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  1. #1
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    Armstrong's 2001 sample was suspect but not positive, says head of Lausanne lab

    Lance Armstrong provided a suspicious doping control at the 2001 Tour de Suisse but did not test positive for EPO, according to Martial Saugy, the director of the Lausanne laboratory which carried out the tests.

    Floyd Landis and Tyler Hamilton both testified to the US Anti-Doping Agency that Armstrong had told them that he had tested positive in Switzerland in 2001 but that the UCI had covered up the result. The UCI has denied any such collusion.

    Speaking to AFP, Saugy said that Armstrong did not test positive for EPO but his sample was one of the three from the race to be flagged as “suspect." As an "important competitor," Armstrong was called before the UCI to provide an explanation. Armstrong returned another such suspect sample at the Dauphiné Liberé in 2002, which was analysed by a different laboratory.

    “There was no positive test on the Tour of Switzerland in 2001,” Saugy told AFP. “Armstrong had another suspect result during the 2002 Dauphiné Liberé. The politics of the UCI at that time, if there was such a result involving an important competitor, was to meet them and ask for an explanation. That was their approach to prevention.”




    Who is lying......Martial Saugy or Landis and Hamilton.
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  2. #2
    Iohannes fac totum
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    It is possible that they are all telling the truth. I trust Saugy. Landis and Hamilton both could have been told that by Armstrong, assuming Armstrong misinterpreted the info that was relayed to him. OR Landis and Hamilton misinterpreted what they heard. OR they are all liars who misinterpreted each other.

    There is no reason to doubt what Saugy is saying though.

  3. #3
    haole from the mainland
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    Quote Originally Posted by 88 rex View Post
    It is possible that they are all telling the truth. I trust Saugy. Landis and Hamilton both could have been told that by Armstrong, assuming Armstrong misinterpreted the info that was relayed to him. OR Landis and Hamilton misinterpreted what they heard. OR they are all liars who misinterpreted each other.

    There is no reason to doubt what Saugy is saying though.
    Or Armstrong wanted to intimate he was God to Hamilton and Landis. "Don't worry about testing positive--we can take care of that." I have no doubt there was a lot of bull$hitting and mind games on the Postal bus.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jorgy View Post
    Or Armstrong wanted to intimate he was God to Hamilton and Landis. "Don't worry about testing positive--we can take care of that." I have no doubt there was a lot of bull$hitting and mind games on the Postal bus.
    This would be my guess as well.

  5. #5
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    Not saying they did, but the Laussanne lab does in fact have a good reason to lie...if the test was actually "positive" but was read a "suspicious" for cover up purposes, it would completely undermine their legitimacy. Everyone involved has a self-preservation interest in this mess.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmdrpiffle View Post
    This would be my guess as well.
    sounds right to me.
    Set=DbOg

  7. #7
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    [QUOTE=MR_GRUMPY;4153086]Who is lying......Martial Saugy or Landis and Hamilton./QUOTE]

    The person who is most likely to have been lying is Armstrong but it's probably just as likely he simply misunderstood when he told his team mates he had tested positive.

    Besides what seems to get missed in all of this messing about regarding whether it was positive or not, is that a meeting took place between Armstrong and his people and the lab explaining to them how the test works, why he was almost positive, etc.

    IOW, they gave Armstrong's people all kinds of info. relevant to avoiding a positive.

  8. #8
    haole from the mainland
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne Barry View Post

    The person who is most likely to have been lying is Armstrong but it's probably just as likely he simply misunderstood when he told his team mates he had tested positive.

    Besides what seems to get missed in all of this messing about regarding whether it was positive or not, is that a meeting took place between Armstrong and his people and the lab explaining to them how the test works, why he was almost positive, etc.

    IOW, they gave Armstrong's people all kinds of info. relevant to avoiding a positive.
    Sounds like that was the protocol of the day, which seems crazy in retrospect.
    Last edited by jorgy; 10-21-2012 at 10:42 AM.

  9. #9
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    I don't think it matters at this point. His grave was dug a long time ago.

