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Thread: Chain wax. Yes.

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    Chain-L. 700-800 is the average. Even more in dry conditions.

    So by "getting messy" you mean the chain getting "greasy"? It's as "messy" after 50mi as it is after 500mi.

    Chainring tattoo? Literally the last thing I worry about. The likelyhood... absolute zero. Haven't had one of those since.... can't remember how many years.

    Dropping a chain? Can't remember the last one of those either, probably since the invention of chain catchers. But in the odd event it would happen, it results in grease on thumb and finger... not the whole hand. 2 seconds to wipe it the grass an on your way.
    Same here. Been a while since I've dropped a chain. I have to touch the chain usually when taking off the rear wheel changing a flat, so I use the allen wrench, wipe if off in the grass, and pack a couple of handiwipes to get the road grime off the hands after replacing the tube.

    Chain L rocks! I've got it on the commuter. Picks up dust no worse than the thinner stuff. A small drop on each roller. Wipe off excess after the first ride, and the drivetrain looks pretty clean thereafter. It's super smooth and quiet, doesn't get washed off by rain or wet roads. Wonderful stuff. The wear on the chain is probably about the same rate as with the thinner lubes. In any case not a big concern. 8 speed chains are less than $30. Have a stack of new ones in boxes ready to go!

    I've used wax lubes from a bottle, White Lightening. The chain stays clean, but WTH, the drive train starts feeling rough after the first ride. Too much work to take the chain off and clean it overnight in mineral spirits or whatever and do it right. My chains are replaceable parts, like tires and derailleur cables. I switch them at 3000 mile intervals, just before they start to "stretch." I'm getting 10,000 miles on the cheap 6 speed 13-28 freewheels, $25. Good enough for me. What's not to like? No 32 tooth "climbing gear?"

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by TricrossRich View Post
    what's funny is that you're pretending to be an expert and offering advice on which way is better, without having tried both options. Its like asking someone, "what is better, Pizza or Tacos?" and they tell you, "Pizza, but I've never tried Tacos, but this guy over here had tacos and he said they weren't good, so I think pizza is the best."

    Additionally, do you think I'm standing there watching the wax melt in the slow-cooker for 45 minutes? Have you never used a slow-cooker in your life? You literally plug it in and walk away, go about your business and come back to it when its time to drop the chain in. It takes 10 seconds to plug in and 45 seconds to drop the chain in. Now, if you're suggesting a normal chain lube takes 2-5 minutes, I'd argue that you're not doing it correctly... You're not properly removing old, dirty lube from the chain and then you're not allow the new lube to dry on the chain as per most manufacturer's recommendations... The ones I used, muc-off, Boe-shield T-9, Dumonde Tech, etc... all recommended he chain sit overnight.
    ok fair enough. But I'll wait until I see the overwhelming number of club riders and racers around my area switch from petroleum lube to wax before I'd bother.

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post
    I've used wax lubes from a bottle, White Lightening.
    White Lightning lasts for probably no more than 20 miles. It has about the lubricating properties of water. I'm not fond of wax lubes, but this one has got to be the worst.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post
    on the cheap 6 speed 13-28 freewheels, $25. Good enough for me. What's not to like? No 32 tooth "climbing gear?"
    No comment.
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  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post
    8 speed chains are less than $30.
    So are 11sp chains. Under $20 on sale.
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  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    White Lightning lasts for probably no more than 20 miles. It has about the lubricating properties of water. I'm not fond of wax lubes, but this one has got to be the worst.



    No comment.
    I remember when White Lightening was all the rage. My LBS talked my into trying it and I decided to give it a try for whole bottle's worth. Yea, it will keep your chain clean but if you did not reapply it constantly your chain would squeak. This is one of the few prepared lubes that I have completely written off

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Lauridsen View Post
    Does it matter what weight synthetic oil for the "home brew"?
    Nope. And there's no need to use synthetic. Any non-vegetable oil or gear lube will work fine. The basic principle in home brew is the use of solvent to gain full lube penetration and to flush out the grit/gunk.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post

