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  1. #51
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    More evidence....

    Security camera footage

    A quote from someone who has seen the tape:

    "The biker is going fast and looks like he is hunched down. He hits the victim dead-on. There is never a moment where he looks like he is trying to slow down,"

    The only thing is that it doesn't show the light -- but there are various things that do not match up with his (the cyclist's) statements -- crosswalk was not busy, etc.

    This is causing enough anger (at the higher levels, not the normal, car-driver anger) that it may cause a serious enforcement level step up.

  2. #52
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    I don't think this guy is going to just get by with community service.
    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...1H44.DTL&tsp=1

  3. #53
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    As a cyclist and driver I can't tell the number of times I've almost turned a city biker into a hood ornament because they just blew thru stop signs/lights. This guy deserves everything thrown at him.

    And more info today...
    Video surveillance footage taken when a bicyclist ran into a 71-year-old pedestrian crossing San Francisco's Castro Street, killing the man, is raising questions about the biker's account of the crash.

    The video shows Sutchi Hui of San Bruno and his wife stepping into the intersection at Castro and Market streets just as Chris Bucchere rides in from the north side, said a law enforcement source who has viewed the footage.

    "The biker is going fast and looks like he is hunched down. He hits the victim dead-on. There is never a moment where he looks like he is trying to slow down," said the source, who spoke on condition of anonymity because police are still investigating the March 29 crash.

    Read more: Video of fatal S.F. crash may contradict bicyclist

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhotonFreak View Post
    I suspect it was a combination of all these things -- probably a light that was probably timed too short for the conditions, pedestrians stepping out a second too early (as they didn't see any cars coming), and an over-eager cyclist (admittedly speeding but probably not so much but by enough to be considered reckless in and of itself) coming into an intersection fast and possibly just missing the signal.

    If it turns out the cyclist did in fact make the yellow light and was guilty of nothing more than speeding, then it probably is the fault of the city for having improperly timed lights. This might be a cause for the victim's family to sue the city, which might happen one way or another if it turns out the cyclist doesn't have any money to go after.
    the yellow lights in SF are pretty short. it helps $FPD write more tickets.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by charlox5 View Post
    the yellow lights in SF are pretty short. it helps $FPD write more tickets.
    Actually that is not correct. Just like all lights in the State of Californa the yellow lights are timed in a specific manner. If you take the first digit in the speed limit in any area then add 1, that is how many seconds the yellow is set for...ie 35mph limit equals 4 second red. I work with SFPD everyday at work and I'll tell you the average beat cop is not real interested in traffic traffic enforcement. With the exception of the officers in the "Traffic Company," motor officers, you have to go out of your way to get a traffic citation.

  6. #56
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    Sucks when your version of the story ("I did everything I could ...") isn't quite reflected on the video ... sounds like the cyclist is (deservedly) in trouble here.
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  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paralizer View Post
    Actually that is not correct. Just like all lights in the State of Californa the yellow lights are timed in a specific manner. If you take the first digit in the speed limit in any area then add 1, that is how many seconds the yellow is set for...ie 35mph limit equals 4 second red. I work with SFPD everyday at work and I'll tell you the average beat cop is not real interested in traffic traffic enforcement. With the exception of the officers in the "Traffic Company," motor officers, you have to go out of your way to get a traffic citation.
    that methodology seems pretty unscientific when AASHTO and ITE have much more complex formulas for timing yellows. Also, i doubt SF has 4 second yellows but I can't confirm that. i could be wrong.

  8. #58
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    Length of yellow doesn't matter when you are traveling so fast you can't stop when people are walking across the street in front of you. Unless the street is blocked off for a race, you must anticipate that cars will pull out of alleys unexpectedly, lights will change and pedestrians will cross streets. Other people's lives depend on our attitudes and decisions.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by charlox5 View Post
    that methodology seems pretty unscientific when AASHTO and ITE have much more complex formulas for timing yellows. Also, i doubt SF has 4 second yellows but I can't confirm that. i could be wrong.
    Not trying to divert the thread or get into a big discussion...my bad the formula I liaised is one we give people to use as a close reference point. It does not get down to the tenth of a second. SF has few extended yellows because the highest percentage of streets have a 25mph limit. But if you want exact numbers and this regulated by DMV...

    http://www.ci.hayward.ca.us/departme...time_specs.pdf

  10. #60
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    does anyone know if he was riding a fixie?

