Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 63
  1. #1
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: BCSaltchucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,340

    eBikes now outselling all the rest of the bicycles. wow

    in several countries it has been reported (I heard it on GCN this week) eBikes are outselling non-e bikes, including cycling-mad Netherlands and Spain. Expected to overtake global bike sales in a few years.

    This amazes me. Generally in a good way - should mean fewer cars and more of a critical mass (not Critical Mass, LOL) for justifying all the protected bike lanes being created these days, thus defraying the objections of car owners who think the new lanes are an under-utilized waste of roadspace. And perhaps also means that the 99% of ebikes are the regulation-compliant pedal-assist type, not hyper e-motorcycles - ie mass market ebikes instead of DIY hobby projects.

    not sure where they got their data, but here is the GCN video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJEEX72H1Jc

    no, I do not ride an ebike myself

  2. #2
    tlg
    tlg is offline
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: tlg's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    10,152
    Not really hard to believe. I'm sure countries like China are buying them in huge quantities. They already have a giant population of bike and scooter riders. An ebike is more economical than a scooter.


    Custom Di2 & Garmin/GoPro mounts 2013 SuperSix EVO Hi-MOD Team * 2004 Klein Aura V

  3. #3
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    7,660
    Keep in mind that sales are use are not the same thing though.

    I don't doubt ebikes outsell regular bikes in Europe. But bikes last forever and everyone who wants a pedal bike bike in Europe already has one or can find a used one easy. While ebikes are new so anyone wanting one will have to go out and buy it new. I'm over generalizing but I think you'll get the point.

    I've been to Spain recently and anecdotally would say ebikes are no way near as common in use as regular bikes.

  4. #4
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    7,372
    It's good to remember that Europe imposes a 25KPH max speed capability on e-bikes.
    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    in several countries it has been reported (I heard it on GCN this week) eBikes are outselling non-e bikes, including cycling-mad Netherlands and Spain. Expected to overtake global bike sales in a few years.

    This amazes me. Generally in a good way - should mean fewer cars and more of a critical mass (not Critical Mass, LOL) for justifying all the protected bike lanes being created these days, thus defraying the objections of car owners who think the new lanes are an under-utilized waste of roadspace. And perhaps also means that the 99% of ebikes are the regulation-compliant pedal-assist type, not hyper e-motorcycles - ie mass market ebikes instead of DIY hobby projects.

    not sure where they got their data, but here is the GCN video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJEEX72H1Jc

    no, I do not ride an ebike myself

  5. #5
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    4,987
    I have been doing some thinking on the pros and cons of ebikes

    pros:
    - more public cycling awareness
    - more bicycle friendly regulations
    - healthier citizens
    - alloy (ebikes) is more eco friendly than carbon (many road bikes)

    cons:
    - it still has a battery, but I guess battery is still more eco than carbon fiber?
    - there will be rogue people modding their ebikes with a DYI kit for fast joy rides on the trails

    Wouldn't it be something if ebikes kill out the traditional low- to mid- end road bikes. I can definitely see this happening. Will the market consolidate to having mainly ebikes and high end road bikes? How will players like Specialized and Giants react? Will we see a Specialized and Giant ebikes? Giant would be foolish to overlook this.

  6. #6
    hfc
    hfc is offline
    Doesn't like subtitles
    Reputation: hfc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    3,208
    My guess is ebikes are bought more frequently by commuters or business use type person in a country like China. My hope is that one would be bought instead of a motor scooter, so a win for the environment.

  7. #7
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: BCSaltchucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,340
    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    Not really hard to believe. I'm sure countries like China are buying them in huge quantities. They already have a giant population of bike and scooter riders. An ebike is more economical than a scooter.


    interesting you mention China

    China - has banned motorcycles scooters and all those ebikes! OK not a total ban - they have banned them from the 5 largest cities in China, and it is mainly the scooter-like ebikes they are banning (even though they are essentially same as bicycle-type ebikes in terms of performance). It is part of a big move in China to get everyone driving cars - yes cars. The culture there of the ruling elite is that bikes and motorbikes are an annoyance to drivers, and more crucially they make the cities look 'poor' while they are trying to achieve a prestigious modern image for the country. They regularly have roadside stings where they confiscate hundreds of ebikes and motorbikes and scooters, never to be seen again.

