Results 1 to 18 of 18
  1. #1
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: OldZaskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    1,972

    Shimming a wheel to center it?

    My 2009 Scott Addict SL frame was clearly designed before we all knew with absolute certainty that 25mm tires were exponentially faster.

    My wider rims (19mm inside / 25mm outside) and 25mm tires have taken up most of the space between the chain stays. But, the wheel isn't centered in the frame. It's straight. just not centered. And, the non-drive side is really close - like 1mm close.

    I'm wondering if adding a 1mm spacer/washer, between the non-drive side of the hub and the frame, would have any negative affect... and if it'd even do any good. Adding that spacer won't move the hub/wheel any closer to the drive side chain stay. It would only spread the frame at the drops.

    I guess I'm answering my own question on the spacer fix. So... is there a solution here? Or, do I drop to a narrower wheel/tire or different wider wheel/tires?

  2. #2
    'brifter' is a lame word.
    Reputation: cxwrench's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    11,876
    Why on earth would you use spacers when you can center the rim?
    I work for some bike racers
    I've got some bikes, some guns,
    and a bunch of skateboards

  3. #3
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: OldZaskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    1,972
    This is why I'm asking cx. I did say that "I think I answered my own question..." - that a shim/spacer won't work...

    I'm assuming, when you say "... you can center the rim", that'd be a job for a competent wheel builder - to redish the wheel?

  4. #4
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: bikerjulio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    7,356
    You say the wheel is "straight". How do you know this?
    We just don’t realize the most significant moments of our lives when they’re happening
    Back then I thought “well there'll be other days”
    I didn’t realize that was the only day
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9yrupye7B0

    There's sometimes a buggy.
    How many drivers does a buggy have?
    One.
    So let's just say I'm drivin' this buggy...
    and if you fix your attitude you can ride along with me.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GekiIMh4ZkM

  5. #5
    'brifter' is a lame word.
    Reputation: cxwrench's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    11,876
    Quote Originally Posted by OldZaskar View Post
    This is why I'm asking cx. I did say that "I think I answered my own question..." - that a shim/spacer won't work...

    I'm assuming, when you say "... you can center the rim", that'd be a job for a competent wheel builder - to redish the wheel?
    Do you have access to a truing stand? Shouldn't be too hard, you can do it w/o a dishing tool also. If the wheel is straight as you say, and the truing stand is set up properly w/ the feeler gauges centered, you can tell if the rim is centered and then adjust as needed. If you don't have a truing stand you could do it with the wheel in the frame but I'd recommend taking it to a shop with an experienced wheel builder and let him/her do it.
    I work for some bike racers
    I've got some bikes, some guns,
    and a bunch of skateboards

  6. #6
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: bikerjulio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    7,356
    As well as the wheel being correctly dished, I also meant "how do you know the dropouts are perfectly aligned"?

    With a known "straight" wheel, you can test by installing it both correctly and backwards. If it's still offset the same way in the chainstays for this test then it's not the wheel, it's the dropouts.
    We just don’t realize the most significant moments of our lives when they’re happening
    Back then I thought “well there'll be other days”
    I didn’t realize that was the only day
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9yrupye7B0

    There's sometimes a buggy.
    How many drivers does a buggy have?
    One.
    So let's just say I'm drivin' this buggy...
    and if you fix your attitude you can ride along with me.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GekiIMh4ZkM

  7. #7
    a real member's member
    Reputation: blackfrancois's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    3,001
    i check dish with two equal stacks of cd jewel cases on a table and a metric ruler.

    a long string can tell you if your frame is straight.

    for steel bikes, a homemade dropout alignment tool can be made for about $5.
    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

  8. #8
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: bikerjulio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    7,356
    1 mm off at the dropouts is going to translate to 3mm sideways at the rim.

    It doesn't take much.
    We just don’t realize the most significant moments of our lives when they’re happening
    Back then I thought “well there'll be other days”
    I didn’t realize that was the only day
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9yrupye7B0

    There's sometimes a buggy.
    How many drivers does a buggy have?
    One.
    So let's just say I'm drivin' this buggy...
    and if you fix your attitude you can ride along with me.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GekiIMh4ZkM

  9. #9
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    7,860
    Some bikes have asymmetric chainstays or even seat stays by the way. It could be there's no problem other than the wheels/tires don't fit your frame if it's asymmetric by design.

