Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 26 to 50 of 73
  1. #26
    fdfd
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    21
    The KMC X11L is equal to Dura Ace level.
    The KMC X11SL is equal to Dura Ace level with sugar on top.

    Both excellent chains. For value the X11L wins. And there is only 13 grams difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    No, not right. If you break a chain on the road your fix options are the same regardless of who makes the chain and if it was sold with a quick link or a pin. In other words you can use a quick link on a shimano chain. But come to think of it I'm not sure if pins are available for KMC, Sram and others or if shimano pins would work. So maybe shimano offers more fix options.
    No there isn't any available. KMC and SRAM chains are designed differently and not meant to be split and reconnected with a pin otherwise they could fail.

    Quick links are not just for repairs. They are permanent. They are more versatile and simply faster to use.

    I have re-used 11spd QL's many times without issues.

    Shimano pins are very easy to lose being so tiny. And there is more room for error especially if you are trying to fix it in the dark.

    And yes you will need to carry spare quick links for emergencies. I carry 2 pairs
    Last edited by trailflow; 12-29-2015 at 03:01 PM.

  2. #27
    I love to climb!
    Reputation: Jwiffle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    1,926
    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    What is that saying about the chain only being as strong as the weakest link? Therefore, in theory, 50% quick links is no weaker than one quick link. Not a wise move. A game of Russian Roulette IMHO.
    I don't remember exactly what article I read, but years ago sram said their quick links were stronger than the regular links. Every sram and kmc chain I've ever installed, I've used the provided quick link. Never once a failed quick link.
    Stop in at Element Sports. www.elementsport.com
    Get Out! Have Fun!

  3. #28
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by Jwiffle View Post
    I don't remember exactly what article I read, but years ago sram said their quick links were stronger than the regular links. Every sram and kmc chain I've ever installed, I've used the provided quick link. Never once a failed quick link.
    I think Shimano is the only chain manufacturer that doesn't use a quick link. In my opinion, quick links are a proven method to connect a chain.

  4. #29
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    1,612
    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    So many things wrong here... I don't even know what to say.

    Well, one thing is for sure. That's one expensive chain.
    Oddly enough, most of them were given to me on the trail as my chain broke during group rides. lol.. I probably used 5 of my own over a period of time.

    And honestly, it was not really close to 50%, I was being a little facetious and trying to be funny. but I did have around 10 to 15 quick links. Never broke one of those, normal chain links are the ones that kept breaking (XT range of chain)

  5. #30
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Oxtox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    9,818
    Quote Originally Posted by mfdemicco View Post
    I think Shimano is the only chain manufacturer that doesn't use a quick link. In my opinion, quick links are a proven method to connect a chain.
    quick links work fine. ridden thousands and thousands of failure-free miles using them.

    and, in 50+ years of riding, I've broken one chain (and it didn't have a QL).

    chain failure is a pretty minor worry...

  6. #31
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Lombard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    7,063
    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post

    chain failure is a pretty minor worry...

    ......unless it happens to you. I've seen people break chains on group rides, but it was usually a clyde or clydette or due to obvious chain neglect like rust.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein



  7. #32
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,303
    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    but it was usually a clyde or clydette
    I've seen a smaller guy (+- 160 lbs) breaking his chain before. He was riding a single speed bike and was pushing it hard at the start (out of saddle). Then I heard a "pop" and he almost crashed in the middle of a busy intersection.

    BTW, where are those clydettes riding? I know a dude who likes that type...

  8. #33
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    20,730
    Quote Originally Posted by mfdemicco View Post
    There is if you want clean it thoroughly.
    You can clean it more than adequately without ever taking it off the bike. Assuming we're talking road riding, use the following technique for successful ProLink or homebrew lube (1 part motor oil to 3-4 parts odorless mineral spirits) application and use:

    1 - wipe the chain, cogs, pulleys, and chain rings clean with a rag. If there is gunk on the cogs, floss between them with a rag wet with OMS.
    2 – shift to the big ring and the smallest cog and drip on lube while pedaling slowly so that the chain just starts to drip lube. Aim the lube between the side plates and between the bushings and the side plates.
    3 - keep pedaling the cranks for a minute or so to loosen all the dirt on the chain and to get full penetration of the lube.
    4 - thoroughly wipe the chain, cogs, pulleys, and chain rings clean with a rag.
    5 - repeat steps 2-4 if the chain was really dirty