  10. #10
    Rollin' Stones
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    Perhaps the lab is trying to maintain credibility to save their jobs?
    I want rustlers, cutthroats, murderers, bounty hunters, desperados, mugs, pugs, thugs, nitwits, halfwits, dimwits, vipers, snipers, con-men, Indian agents, Mexican bandits, muggers, buggerers, bushwhackers, hornswogglers, horse thieves, bull-dykes, train robbers, bank robbers, ass-kickers, sh**-kickers, and Methodists!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by jorgy View Post
    Sounds like that was the protocol of the day, which seems crazy in retrospect.
    It seems crazy, period. Those meeting could only serve one purpose: To fine tune the athlete's doping program so he did not test positive in the future. Flat out corruption.

  12. #12
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    Nobody can fault the statement that Floyd Landis and Tyler Hamilton are both self admitted liars. Can anyone say the same for Saugy??

    People can speculate all they want, but I'm talking about hard facts.
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    If your opinion differs from mine, ..........Too bad.
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  13. #13
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    This is sort of odd.

    1. competitor's sample is suspect
    2. competitor gets called to discuss sample
    3. something happens
    4. positive is cancelled.

    Maybe the "something happens" is the shakedown of the competitor for a "donation".

    In any case, the whole thing is embarrassing for cycling.

  14. #14
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    Maybe Saugy has Elvis living with him.

    Speculation is fun.
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    If your opinion differs from mine, ..........Too bad.
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    How would you like it if Hitler killed you
    Dogbert.

    I>U

    Buying parts to hang on your bike is always easier than getting fit.

    If you feel wimpy and weak, get out and train more, ya wee lassie!

    If Jesus had a gun, he'd be alive today!

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR_GRUMPY View Post
    Nobody can fault the statement that Floyd Landis and Tyler Hamilton are both self admitted liars. Can anyone say the same for Saugy??

    People can speculate all they want, but I'm talking about hard facts.
    What hard facts? The lab director saying he didn't do it or the multiple witnesses that say Armstrong told him he did?

    The only thing we seem to know for sure is that Armstrong met with the lab to discuss his test results. That the lab director was part of this says a lot.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 88 rex View Post

    There is no reason to doubt what Saugy is saying though.
    Given the timing, 1 day b4 UCI release I would say there are half a million reasons. Who has the most at stake Landis, Hamiltin ar Saugy?

    You should be more cynical.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR_GRUMPY View Post
    Nobody can fault the statement that Floyd Landis and Tyler Hamilton are both self admitted liars. Can anyone say the same for Saugy??
    It doesn't seem to even be in dispute at this point that Landis and Hamilton are telling the truth. The only real question is if what Armstrong told them was the truth, a lie, or a misunderstanding?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jorgy View Post
    Or Armstrong wanted to intimate he was God to Hamilton and Landis. "Don't worry about testing positive--we can take care of that." I have no doubt there was a lot of bull$hitting and mind games on the Postal bus.
    I had never considered that Armstrong lied to teammates on this issue, making the whole thing up. A bit twisted, but I guess plausible.

  19. #19
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    EPO testing was in its infancy back then. It was first used for the 2000 Sydney Olympics. I'm wondering whether the Lauserne lab had the capacity to do a specific test for EPO, or if they analyzed his blood values? Was it a blood sample, or a urine sample?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR_GRUMPY View Post
    Who is lying......Martial Saugy or Landis and Hamilton.
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    Lance's ego and rampant stupidity 'lied', bragging about the power he had over the process.

    The 'explanation' was provided - detailed on the back of a piece of paper, the front of which resembled a $50,000 check.
    A good habit is as hard to break as a bad one..

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by adimiro View Post
    Not saying they did, but the Laussanne lab does in fact have a good reason to lie...if the test was actually "positive" but was read a "suspicious" for cover up purposes, it would completely undermine their legitimacy. Everyone involved has a self-preservation interest in this mess.
    Yep. Altering/destroying data coming from a lab? The lab has every reason to lie about this.

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