    I've used wax lubes from a bottle, White Lightening. The chain stays clean, but WTH, the drive train starts feeling rough after the first ride. Too much work to take the chain off and clean it overnight in mineral spirits or whatever and do it right. My chains are replaceable parts, like tires and derailleur cables. I switch them at 3000 mile intervals, just before they start to "stretch." I'm getting 10,000 miles on the cheap 6 speed 13-28 freewheels, $25. Good enough for me. What's not to like? No 32 tooth "climbing gear?"
    To be clear, the OP is not talking about White Lightning or any of the other squirt able wax lubes, he referenced Molten Speed Wax, which is a hot wax lube. I've not tied any other squirt able wax lubes, so I'll hold judgement on them, but I've not heard good things and they are different than what we're talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    ok fair enough. But I'll wait until I see the overwhelming number of club riders and racers around my area switch from petroleum lube to wax before I'd bother.
    I honestly don't think you'll ever see an overwhelming number of riders switch, simply because at first glance, it does seem like more work. I was first told about hot wax lubes 3 years ago, but thought it sounded like a hassle... the prior to last season, I was talking to a couple of the well-respected, fast TT guys in my area and it seemed as if they were all using it. It was like a secret that no one really talked about. I decided to try it. Now, you may doubt if chain is more or less efficient and results in more speed, but I personally think that it does, but that's not honestly why I'd stick with it and not switch back at this point, the other benefits I listed are.... and I ultimately, I don't feel that I spend anymore time on my chain than anyone else, in fact, I find I'm spending less time.
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  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Hmmm. Most motor oils for cars are now much thinner than that. Mike T. lives in Canada, so he probably uses 5W20 or even 0W20. If you are using 20W50, use more mineral spirits like 75%/25%. The idea is that the home brew must be thin enough so it gets inside the rollers. The mineral spirits eventually evaporates and the oil is then inside where it will do some good. Remember that any lube on the outside of your chain only serves one purpose - to collect dirt! So, wipe, wipe, wipe!
    I used a bottle of straight 30 weight mixed 50/50, and when the squirt bottle that I use to apply got about 1/4 down I just added mineral spirits to top it off, and my chain didn't know the difference.
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  9. #59
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    I tried waxing my chains about 30 yrs ago and decided, after maybe 2 or 3 applications that it was a waste. Not only did it flake off the chain leaving wax bits stuck all over the chain stays for the 1st 20\30 miles or so but the chain started squeaking somewhere between 50 to 100 miles.

    But, man, it sure looked dry.

    Oh, and if it rained it would probably start showing surface rust.
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  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    White Lightning lasts for probably no more than 20 miles.
    weird. that's what i've preferred for the last ten years with zero problems. my drive train must be absolutely quiet. (i don't ride in the rain, though.)
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  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    I tried waxing my chains about 30 yrs ago and decided, after maybe 2 or 3 applications that it was a waste. Not only did it flake off the chain leaving wax bits stuck all over the chain stays for the 1st 20\30 miles or so but the chain started squeaking somewhere between 50 to 100 miles.

    But, man, it sure looked dry.

    Oh, and if it rained it would probably start showing surface rust.

    yeah, the mid-80s was the Paraffin Phase for me...tedious effort and way-less-than-acceptable results. not a winning scenario...

    totally satisfied with my current lube and application regimen...every 25-30 rides (~750-850 miles).
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  12. #62
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    [QUOTE=blackfrancois;5212557]weird. that's what i've preferred for the last ten years with zero problems. my drive train must be absolutely quiet. (i don't ride in the rain, though.)[/QUOTE

    Yep. And mine gets abused unmercifully. I will re-apply after each ride if Iím exposing the chain to awful things like salt water. Been using it a few years on the mtb. I like that it kind of builds up, it seems to protect the chain because it gets under water, into snow, covered in muck, you name it... The beach sand alone is brutal, itís like a sandblasting on every ride! Haha! Chain is just fine.

    I switch between bikes from road to mtb, one with Finish Line Dry and one with White Lightening wax and frankly, both chains Work just fine and power the bike. I donít feel any difference at all and I certainly donít think there's a performance difference. I canít imagine it matters all that much in reality, especially for most of us recreational riders.
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  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    So are 11sp chains. Under $20 on sale.
    About time! Good to hear!

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Anybody want to talk about the benefits of wider tires and lower pressures?
    Bah humbug. Another marketing gimmick!

  15. #65
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    [QUOTE=PBL450;5212575]
    Quote Originally Posted by blackfrancois View Post
    weird. that's what i've preferred for the last ten years with zero problems. my drive train must be absolutely quiet. (i don't ride in the rain, though.)[/QUOTE

    Yep. And mine gets abused unmercifully. I will re-apply after each ride if Iím exposing the chain to awful things like salt water. Been using it a few years on the mtb. I like that it kind of builds up, it seems to protect the chain because it gets under water, into snow, covered in muck, you name it... The beach sand alone is brutal, itís like a sandblasting on every ride! Haha! Chain is just fine.