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by cropduster View Post
    does anyone know if he was riding a fixie?
    i don't think so. sounds like he was on a road bike.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by akamp View Post
    He should be prosecuted just the same as drivers who hit and kill cyclists, a quick slap on the wrist if that.
    Pretty much this.
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  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by cropduster View Post
    does anyone know if he was riding a fixie?
    No he wasn't.

  14. #64
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    akamp said: He should be prosecuted just the same as drivers who hit and kill cyclists, a quick slap on the wrist if that.
    Dr. Roebuck said... Pretty much this.
    Wow, pretty callous. The pedestrian was hit in the crosswalk.

    Two wrongs don't make a right -- if you aren't happy that some people who hit a cyclist while driving don't get charged, then do something to change it -- lobby, complain to your local elected board. Please don't act so cavalier about an innocent pedestrian LOSING THEIR LIFE because of the asshattery of another person -- in this case who happened to be riding a bike like a jackass.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrRoebuck View Post
    Pretty much this.

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlakeG View Post
    Wow, pretty callous. The pedestrian was hit in the crosswalk.

    Two wrongs don't make a right -- if you aren't happy that some people who hit a cyclist while driving don't get charged, then do something to change it -- lobby, complain to your local elected board. Please don't act so cavalier about an innocent pedestrian LOSING THEIR LIFE because of the asshattery of another person -- in this case who happened to be riding a bike like a jackass.

    Actually alot of us have complained and so far little has been done.

    While I firmly believe that if it can be proved Chris acted in a negligent manner he needs to be punished, what your seeing from the above comment is likely a reaction to the "hang him high" attitude that alot people are chiming in with while at the same time cars hit and kill/injured peds and cyclists with more frequency and there is less public clamor for punishment and often the punishments are light. Sorry I I don't think Chis needs to be made and example of unless we are going apply the same standard all "accidents".

    Right now tho I think all of us know alot less than we think we do about exactly what happened.

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  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by 32and3cross View Post
    Actually alot of us have complained and so far little has been done.

    While I firmly believe that if it can be proved Chris acted in a negligent manner he needs to be punished, what your seeing from the above comment is likely a reaction to the "hang him high" attitude that alot people are chiming in with while at the same time cars hit and kill/injured peds and cyclists with more frequency and there is less public clamor for punishment and often the punishments are light. Sorry I I don't think Chis needs to be made and example of unless we are going apply the same standard all "accidents".

    Right now tho I think all of us know alot less than we think we do about exactly what happened.

    Cycling Musings: The Bucchere Report
    Why should we descend to to the lowest common denominator? He killed a human being, and should be punished accordingly. He doesn't need to be made an example of. He just needs to be held accountable for his crime, no more and no less.

    If people who commit similar crimes while driving cars are given a pass, we have to vote people into office who don't allow them to get off lightly, stage demonstrations more meaningful than a monthly CM, and keep on top of the issue.

    We shouldn't delegitimize what happened to the poor guy who was merely crossing the street with the green light and got killed.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by sculpin View Post
    Why should we descend to to the lowest common denominator? He killed a human being, and should be punished accordingly. He doesn't need to be made an example of. He just needs to be held accountable for his crime, no more and no less.
    All your doing is making my point for me.

    I never said I thought he should get off light. What I said is that the comment about giving him a slap on the wrist was a reaction to to the calls for a harsh punishment for him when so many drivers are let off with a slap on the wrist.

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by 32and3cross View Post
    All your doing is making my point for me.

    I never said I thought he should get off light. What I said is that the comment about giving him a slap on the wrist was a reaction to to the calls for a harsh punishment for him when so many drivers are let off with a slap on the wrist.
    My apologies, but I guess I am confused.

    You started the paragraph by saying that if he was negligent he should be punished, but you finished the paragraph by saying, "Sorry I I don't think Chis needs to be made and example of unless we are going apply the same standard all "accidents".", after describing how many car drivers are let off with a slap on the wrist for similar crimes, (which would be considered to be getting off light).