    So there is actually a war against 2 wheeled everything in China, ironically. The country which once boasted to be the most bicycle commuting country in the world. Now the roads are rebuilt focused on cars making it unsafe for bicycles, ebikes and motorcycles.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/wadeshe.../#596bdec7141b

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BhDfbUew14

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03lo4b38zpY
    Last edited by BCSaltchucker; 02-24-2017 at 11:06 AM.

  8. #8
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: BCSaltchucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,340
    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    How will players like Specialized and Giants react? Will we see a Specialized and Giant ebikes? Giant would be foolish to overlook this.
    did you cut and paste this from 2005? ;)

  9. #9
    Adorable Furry Hombre
    Reputation: Marc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    24,307
    Not surprising, most people are damned lazy.

    I saw a posting of a guy who had a short hill (as such things go), who wanted an ebike to power up it so he didn't have to sweat. Course he could save $2000USD and be more fit. But, nah, that would take effort.



    Funny how changing the name from "moped" to "ebike" suddenly makes it cool.
    "‘Photograph me on horseback,’ wrote Teddy Roosevelt in 1908. ‘Tennis, no. And golf is fatal.’ "

  10. #10
    Cycling 4 the fun of it.
    Reputation: Cyclist69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    324
    This might seem like a win for cycling. It's not.

    It's just a simpler and cheaper version of what has been destroying our planet and giving, even more people, an excuse to be unhealthy by not doing the work themselves.

    That headline is all about driving up sales.

    If the mortgage brokers say it's a seller's market and you investigate and see, there are about 200 hundred homes for sale in your town. Then it's a buyers market. However, If the brokers, can convince everyone where the market is going. They will be able to keep the housing prices up and generate the profits they and the loan office require.

    If someone tells you that the sky is falling, and you believe it. Then that statement becomes the truth. Same for E-bikes. In no way can these be better for the planet or humans than the simplicity of the design we already have.
    Sycamore Area Cycling

    TREK 2.3c (Road)
    MASI Custom (Coffee Bike)
    Mercier (Gravel Bike)
    Diamondback Overdrive Pro (MTB)

  11. #11
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: BCSaltchucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,340
    Quote Originally Posted by SwiftSolo View Post
    It's good to remember that Europe imposes a 25KPH max speed capability on e-bikes.
    yes EU has 25kph assist limit and 250 watts max

    here in Canada there is a 32kph limit and 500watts. though if you can pedal faster without motor assist the bike is still a bicycle.

    in the US there is the common 20mh and 750 watt maximum IIRC.

    Average BMI higher, thus need more powah

  12. #12
    tlg
    tlg is offline
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: tlg's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    10,152
    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    regular bikes do not work for everyone .. cause people are diverse and different and can't be xpected to become cycling enthusiasts or do their 20km commute on a regular bike, because cities have been planned horribly against the utility of bicycles. Ebikes help bridge that gap.
    Yup. I've been considering getting a scooter the last year or so to commute to work. I do ride my bike sometimes but it's a 17-20mi commute each way. Too much to do every day. And there's a couple sections that just aren't bike friendly.
    I would definitely consider an ebike. Best of both worlds. Less driving my car. More riding a bike.
    Custom Di2 & Garmin/GoPro mounts 2013 SuperSix EVO Hi-MOD Team * 2004 Klein Aura V

  13. #13
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    7,372
    Following your logic, it seems it would be better if we only had 50 lb bicycles to ride because we'd get more exercise.

    The problem is that we'd likely have a substantially reduced percentage of the population riding and getting that exercise.

    The notion that e-bikes provide no exercise is one of ignorance. In fact, they allow folks to ride and get exercise in places where they would not be able to ride at all without some assistance. Grandmothers who were once avid cyclists can now ride in the mountains with their 20 year old grandchildren. The actual outcome is often that these folks now train to extend their range for long rides with their very fit children.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclist69 View Post
    This might seem like a win for cycling. It's not.

    It's just a simpler and cheaper version of what has been destroying our planet and giving, even more people, an excuse to be unhealthy by not doing the work themselves.