    I switch between bikes from road to mtb, one with Finish Line Dry and one with White Lightening wax and frankly, both chains Work just fine and power the bike. I donít feel any difference at all and I certainly donít think there's a performance difference. I canít imagine it matters all that much in reality, especially for most of us recreational riders.
    It doesn't. Just don't bring it to me when it needs cleaning. Wax is the worst for getting between cogs and into places that make it a royal pain to clean. I will turn away a service bike if it's been lubed w/ WL or wax like we're talking about in this thread...not worth the time.
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  16. #66
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    [QUOTE=cxwrench;5212588]
    Quote Originally Posted by PBL450 View Post

    It doesn't. Just don't bring it to me when it needs cleaning. Wax is the worst for getting between cogs and into places that make it a royal pain to clean. I will turn away a service bike if it's been lubed w/ WL or wax like we're talking about in this thread...not worth the time.
    OK, I promise, pinky swear, I wonít bring you my mtb. LOL.
    Last edited by PBL450; 01-30-2018 at 03:35 AM.
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  17. #67
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    This wax oil debate will go on forever. Here is my take.
    When you melt wax onto two pieces of metal and the wax cools and then you rub the metal pieces together the wax flakes off. Oil sticks and flows. Why in the Hell would you lube anything with wax? I know of no other mechanical devices that use wax as a lubricant. Would you lube a watch with wax? Is anything on a car lubed with wax? A bicycle chain is moving the whole time and the wax is falling off to the ground. It flakes off and does not flow or stick. The only good thing it does is keep your chain clean.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by siclmn View Post
    This wax oil debate will go on forever. Here is my take.
    When you melt wax onto two pieces of metal and the wax cools and then you rub the metal pieces together the wax flakes off. Oil sticks and flows. Why in the Hell would you lube anything with wax? I know of no other mechanical devices that use wax as a lubricant. Would you lube a watch with wax? Is anything on a car lubed with wax? A bicycle chain is moving the whole time and the wax is falling off to the ground. It flakes off and does not flow or stick. The only good thing it does is keep your chain clean.
    Aw man, did you have to come up with that inconvenient truth?

    Waxers will tell you the oil residue on the inadequately cleaned chain would stop wax from soaking into the metal and flake off when riding. But on a pristine clean chain the hot wax melts into the metal "grain" in the rollers, and stays there for 500 miles.

    So who's right?

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by siclmn View Post
    This wax oil debate will go on forever. Here is my take.
    When you melt wax onto two pieces of metal and the wax cools and then you rub the metal pieces together the wax flakes off. Oil sticks and flows. Why in the Hell would you lube anything with wax? I know of no other mechanical devices that use wax as a lubricant. Would you lube a watch with wax? Is anything on a car lubed with wax? A bicycle chain is moving the whole time and the wax is falling off to the ground. It flakes off and does not flow or stick. The only good thing it does is keep your chain clean.
    There aren't many machines that operate at the low temperatures and forces of a bicycle drivetrain. But wax lubricant seems to stick just fine to skis, snowboards and bullets.

    For industrial applications, no one is going to take down a lathe drive to re-wax it. Maybe they would if they were pedaling it, though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    It doesn't. Just don't bring it to me when it needs cleaning. Wax is the worst for getting between cogs and into places that make it a royal pain to clean. I will turn away a service bike if it's been lubed w/ WL or wax like we're talking about in this thread...not worth the time.
    The wax doesn't dissolve in mineral spirits? I haven't tried, but I thought it did.



    Does anyone know if a chain immersed in hot wax for awhile will get clean? It seems like the most attractive feature of wax would be if all you needed to do was the wax bath and not a solvent cleaning first.

    I've used paraffin baths for leather, before. You leave the sheath or whatever in the wax until the temp of the leather is the same as the wax. It changes the leather permanently and the wax doesn't shed after a certain point.

    Given the level of lubrication basic paraffin provides in tests, I'm a little curious.
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  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post

    Waxers will tell you the oil residue on the inadequately cleaned chain would stop wax from soaking into the metal and flake off when riding. But on a pristine clean chain the hot wax melts into the metal "grain" in the rollers, and stays there for 500 miles.

    So who's right?

    Think displacement, and what happens afterwards. Liquids flow, solids do not.

    It really is that simple.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post
    Aw man, did you have to come up with that inconvenient truth?

    Waxers will tell you the oil residue on the inadequately cleaned chain would stop wax from soaking into the metal and flake off when riding. But on a pristine clean chain the hot wax melts into the metal "grain" in the rollers, and stays there for 500 miles.

    So who's right?
    Don't matter, we can take care of our chains as we see fit. But saying that, the waxers are wrong.
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  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuiQuaeQuod View Post
    Think displacement, and what happens afterwards. Liquids flow, solids do not.

    It really is that simple.
    And we have a winner! Best answer in this thread!

    Anybody want to talk about the benefits of wider tires and lower pressures?
    Quote Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post
    Bah humbug. Another marketing gimmick!
    Lower pressures are a marketing gimmick? Last I heard, air is free.
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  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Nooooooo.
    Absolutely-No-Flipping-Way

    I clean my chain infrequently, apply a **** load of Rock an Roll or available lube every couple of weeks, ride the **** out of it and throw it in the trash for a new one about every year..

    The Wax Manufacture states that the lube is good for 200 to 400 miles and then requires another application?? That sounds like a full time job. Some of us have other interests-demands-family-life.. That's just nuts..

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Lower pressures are a marketing gimmick? Last I heard, air is free.
    Not if you're using pure nitrogen as recommended or helium for your weight weenies.!!!!

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