  10. #10
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    7,860
    Quote Originally Posted by bikerjulio View Post
    1 mm off at the dropouts is going to translate to 3mm sideways at the rim.

    It doesn't take much.
    Right, not much at all. I've had even dirt/gunk build up that somehow got on my hub throw of the centering.

  11. #11
    Russian Troll Farmer
    Reputation: No Time Toulouse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    966
    Quote Originally Posted by blackfrancois View Post
    i check dish with two equal stacks of cd jewel cases on a table and a metric ruler.

    ....
    Bad suggestion, not all CD cases are the same.

    My way is to use 3 of a set of machinist's matched 1-2-3 blocks on an inspection plate, and a height stand with an indicator. Zero the stand, flip the wheel, and measure again.
    "L'enfer, c'est les autres"

  12. #12
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    20,548
    Quote Originally Posted by OldZaskar View Post
    But, the wheel isn't centered in the frame. It's straight. just not centered. And, the non-drive side is really close - like 1mm close.
    Remove the wheel, flip it around (freewheel on the left) and reinstall. If the rim has "moved" to the other side, then your wheel is not properly dished. If the rim is in the same place, then the frame is asymmetric (either because it is off or as a "feature").

  13. #13
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: OldZaskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    1,972
    THIS is the experience and knowledge I was looking for. I'm going to flip the wheel and compare clearance side to side. Then (feel like I need an if-then chart) depending on findings, address the dish. There's a very good shop/wheel builder about 10 minutes away. No brainer there (the wheels are too new and too nice for me to experiment with).

    I'd actually rather - if there's a problem at all - that it be with the frame. The frame has another week before it's retired. The wheels are just getting started.

    Thanks guys.

  14. #14
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Lombard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    5,507
    Better yet, just invest in one of these:

    https://www.biketiresdirect.com/prod...iABEgKeJvD_BwE
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  15. #15
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    510
    Quote Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    Bad suggestion, not all CD cases are the same.

    My way is to use 3 of a set of machinist's matched 1-2-3 blocks on an inspection plate, and a height stand with an indicator. Zero the stand, flip the wheel, and measure again.
    Are you kidding? The creative CD jewel case suggestion is plenty accurate, even if the jewel cases are of different thicknesses or the table isn't precisely flat. All you are measuring is the distance between table and hub flange, then flip the wheel and repeat. S long as the jewel case stack isn't moved, the difference between the two measurements is plenty accurate enough - as in within +/-1mm. I'll save my precision blocks, inspection plates and indicators for the stuff that needs the high precision.

  16. #16
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    7,860
    I'm kind of surprised so many guys have Jewel CDs laying around to use. https://www.amazon.com/Merry-Goes-Ro...t_mus_ep_dpi_1

  17. #17
    a real member's member
    Reputation: blackfrancois's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    3,001
    Quote Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    Bad suggestion, not all CD cases are the same.
    lol. you can just measure them.
    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

  18. #18
    .je
    .je is online now
    JRA FYI
    Reputation: .je's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    797

    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    Bad suggestion, not all CD cases are the same.

    My way is to use 3 of a set of machinist's matched 1-2-3 blocks on an inspection plate, and a height stand with an indicator. Zero the stand, flip the wheel, and measure again.
    WHY THAT FUSS??

    I made this dishing tool (and that truing stand) from literally scrap I had, and it works exactly like it it's supposed to. There isn't a measurement gauge, but your eyes can see to 0.1mm. 2x4s that are 3.5" wide, a stick or wood like that, and a wood screw to measure the lock nut face.
    Attachment 313061

Similar Threads

  1. Shimming a seat post - homemade fix?
    By mm9 in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 01-11-2014, 08:43 PM
  2. 46cm (center 2 center) compact bar
    By jrm in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 06-18-2012, 09:57 AM
  3. Bars 46cm Center to Center
    By laxcheeks in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 04-03-2010, 01:18 PM
  4. Shimming a 27.2mm post to 31.6mm??
    By domo in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-04-2006, 02:31 PM
  5. Rear wheel rim off center (over-dished)
    By Speed_Metal in forum General Cycling Discussion
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 03-30-2004, 01:12 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •