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  1. #1
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    Deraileur Pivot/Pully Lube

    Ok, here we go, another lube question, not unlike what your favorite beer is.

    At anyrate, what do you use on your DRís?

    Itís winter teardown time. Iím commited to doing the DRís justice and clean them down to bare nakedness. Take the cages apart, degrease the springa-duh-hinga-duhs. Try get the 105ís like new.

    Iíve been using Boeshield but it leaves behind this black crap that is hard to remove....

    Ok, tell me wuts best...

  2. #2
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    I rarely do anything to my derailleurs unless there is a problem. If you have poor shifting, the most likely culprit is cables and housings.

    On an old sticky derailleur, a spray down with WD-40 is all I would do. Put a little chain lube on the pulley bushings if they are noisy.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    ďStatistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.Ē -- Aaron Levenstein



  3. #3
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    I hear you. Kinda of in a take apart mood though. Time to replace the chain so itís off. Wheel hub has a ever so slight play in it. Going to replace the somewhat sluggish shifting cables too. Take the fork off, tear down. BB going to stay. Might even take the chainrings off clean meticously. New casette. Commuter needs some TLC. I like my steeds to be in tip top, no mid season needs, those do happen though....just want to show her some take apart luv...

  4. #4
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    I know a mechanic who swear that Tenacious Oil is the best thing for pulleys. I just give them a bit of chain lube once in a blue moon....
    "L'enfer, c'est les autres"

  5. #5
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    Ya, I think I might wander down to the LBS and pony up the excessive for the PW Tenacious...always chill to see my peeps too!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by saddle tramp View Post
    I hear you. Kinda of in a take apart mood though. Time to replace the chain so itís off. Wheel hub has a ever so slight play in it. Going to replace the somewhat sluggish shifting cables too. Take the fork off, tear down. BB going to stay. Might even take the chainrings off clean meticously. New casette. Commuter needs some TLC. I like my steeds to be in tip top, no mid season needs, those do happen though....just want to show her some take apart luv...
    Probably the best thing you can do for your bike. Make sure you get good quality stainless steel cables, not the cheaper galvanized cables. Galvanized cables oxidize which causes them to become rough. Rough cables cause friction. Friction causes poor shifting. Stainless steel stays smooth.

    Changing cable housings is probably a good thing to do too if they are older. Housings wear inside and eventually become rough and.......you get the idea.

    In the grand scheme of things, you can have cheap components with good cables and housings and your bike will shift decent. On the other hand, you can have the best quality components, but with cheap or old cables and housings, your system will shift like cr@p.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    ďStatistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.Ē -- Aaron Levenstein



  7. #7
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    Yep, got it all toarn down. Going to replace the shark toothed rings too. Time to take a break. Only thing left is shimano crank and FD to remove. Thereís no issues but it sure would be easier to clean the FD in the wash tank along with the RD. I have a backup BB I bought after riding through the floods last Spring and there was some click, click...but that turned out to be a pedal repacking....Iíll probably take it all the way...

  8. #8
    'brifter' is a lame word.
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    Absolutely replace the housing if you're replacing cables. Most of the loss of shifting performance takes place in the housing not on the cable...unless you store your bike outside or take it on a ferry boat on salt water.
    I work for some bike racers
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Absolutely replace the housing if you're replacing cables. Most of the loss of shifting performance takes place in the housing not on the cable...unless you store your bike outside or take it on a ferry boat on salt water.
    You have said this before and in the case of riders like us who ride a lot, you are correct.

    However, for the occasional or "casual" rider whose cheap galvanized cables (yes, many lower end bikes come with these) deteriorate due to age and therefore oxidation rather than use, new cables sans housings produce definite shifting improvement.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    ďStatistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.Ē -- Aaron Levenstein



  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by saddle tramp View Post
    Ok, here we go, another lube question, not unlike what your favorite beer is.

    At anyrate, what do you use on your DRís?

    Itís winter teardown time. Iím commited to doing the DRís justice and clean them down to bare nakedness. Take the cages apart, degrease the springa-duh-hinga-duhs. Try get the 105ís like new.

