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Thread: Sella = CERA

  1. #1
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    Sella = CERA

    http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/Prim...lla_0508.shtml

    Getting harder to believe in miracles

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigpinkt
    http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/Prim...lla_0508.shtml

    Getting harder to believe in miracles
    There's always the original miracle worker to believe in

    So, Schumacher would seem to be the next likely candidate if exceptional, repeated efforts and results are indicative.

  3. #3
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    Duh!

    It's not like we didn't see that coming! What about some of his CSF-Navigare teammates (ie: Baliani) who were also putting in some ridiculously 'superhuman' efforts during the Giro?
    “The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you've got it made.”
    -Groucho Marx

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    jd3
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    I lkie how they said " highly targeted". It looks like these superhuman efforts are begining to make riders look like an ad for Target.
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?...ug08/aug06news

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    Quote Originally Posted by jd3
    I lkie how they said " highly targeted". It looks like these superhuman efforts are begining to make riders look like an ad for Target.
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?...ug08/aug06news
    Like Ricco, there may have also been indications from his Giro tests that he was using it.

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    One would conclude that Contador has also been tested and would have been tested as soon as the CERA test was approved.
    Zero

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    Quote Originally Posted by giovanni sartori
    One would conclude that Contador has also been tested and would have been tested as soon as the CERA test was approved.
    One would like to think so, especially if there were any anomalies in his Giro tests or biopassport data. It is unfortunate when McQuaid says he can guarantee Contador is clean. I don't think UCI can control test results, but they very well may have significant say over who, when, and how often someone gets tested. One would hope Gripper and the anti-doping people are independent of the "politicians" like McQuaid.

  8. #8
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    Looks like the "Boulder Report" had this one nailed back in May
    http://boulderreport.bicycling.com/2008/05/index.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by godot
    Looks like the "Boulder Report" had this one nailed back in May
    http://boulderreport.bicycling.com/2008/05/index.html
    Who's suspicians weren't raised above normal by Selle's (and his team mates) rides? Hell even McQuaid called them out in the press!

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    Quote Originally Posted by godot
    Looks like the "Boulder Report" had this one nailed back in May
    http://boulderreport.bicycling.com/2008/05/index.html
    Good read, thanks for the post.

  11. #11
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    "It is better to conquer yourself, than to win a thousand battles." -Dhammapada

    "Fact is only what you believe; fact and fiction work as a team." Jack Johnson

    "A true cyclist sometimes has to bite the dust before he can reach the stars.” Laurent Fignon

  12. #12
    haole from the mainland
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    I hope they pressure him enough he admits he was doped during the Giro so his stage wins get taken away.

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    Honestly, this gives me hope.

    I agree that Schumacher probably ought to be paid a midnight visit by the vampires...

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne Barry
    I don't think UCI can control test results, but they very well may have significant say over who, when, and how often someone gets tested.
    It's kind of hard not to test the guy who wears the pink jersey for six days. It's mandatory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by peter1
    Honestly, this gives me hope.

    I agree that Schumacher probably ought to be paid a midnight visit by the vampires...
    He was, yesterday in China.

  16. #16
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    I was a among a handful of posters who were ripping into Sella, and especially that mountain time trial and the extra-human efforts pulled off by CSF-Navigare. First place and three of the top 5 finishers for that team? Yeah right!

    And, not surprisingly, there were a few others that took us to task for doubting CSF. Where are you now? Come out and play.

    So many of us race bikes. We know what it's like to train, what our bodies are capable of, when we're on form, and when we're not. Pros are paid to crush. It's their livelihood. Unlike us amateurs who give racing a backseat to other areas of our lives, this IS their life. They do what they can to kill it, get the contract, and stay employed.

    Therefore, when you see some long time pro suddenly doing thing well, well, well beyond what he was ever capable of in the past, you cannot chalk it up to "a new pedaling style" as Sella did in a post-Giro article. That is just insulting. Where there's fire.... and unfortunately, we see quite a lot of fire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mohair_chair
    It's kind of hard not to test the guy who wears the pink jersey for six days. It's mandatory.
    But the CERA test wasn't ready until after the Giro. How many out of competition tests has Contador received since then? I think that's to what Dwayne Berry was referring.

    I don't think it's safe to assume the UCI's testing is free of political interference. While some national federations (e.g., CONI) appear to be hard liners, Spain's is not one of them. So, I doubt Contador, Valverde, et al. have seen rigorous testing from their national federation.

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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by godot
    Looks like the "Boulder Report" had this one nailed back in May
    http://boulderreport.bicycling.com/2008/05/index.html

    Interesting:

    "I've asked a lot of people how they'd identify suspicious performances in racing and two things keep rising to the top:
    -Beware of guys who come out of nowhere to instant glory and then disappear just as fast (see Rasmussen, Michael). If it seems like they're in the witness protection program and then all of a sudden are winning left and right, you've got to wonder what they're doing on their time off.
    -Beware of performances that seem automatic; the "no bad days" issue. Simply put, that's not how human physiology works. You dig deep and then you need to recover."

  19. #19
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    The CERA test exists now, but it was in development then. I'm sure they ran some of the Giro samples through the unfinished test as test cases. I wonder if they preserved samples for anyone who came back as "interesting," so they could run them through the test when it was ready.

    Also, regardless of whether the Spanish federation tests Contador, he is on Astana, which has the same internal testing system as Columbia, Garmin, and CSC. Make of that what you will, but he is certainly tested more than a lot of other riders.

  20. #20
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    Sella hardly qualifies as a long term pro. He only turned pro four years ago.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mohair_chair

    Also, regardless of whether the Spanish federation tests Contador, he is on Astana, which has the same internal testing system as Columbia, Garmin, and CSC. Make of that what you will, but he is certainly tested more than a lot of other riders.
    No,

    Garmin and Columbia use ACE. Astana and CSC use Damsgaard.

    So far CSC has released some results but Astana has released nothing, and Damsgaard has not commented on Astana publicly either.

  22. #22
    haole from the mainland
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    I'm not defending Rasmussen or saying he's not a doper, but he was formerly World Mtn Biking Champ. And in 2007 he did the Tour of Cali and the Giro; he's obviously not a guy that's going to contend for the spring classics. He wasn't racing a consistent year-round program like, say, Cadel Evans, but he was around and racing prior to the Tour.

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    and in those 4 years he showed nothing that would have indicated he had the potential to do what he did in the Giro this year. When he repeated the day after Pampeago it was certainly a huge red flag. Ricco seemed quite human compared to what he and his teammates pulled out, especially on the Fedaia.

    Coming from the top line doping factories I doubt Contador was/is using CERA. If you have the bucks and connections I would think something along the lines of an oxygen uptake/release modifier, or at least some atypical modification to EPO. According to a prominent biotech researcher a few years ago it's science that can literally be done in the kitchen sink with the right knowledge and there are a lot of kitchen sinks in Russia and China to pump out endless modifications to outrun the testers.
    Last edited by terzo rene; 08-05-2008 at 07:23 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by terzo rene
    Coming from the top line doping factories I doubt Contador was/is using CERA.
    I don't see why autologous blood doping isn't still a viable option for someone with the commitment and money. Still no test and the biopassport has yet to affect anyone, no? The only deterent is if riders have been scared by the threat, but that will diminish if no one is punished by the ADAs for whacky blood parameters.

    I think based on performance and the fact that almost anyone who stands out gets popped, the doping has become much less widespread and restrained by those still using.

    I still think it naive to believe everyone has gone straight. I suspect the ubiquitously mentioned, but rarely tested positive corticosteroids are still in wide use, as well has HgH, probably some "recovery" hormones, and microdosing either EPO and/or autologous blood transfusions.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne Barry
    I don't see why autologous blood doping isn't still a viable option for someone with the commitment and money. Still no test and the biopassport has yet to affect anyone, no? The only deterent is if riders have been scared by the threat, but that will diminish if no one is punished by the ADAs for whacky blood parameters.

    I think based on performance and the fact that almost anyone who stands out gets popped, the doping has become much less widespread and restrained by those still using.

    I still think it naive to believe everyone has gone straight. I suspect the ubiquitously mentioned, but rarely tested positive corticosteroids are still in wide use, as well has HgH, probably some "recovery" hormones, and microdosing either EPO and/or autologous blood transfusions.
    Well autologous transfusions are soon to be detectable, plus there is the issue of storing the blood. Really it requires more support and more of a doping culture to pull off it seems than self injections of EPO and with autologous there is usually a paper trail and doctors involved since the blood needs to be stored for an extended period of time so it would seem it's easier to get caught through non testing methods.

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