    Either he gets punished, or he doesn't get made an example of (which would be getting off light), based on what a car driver would receive for a similar offense.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlakeG View Post
    Wow, pretty callous. The pedestrian was hit in the crosswalk.

    Two wrongs don't make a right -- if you aren't happy that some people who hit a cyclist while driving don't get charged, then do something to change it -- lobby, complain to your local elected board. Please don't act so cavalier about an innocent pedestrian LOSING THEIR LIFE because of the asshattery of another person -- in this case who happened to be riding a bike like a jackass.
    Cyclists are killed everyday by people breaking the law. You do realize that it is the law that vehicles drive a given distance away from a cyclist, in Arizona this is three feet. Why is there no public hangings for people who hit cyclists, either by accident or by sheer stupidity. During the Tour de Tucson a couple of years ago some old fart hit 10 cyclists leaving one in a coma with severe head injuries. The only thing he was ticketed for was leaving the scene of an accident. Sounds like a slap on the wrist to me.


    When I was in college my roommate was killed while cycling by a girl who hit him from behind driving 50 mph in a 30. She said she couldn't see because the sun was in her eyes. Did I mention that when she hit him he was 6 feet to the right of the white line. She was never even ticketed for speeding.

    Also apparently even law enforcement officers could care less about causing any harm to cyclists here in Tucson. During a weekly ride down here a sheriffs deputy was driving towards a large group of cyclist head on. He cut across the opposite lane of traffic and came to a stop only yards in front of the group that was going probably 26,27mph. This caused a fairly large pileup of bikes and riders. Even though this happened a couple of years ago it is still under "internal review"


    While I find it terrible that a man lost his life by some idiot on a bike they don't need to make an example out of the cyclist until they decide to prosecute everyone else who causes harm to either cyclists or pedestrians.

    But that wouldn't be good for the news industry because no one cares when a cyclist is hurt other than the few in the cycling community.

    Although you may think I am a jerk, I could also care less if the cyclist hit the side of a truck, assuming the truck was legal and the cyclist did run the red light which it does sound like he did.

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by akamp View Post
    While I find it terrible that a man lost his life by some idiot on a bike they don't need to make an example out of the cyclist until they decide to prosecute everyone else who causes harm to either cyclists or pedestrians.
    Exactly.
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  22. #72
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    "While I find it terrible that a man lost his life by some idiot on a bike they don't need to make an example out of the cyclist until they decide to prosecute everyone else who causes harm to either cyclists or pedestrians."

    Why the need to 'make an example' out of him? Why not just prosecute him for breaking the law, presuming he did, and put pressure on elected officials to prosecute drivers when they do the same?

    Or do you think a different punishment would be more appropriate?

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by sculpin View Post
    "While I find it terrible that a man lost his life by some idiot on a bike they don't need to make an example out of the cyclist until they decide to prosecute everyone else who causes harm to either cyclists or pedestrians."

    Why the need to 'make an example' out of him? Why not just prosecute him for breaking the law, presuming he did, and put pressure on elected officials to prosecute drivers when they do the same?

    Or do you think a different punishment would be more appropriate?
    I see it as more of a statement about car drivers getting away with murder, seemingly on a daily basis.
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  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrRoebuck View Post
    I see it as more of a statement about car drivers getting away with murder, seemingly on a daily basis.
    Car drivers do seem to get away with murder on a daily basis, and that infuriates me, but I don't think letting this guy get away without harsh punishment (if he is guilty) is a reasonable counter for all the cyclists that have died at the hands of motorists.

  25. #75
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    How many cyclists are killed by pedestrians? Don't you think that's a better argument than bringing in cars, which if I'm not mistaken had nothing to do with this situation? Why bother bringing in cars. I had goldfish when i was a kid. The last ped that was killed by a cyclist in sf -the guy did no time, just probation, etc. he was found 100% at fault.

    I don't know this guy, but I do know the mentality of a lot of cyclists in SF. You can read articles about the wiggle where 20 riders in a row will blow through a stop sign - not a group ride just general elitist asshats that make it more difficult for everyone who tries to do the right thing.

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