    Iíve been using Boeshield but it leaves behind this black crap that is hard to remove....

    Ok, tell me wuts best...
    I have had good success with a thin layer of grease combined with a dribble of oil. The mixture is "a very thin grease" or a "very thick oil." I would agree that Phil's Tenacious Oil would probably work well, as would 90w gear lube.

  11. #11
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    I took everything apart, crank off, chainrings, DRís, brakes...going all the way. Finally ended up soaking everything in alcohol-have gallons at work. Then using master blaster and that finally got the black rock hard boeshield residue knocked off. The jockey pulleys were encrusted along with the metal races that go on either side of them. That boeshield stuff was tough chit. So it probably was good-it protected, bad holly chit it came off hard...everthing is clean, clean! Reassembly I broke down and picked up some Phil Wood grease to reassemble everything with. My current chain lube has been rock and roll gold, love that stuff. And Iím going to use oil from prolink progold pen oiler on the dr pivots, pulleys. Ya, thatís the plan. Weíll see. The fun part, reassembly with all clean like new goodies...the zen part, I dig it. And yes, new cables and housing to be sure.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by saddle tramp View Post
    I took everything apart, crank off, chainrings, DRís, brakes...going all the way. Finally ended up soaking everything in alcohol-have gallons at work. Then using master blaster and that finally got the black rock hard boeshield residue knocked off. The jockey pulleys were encrusted along with the metal races that go on either side of them. That boeshield stuff was tough chit. So it probably was good-it protected, bad holly chit it came off hard...everthing is clean, clean! Reassembly I broke down and picked up some Phil Wood grease to reassemble everything with. My current chain lube has been rock and roll gold, love that stuff. And Iím going to use oil from prolink progold pen oiler on the dr pivots, pulleys. Ya, thatís the plan. Weíll see. The fun part, reassembly with all clean like new goodies...the zen part, I dig it. And yes, new cables and housing to be sure.
    Are you sure it was Boeshield? Boeshield is a yellow tinted clear color. I have used it on my bikes and power tools/blades for years and have never had it leave a black residue behind...

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Absolutely replace the housing if you're replacing cables. Most of the loss of shifting performance takes place in the housing not on the cable...unless you store your bike outside or take it on a ferry boat on salt water.
    This simply isn't the case in my experience with Shimano shifters. The cable starts to fray inside the shifter long before there's any problem with the housing.
    I generally replacing housing for every three cables (about 12k miles) and have never had any shifting issues from not replacing the housing when I do the cables.

  14. #14
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    yep, Boeshield T-9 and I didn't use it like crazy, just a little squirt when the DR pulleys started to squeak or the pivots on DR's. An occasional few drops under the BB where the cables go through that plastic cable guide. Actually worked it's way underneath that plastic piece and took the paint off a steel frame. Hardened to a hard black, finger nail couldn't scratch it off.

  15. #15
    'brifter' is a lame word.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    This simply isn't the case in my experience with Shimano shifters. The cable starts to fray inside the shifter long before there's any problem with the housing.
    I generally replacing housing for every three cables (about 12k miles) and have never had any shifting issues from not replacing the housing when I do the cables.
    I guess your expereince is different from the majority of mechanics I know and work with. Given that cables are steel and the housing liner is plastic where would you think that the wear (that has an effect on shifting performance) comes from? Yeah, the end of the wire will fatigue and most likely break in the shifter after XXXX miles but will there be any noticeable issue w/ the rest of the wire that's in the housing? Most likely not, and if there is any corrosion that will surely mess up the liner in the housing even worse than normal wear making its replacement a good idea.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Yeah, the end of the wire will fatigue and most likely break in the shifter after XXXX miles but will there be any noticeable issue w/ the rest of the wire that's in the housing? Most likely not, and if there is any corrosion that will surely mess up the liner in the housing even worse than normal wear making its replacement a good idea.
    It sounds like you are 'most likely' agreeing with me despite not agreeing.
    If the cable dies inside the shifter due to the what we'll call The Shimano Problem but there are no other problems I don't see how that accelerates the housing wear.