    That headline is all about driving up sales.

    If the mortgage brokers say it's a seller's market and you investigate and see, there are about 200 hundred homes for sale in your town. Then it's a buyers market. However, If the brokers, can convince everyone where the market is going. They will be able to keep the housing prices up and generate the profits they and the loan office require.

    If someone tells you that the sky is falling, and you believe it. Then that statement becomes the truth. Same for E-bikes. In no way can these be better for the planet or humans than the simplicity of the design we already have.

  14. #14
    Cycling 4 the fun of it.
    Reputation: Cyclist69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    324
    Ebikes are a fad.

    The first motorcycles were invented from bicycle manufacturers. The scooter came along as a lighter and more efficient alternative to a full-sized motorcycle.

    So, now we are looking for something more efficient than the pedal bicycle?

    The manufacturers believe they have come up with the solution and it's sure to drum up sales for the next few years until it all comes full circle again.

    Meanwhile forgetting we can purchase used a scooter that is better equipped and lower in cost and more powerful.

    Whatever. Sell, Sell, Sell.

    The essence of the bicycle will always remain. History has proven that.
    Sycamore Area Cycling

    TREK 2.3c (Road)
    MASI Custom (Coffee Bike)
    Mercier (Gravel Bike)
    Diamondback Overdrive Pro (MTB)

  15. #15
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    138
    As long as the e-bike sales are not displacing regular bike sales, I see this as a good thing.

    Ebikes are a great way to get people to use something besides a car for around town. I think of them as electric scooters, which I feel are a great thing to encourage.

    These are mostly alternatives to cars, not pedal bikes.

    A good friend of mine owns an bike shop that specializes in e-bikes. Pretty much everyone he sells to are buying them as commuters or errand bikes. A lot are cargo bikes.

    A few people have asked him about MTBs (that is a whole different discussion), but nobody was looking for something to replace a recreational or competitive bike road bike.

  16. #16
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    69
    The consensus seems to be that if Ebikes continue to be marketed toward the commuter / non purist cycling crowd, all is well?


    Ebike local cycling club rides are less than a decade away.


    Technology is the only progressive, everything else... is regressive.


    I'm not a fan of the speed of technology and I'd be a purist but it's hard to not see this happening.

  17. #17
    Adorable Furry Hombre
    Reputation: Marc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    24,307
    Quote Originally Posted by kapusta View Post
    As long as the e-bike sales are not displacing regular bike sales, I see this as a good thing.

    Ebikes are a great way to get people to use something besides a car for around town. I think of them as electric scooters, which I feel are a great thing to encourage.


    These are mostly alternatives to cars, not pedal bikes.

    A good friend of mine owns an bike shop that specializes in e-bikes. Pretty much everyone he sells to are buying them as commuters or errand bikes. A lot are cargo bikes.

    A few people have asked him about MTBs (that is a whole different discussion), but nobody was looking for something to replace a recreational or competitive bike road bike.

    A more realistic way to think of them, in these parts....they're "those" riders marauding down the "NO MOTORIZED VEHICLES" paths at 25MPH.

    Why?


    Because the roads, where motorized vehicles belong, are suicide unless you have a 4000LB steel roll cage....so naturally those same homicidal drivers take their mopeds on the bike paths that are not supposed to have mopeds (or scooters) on them at all.
    "‘Photograph me on horseback,’ wrote Teddy Roosevelt in 1908. ‘Tennis, no. And golf is fatal.’ "

  18. #18
    Cycling Addict
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    3,186
    Quote Originally Posted by kapusta View Post
    As long as the e-bike sales are not displacing regular bike sales, I see this as a good thing.

    Ebikes are a great way to get people to use something besides a car for around town. I think of them as electric scooters, which I feel are a great thing to encourage.

    These are mostly alternatives to cars, not pedal bikes.

    A good friend of mine owns an bike shop that specializes in e-bikes. Pretty much everyone he sells to are buying them as commuters or errand bikes. A lot are cargo bikes.