    Do this AFTER a ride, as you want to allow time for the solvent to evaporate before you head out on the road. If you do this every 300 miles or so (or when you get caught in the rain or other dirty conditions), you will not get any significant gunky buildup, and you won't have to remove the chain or the cassette to clean it , and no separate cleaning is ever required. This leaves lube on the inside parts, and wipes it off the outside parts, minimizing dirt pickup.

    No lube is "perfect." A bright shiny chain that is clean to the touch but is well lubed and gives long mileage is still not possible. IMO, ProLink/home brew is the best compromise among commercial lubes. Other people have different opinions.

  9. #34
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    1,659
    Quote Originally Posted by deviousalex View Post
    Why are these complimentary? You ping the chain when you install it and if it breaks out on the road you quick-link it. If you use a quick-link to install the chain you can't use it to repair a broken chain on the road. It's already on the chain.
    Links are sold separately, and you can keep a spare link or two* in your saddle bag.

    I buy a convenient card of 6 KMC 10CR missing links for Campagnolo C10 chains when I'm running low. The last one was $14.73 with free shipping from Amazon which is under $2.50 per link.

    * In 2015 I discovered it's possible to put two loops in your chain when you have an over-shift off the big ring which corrects itself, bending two links in the process.
    Last edited by Drew Eckhardt; 12-30-2015 at 05:10 PM.

  10. #35
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Lombard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    7,063
    Quote Originally Posted by Kerry Irons View Post
    You can clean it more than adequately without ever taking it off the bike. Assuming we're talking road riding, use the following technique for successful ProLink or homebrew lube (1 part motor oil to 3-4 parts odorless mineral spirits) application and use:

    1 - wipe the chain, cogs, pulleys, and chain rings clean with a rag. If there is gunk on the cogs, floss between them with a rag wet with OMS.
    2 – shift to the big ring and the smallest cog and drip on lube while pedaling slowly so that the chain just starts to drip lube. Aim the lube between the side plates and between the bushings and the side plates.
    3 - keep pedaling the cranks for a minute or so to loosen all the dirt on the chain and to get full penetration of the lube.
    4 - thoroughly wipe the chain, cogs, pulleys, and chain rings clean with a rag.
    5 - repeat steps 2-4 if the chain was really dirty

    Do this AFTER a ride, as you want to allow time for the solvent to evaporate before you head out on the road. If you do this every 300 miles or so (or when you get caught in the rain or other dirty conditions), you will not get any significant gunky buildup, and you won't have to remove the chain or the cassette to clean it , and no separate cleaning is ever required. This leaves lube on the inside parts, and wipes it off the outside parts, minimizing dirt pickup.

    No lube is "perfect." A bright shiny chain that is clean to the touch but is well lubed and gives long mileage is still not possible. IMO, ProLink/home brew is the best compromise among commercial lubes. Other people have different opinions.



    Ahhh, there must be more chain lube opinions here on RBR than any other topic. Your advice seems good, but your using motor oil is controversial. Sheldon Brown specifically says not to use motor oil as it contains detergents:

    Chain Maintenance

    However, Mike T. on RBR uses a similar cocktail of synthetic motor oil and mineral spirits and gets 11K miles out of his chains:

    Chains

    Mike T. also uses WD-40 as a cleaner before the lube process.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein



  11. #36
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    8,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Sheldon Brown specifically says...
    There are several ways that people try to clean their chains. Only those which involve removing the chain from the bicycle are very satisfactory.
    Chain Maintenance

    Regardless, I have found a motor oil and OMS home brew to be perfectly fine and suitable for hundreds of miles of riding without squeaking.

  12. #37
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Ahhh, there must be more chain lube opinions here on RBR than any other topic. Your advice seems good, but your using motor oil is controversial. Sheldon Brown specifically says not to use motor oil as it contains detergents:

    Chain Maintenance

    However, Mike T. on RBR uses a similar cocktail of synthetic motor oil and mineral spirits and gets 11K miles out of his chains:

    Chains

    Mike T. also uses WD-40 as a cleaner before the lube process.
    I don't see the point of diluting motor oil with mineral spirits. Oil has no problem with penetration into the loose tolerances of a chain.

    The late Jobst Brandt said never oil a dirty chain. That moves dirt inside the chain and dirt is what causes wear. He got 10,000 miles out of a chain using 30 weight motor oil.

  13. #38
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    8,442
    On a site where people buy and sell $6000 frames like they're going out of style the OCD about getting a few extra miles out of a $25 part (chain) kind of cracks me up. I know I'm exaggerating and it's probably not the same people postng about high dollar that post about chain care but it still cracks me up.

  14. #39
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    1,659
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    On a site where people buy and sell $6000 frames like they're going out of style the OCD about getting a few extra miles out of a $25 part (chain) kind of cracks me up. I know I'm exaggerating and it's probably not the same people postng about high dollar that post about chain care but it still cracks me up.
    Amortized over the time I've owned it my titanium frame cost me $4 a month, and I'll keep riding it for the forseeable future.

    A $25 chain costs me $5-$6 a month. A $40 tire runs $8-$9 a month. A $4 shift cable is $2 a month.

    Obsessing about the consumables will impact my wallet more than riding a nice frame and Record Titanium components.
    Last edited by Drew Eckhardt; 12-31-2015 at 12:41 PM.

  15. #40
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    On a site where people buy and sell $6000 frames like they're going out of style the OCD about getting a few extra miles out of a $25 part (chain) kind of cracks me up. I know I'm exaggerating and it's probably not the same people postng about high dollar that post about chain care but it still cracks me up.
    On the other hand, a $6000 bike with a filthy drivetrain... What's wrong with that picture?

  16. #41
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    1,659
    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    quick links work fine. ridden thousands and thousands of failure-free miles using them.

    and, in 50+ years of riding, I've broken one chain (and it didn't have a QL).

    chain failure is a pretty minor worry...
    With 8 cogs or more I've broken at least three in 19 years without shifting under load, some while weighing under 150 pounds.

    That could have been due to my C8/C9 chains because Campagnolo didn't switch to flush peened rivets until moving to 10 cogs, and they stay on longer while elongating - 5000 miles to reach 1/32" at which point I replace anyways because side wear has degraded shifting.

    I also bent two links when the chain came off my big ring then went back on putting two loops in itself.

    KMC vs. Shimano Chains? learn me sumtin'-bent_link.jpg
    Last edited by Drew Eckhardt; 12-31-2015 at 12:38 PM.

  17. #42
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    8,223
    Quote Originally Posted by mfdemicco View Post
    I don't see the point of diluting motor oil with mineral spirits. Oil has no problem with penetration into the loose tolerances of a chain.

    The late Jobst Brandt said never oil a dirty chain. That moves dirt inside the chain and dirt is what causes wear. He got 10,000 miles out of a chain using 30 weight motor oil.
    The OMS helps to clean the dirt out and helps get the oil into all the spots. When it evaporates it leaves a thin film of oil on the parts, which tends to collect less dirt than a thick glob of oil.

  18. #43
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    5,618
    I have bronken 2 Shimano chains, pins broke. One was on my mtb bike, and one was on climbing road bike. But haven't broken any quick links yet.

  19. #44
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    8,223
    Damn, just broke my first chain today. Just finished a ride on the Mukluk and decided to ride through our virgin snow yard. It broke at a standard pin. Only about 300 miles on it. Pretty sure it's a SRAM.

  20. #45
    Crank Addict
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    1,923
    OK... so i put the new chain on last night. I can feel that it has a film on it... does it need to lubed prior to use? or is the film I'm feeling, a perfectly lubed chain, ready to go?

    Bike #2 gets swapped the afternoon.
    ___________________________
    2016 Pactimo Brand Ambassador

    www.Crankaddicts.cc

    www.skratchlabs.com
    www.hilltopbicycles.com

    2015 S-Works DSW Allez
    2014 S-Works Shiv TT
    2015 Specialized Venge Pro
    2016 Specialized Fuse Comp

  21. #46
    Crank Addict
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    1,923
    Quote Originally Posted by TricrossRich View Post
    OK... so i put the new chain on last night. I can feel that it has a film on it... does it need to lubed prior to use? or is the film I'm feeling, a perfectly lubed chain, ready to go?

    Bike #2 gets swapped the afternoon.
    ::edit.... just checked KMC's website and I found in the FAQ, Chains are lubed, ready to run.
    ___________________________
    2016 Pactimo Brand Ambassador

    www.Crankaddicts.cc

    www.skratchlabs.com
    www.hilltopbicycles.com

    2015 S-Works DSW Allez
    2014 S-Works Shiv TT
    2015 Specialized Venge Pro
    2016 Specialized Fuse Comp

  22. #47
    Forever a Student
    Reputation: MMsRepBike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    4,963
    Quote Originally Posted by TricrossRich View Post
    ::edit.... just checked KMC's website and I found in the FAQ, Chains are lubed, ready to run.
    yes, but...

    I never put a chain on right out of the package, they always get soaked in mineral spirits overnight and rinsed/dried first. Why? Compatibility issues. Is that stock lube on the chain compatible with whatever you're going to put on it? What if it isn't?
    use a torque wrench

  23. #48
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Lombard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    7,063
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue CheeseHead View Post
    Damn, just broke my first chain today. Just finished a ride on the Mukluk and decided to ride through our virgin snow yard. It broke at a standard pin. Only about 300 miles on it. Pretty sure it's a SRAM.
    Who installed that chain? I didn't think SRAM or KMC used a pin, only Shimano. My only guess is that your SRAM chain was attached using the Shimano pin. That's a definite no-no.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein



  24. #49
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Oxtox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    9,818
    Quote Originally Posted by TricrossRich View Post
    ::edit.... just checked KMC's website and I found in the FAQ, Chains are lubed, ready to run.
    fwiw, Sheldon says to never remove the mfg's lube. see below...

    Factory Lube

    New chains come pre-lubricated with a grease-type lubricant which has been installed at the factory. This is an excellent lubricant, and has been made to permeate all of the internal interstices in the chain. This factory lube is superior to any lube that you can apply after the fact [well, unless...see below -- John Allen].

    Some people make the bad mistake of deliberately removing this superior lubricant. Don't do this!

    The factory lubricant all by itself is usually good for several hundred miles of service if the bike is not ridden in wet or dusty conditions. It is best not to apply any sort of lube to a new chain until it is clearly needed, because any wet lube you can apply will dilute the factory lube.

  25. #50
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    8,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Who installed that chain? I didn't think SRAM or KMC used a pin, only Shimano. My only guess is that your SRAM chain was attached using the Shimano pin. That's a definite no-no.
    Chain was original. Turns out it was a KMC and it happened to be the Missing Link that failed, but it did not fail at the one of the removable pin to plate connections. One of the plates broke on the side where the pin was pressed in. I will post a picture.

    Well, I can no longer say that I have not broken a KMC chain or a missing link, I killed two birds with one stone.

    BTW, this is a 10 speed setup. Given the chain only has 300 miles on it I installed a new missing link and will give it a go. (Saddle bag has another missing link and chain tool, just in case.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Shimano CN vs. HG 10-speed chains?
    By no msg in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 10-22-2014, 09:02 AM
  2. Chains, Sram vs. Shimano
    By havanabama in forum Specialized
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 09-02-2013, 05:10 AM
  3. Shimano vs KMC chains
    By GDTRFB in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 08-16-2012, 05:58 AM
  4. shimano cassettes and chains
    By focusyourself in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-12-2010, 01:50 PM
  5. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-11-2007, 05:09 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Latest RoadBike Articles

THE SITE

ABOUT ROADBIKEREVIEW

VISIT US AT

roadbikereview.com and the ConsumerReview Network are business units of Invenda Corporation

(C) Copyright 1996-2018. All Rights Reserved.