    If you replace housing and cable every let's say 10K for a Campy or Sram set I don't see how that's any different from going three cables per one housing with Shimano which to play it safe should be replaced around 3K.

  17. #17
    'brifter' is a lame word.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    It sounds like you are 'most likely' agreeing with me despite not agreeing.
    If the cable dies inside the shifter due to the what we'll call The Shimano Problem but there are no other problems I don't see how that accelerates the housing wear.

    If you replace housing and cable every let's say 10K for a Campy or Sram set I don't see how that's any different from going three cables per one housing with Shimano which to play it safe should be replaced around 3K.
    I'm saying there is wear inside the housing no matter what happens to the cable in the shifter. If it's been more than a couple thousand miles I'll ALWAYS replace the housing because wear in the housing liner is what compromises shifting performance.
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  18. #18
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    is the worn housing causing the wear/damage to the cable?

  19. #19
    'brifter' is a lame word.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldZaskar View Post
    is the worn housing causing the wear/damage to the cable?
    No, it's just not as smooth as new housing. The cable will wear through the liner and then that wear creates more drag. If the cable gets really dirty or corrodes at all the process happens faster. Wear to the cable is something that doesn't happen too often compared to housing wear which happens any time a cable moves in housing.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    No, it's just not as smooth as new housing. The cable will wear through the liner and then that wear creates more drag. If the cable gets really dirty or corrodes at all the process happens faster. Wear to the cable is something that doesn't happen too often compared to housing wear which happens any time a cable moves in housing.
    This is true. However, as Jay said and as I have experienced myself, the last two generations of Shimano STI shifters like to chew cables. I can generally count on having to replace my rear shifter cable every 1500-2000 miles. No wear or deterioration is evident on any other part of the cable except at the shifter. I see no reason to replace the housings at this point unless I am extremely bored.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    ďStatistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.Ē -- Aaron Levenstein



  21. #21
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    What I see on shift cables - agreed, the inner plastic liner wears with a steel cable under tension moving across it. The smaller the housing bend radius is, the more cable pressure, so more wear in that area.

    So worst case under the bar tape, bottom bracket, rear loop. The bottom bracket plastic guide area can also get a deep groove worn in it, so keep it clean and lubed. Or use replaceable teflon (not plastic) liner over the cable there and replace.

    When new, the cable glides over the plastic liner. Over time, the cable wears a groove in the liner, until a point where it wears the liner through to the steel. As the liner wears, I need to make slight adjustments to the rear mech tension, 1/8 turn or so like every 200-500 miles.

    If you follow this, it also makes sense that you should be able to rotate the housing 180 degrees and you'll put the inner cable on a fresh new area of plastic liner when changing cables.

  22. #22
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    for derailleurs ...

    fully overhaul the rear. lightly apply park grease on the two removable springs and both wheel bushings. use a light aerosol oil on the riveted pivots and the inner cage spring.

    simply clean the front derailleur. use aerosol oil on the riveted pivots.
    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

  23. #23
    'brifter' is a lame word.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z'mer View Post
    What I see on shift cables - agreed, the inner plastic liner wears with a steel cable under tension moving across it. The smaller the housing bend radius is, the more cable pressure, so more wear in that area.

    So worst case under the bar tape, bottom bracket, rear loop. The bottom bracket plastic guide area can also get a deep groove worn in it, so keep it clean and lubed. Or use replaceable teflon (not plastic) liner over the cable there and replace.

    When new, the cable glides over the plastic liner. Over time, the cable wears a groove in the liner, until a point where it wears the liner through to the steel. As the liner wears, I need to make slight adjustments to the rear mech tension, 1/8 turn or so like every 200-500 miles.

    If you follow this, it also makes sense that you should be able to rotate the housing 180 degrees and you'll put the inner cable on a fresh new area of plastic liner when changing cables.
    Alllll of this...

    Quote Originally Posted by blackfrancois View Post
    for derailleurs ...

    fully overhaul the rear. lightly apply park grease on the two removable springs and both wheel bushings. use a light aerosol oil on the riveted pivots and the inner cage spring.

    simply clean the front derailleur. use aerosol oil on the riveted pivots.
    And this...solid advice for sure.
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