    A few people have asked him about MTBs (that is a whole different discussion), but nobody was looking for something to replace a recreational or competitive bike road bike.
    This is not what I am seeing among our customers. In my experience, only about 15% of e-bike customers are commuters (so far) - the rest are looking for an easy way to get a little exercise. Some are hunters who are looking for an easier way to get up into the gated off mountain hunting areas.

    That being said, even though our boss has bought heavily into the e-bike kool-aid, they are not yet making up even 10% of our sales.
    Life is short... enjoy the ride.

  19. #19
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    138
    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    A more realistic way to think of them, in these parts....they're "those" riders marauding down the "NO MOTORIZED VEHICLES" paths at 25MPH.

    Why?


    Because the roads, where motorized vehicles belong, are suicide unless you have a 4000LB steel roll cage....so naturally those same homicidal drivers take their mopeds on the bike paths that are not supposed to have mopeds (or scooters) on them at all.
    A fair concern, though I find the biggest menace on shared multi-use urban pathways to be Stravatards, not e-bikes.

    Snark aside, though, I do think you bring up the real problem with low-power scooters in general: they are supposed to ride in traffic, but are usually too slow to keep up with it. It will be interesting to see if ebikes run into the same problem.

  20. #20
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    138
    Quote Originally Posted by bradkay View Post
    This is not what I am seeing among our customers. In my experience, only about 15% of e-bike customers are commuters (so far) - the rest are looking for an easy way to get a little exercise. Some are hunters who are looking for an easier way to get up into the gated off mountain hunting areas.

    That being said, even though our boss has bought heavily into the e-bike kool-aid, they are not yet making up even 10% of our sales.
    I imagine a lot of this depends on location and the local culture. Ithaca, NY is not your average city.

  21. #21
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    420
    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Funny how changing the name from "moped" to "ebike" suddenly makes it cool.
    No, what it actually did was make it legal to ride them on non motorized bike paths. The legislation in the individual states has been or will be changed to remove ebikes from a "motor vehicle" classification and also from being considered motorized giving them the same equivalency as a bicycle.

  22. #22
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    7,372
    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    did you cut and paste this from 2005? ;)
    It could have been as late as 2008.

  23. #23
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: BCSaltchucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,340
    another tidbit - While back I was perusing the website of this hotel in Italy which specializes in catering to bike enthusiasts. They do road ride guiding help you get to know the area. But they also offer ebikes for the non-cyclist spouses to join in on the rides. Interesting idea. So the wife isn't left to fend for herself all day while the boys go play I guess

  24. #24
    a real member's member
    Reputation: blackfrancois's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    2,842
    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Not surprising, most people are damned lazy.
    well, if you're commuting to work in a suit, i can understand trying to avoid overheating.

    Funny how changing the name from "moped" to "ebike" suddenly makes it cool.
    no.

    mopeds and scooters are still cool.
    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

  25. #25
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    7,372
    I've done quite a bit of riding in the Dolomites with some ebikers.

    It's a bit of a reach to suggest that non-cyclists are going to ride very far on ebikes. The ebikers always train with us before the trips to get strong enough to do 5 to 6000 vertical on a single battery charge. A non-cyclists ass would take weeks to heal.

    The ebikes do permit weaker riders to stay with much stronger riders on the numerous mountain passes in the alps and dolomites (up to roughly 5500' of climbing for a moderately fit recreational rider on a good e-bike).
    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    another tidbit - While back I was perusing the website of this hotel in Italy which specializes in catering to bike enthusiasts. They do road ride guiding help you get to know the area. But they also offer ebikes for the non-cyclist spouses to join in on the rides. Interesting idea. So the wife isn't left to fend for herself all day while the boys go play I guess

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Rest Day Review! TdF 2015 Jul 21 rest day discussion. SPOILERS.
    By PJay in forum Pro Cycling - Tour de France
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 07-21-2015, 05:18 PM
  2. How much rest is enough?
    By biggunnz in forum General Cycling Discussion
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 01-17-2014, 09:37 PM
  3. eBikes
    By bikerjulio in forum General Cycling Discussion
    Replies: 42
    Last Post: 08-24-2013, 04:54 PM
  4. A day rest before FTP?
    By zone5 in forum Coaching
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 07-08-2013, 03:30 PM
  5. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 06-15-2013, 10:15 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •