it is for fender/rack mounting??? You can also see the indentation in the top of the drop out where I cut the old mount off.

    Pic 2 is from the rear and you can see that you would really have to modify the rails to go around the caliper to mount anything.

    TF
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Coldsetting Ti:  Two Trees, Come-a-long and Guts...-rack-bolt-1-800.jpg   Coldsetting Ti:  Two Trees, Come-a-long and Guts...-rack-bolt-2-800.jpg  
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  9. #34
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Took another from the left side. If you have more questions, just ask. - TF

    EDIT: Also note that the QR lever can only point down. I may go to a non-QR just because I really don't like the looks of this. - TF
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Coldsetting Ti:  Two Trees, Come-a-long and Guts...-rack-bolt-3-800.jpg  
    Last edited by TurboTurtle; 10-13-2005 at 02:33 PM.
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboTurtle
    They aren't engineers - I'm the engineer. Engineers get things done within useful tolerances. - TF
    Yeah, every LBS should have a big set of maple trees out in back so they can cold-set
    their customers expensive frames to useful tolerances, the engineering way

  11. #36
    RoadBikeReview Member
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    OK! Thanks for the pics,

    but I was only wondering that since everyone was talking about alignment etc. The proof is in sticking the wheel in ein't it? Well, how 'bout it? ;)

  12. #37
    RoadBikeReview Member
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    I had to do that with a few LS frames that didn't come straight from the factory (this was in the mid 90s). If I remember right they were much easier to yank on than steel frames but kind of, well, weird and it was harder to tell what I was doing. They seemed to come out okay but I didn't have a lot of confidence they would stay that way over time.

  13. #38
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by Road cyclist
    Yeah, every LBS should have a big set of maple trees out in back so they can cold-set
    their customers expensive frames to useful tolerances, the engineering way
    No, they should have two big-a$$ frame spreader tools that two guys can grab and spread it. I'm just a "back-yard" mechanic. - TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  14. #39
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by matanza
    but I was only wondering that since everyone was talking about alignment etc. The proof is in sticking the wheel in ein't it? Well, how 'bout it? ;)
    It doesn't have to be aligned or parallel to get the wheel in. In fact, I cannot see why parallel would make any difference unless is was way off - much farther than this small change could make it. You just align the D hanger it's ready. If the frame is out of alignment, it won't track straight. - TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  15. #40
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    I really think you could build a cheap frame spreader that could
    would by turning a threaded leadscrew that could be positioned between
    your chain stays. As you turn out the adjustment nuts on either side
    positioned against your drop-outs your frame stays would spread apart
    slowly. One can also mount a cheap dial indicator to monitor
    on-the-fly adjustment progress. I could build something for under $10 not
    including the dial indicator. Thanks for getting me to think about this
    design project.

  16. #41
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by Road cyclist
    I really think you could build a cheap frame spreader that could
    would by turning a threaded leadscrew that could be positioned between
    your chain stays. As you turn out the adjustment nuts on either side
    positioned against your drop-outs your frame stays would spread apart
    slowly. One can also mount a cheap dial indicator to monitor
    on-the-fly adjustment progress. I could build something for under $10 not
    including the dial indicator. Thanks for getting me to think about this
    design project.
    1 - It will have to have something to hook it around the frame or it will not stay in the drop outs. If it comes flying out...

    2 - You can measure the spread with a ruler. Why would you need a dial indicator? Your looking at about 60mm delta - a ruler is way close enough.

    3 - What makes you think that this would be any better/more precise than the come-along.

    I don't think you are getting the idea of what is happening here.

    TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  17. #42
    Do not touch the trim.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboTurtle
    Took another from the left side. If you have more questions, just ask. - TF

    EDIT: Also note that the QR lever can only point down. I may go to a non-QR just because I really don't like the looks of this. - TF

    Yikes, you could have sent that bad boy to Litespeed and they would have happily welded a Disc mount on there. Seen it done many times with their MTB frames.

  18. #43
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by OnTheRivet
    Yikes, you could have sent that bad boy to Litespeed and they would have happily welded a Disc mount on there. Seen it done many times with their MTB frames.
    They would have just welded on the one I bolted on. - TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  19. #44
    Do not touch the trim.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboTurtle
    They would have just welded on the one I bolted on. - TF
    Sorry, just giving a heads up.

  20. #45
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by OnTheRivet
    Sorry, just giving a heads up.
    No offense taken - no sorry needed. They might actually weld one on top, but this works great so far. I would still have to spread the frame or pay them to do it. - TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  21. #46
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    Wink Quick Set

    In my part of the world we would substitute a 4-wheel drive pickup for the come-a-long, rev up the engine and pop the clutch, instant coldset.
    Last edited by Al1943; 10-15-2005 at 06:22 PM.

  22. #47
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al1943
    In my part of the world we would substitute a 4-wheel drive pickup for the come-a-long, rev up the engine and pot the clutch, instant coldset.
    I can see it now. Pickup, chain, bike, chain, tree. Moments later: Pickup with two chains, bike and tree on top. :-) TF
    "Don't those guys know they're old?!!"
    Me, off the back, at my first 50+ road race.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboTurtle
    1 - It will have to have something to hook it around the frame or it will not stay in the drop outs. If it comes flying out...

    2 - You can measure the spread with a ruler. Why would you need a dial indicator? Your looking at about 60mm delta - a ruler is way close enough.

    3 - What makes you think that this would be any better/more precise than the come-along.

    I don't think you are getting the idea of what is happening here.

    TF

    Sheldon Brown has spreding instructions that suggest use of a 2x4 piece of wood. I like his method since each stay can be bent independant of the other which will assure the alignment is not messed up.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboTurtle
    I can see it now. Pickup, chain, bike, chain, tree. Moments later: Pickup with two chains, bike and tree on top. :-) TF
    We could probably sell this to Geico as a new commerial.

  25. #50
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    QR goes on the other side with disc brakes

    That's how it was delivered on the two bikes I have with disk brakes. The QR goes on "backwards".

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