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  1. #1
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    Reach to bars too long.

    Hey guys!

    I've been reading these forums for a long time, but always managed to never need to post due to the questions other people asked or answers other people gave, so thanks for the help over the years.

    Anyway, todays issue.

    When i bought this bike the handlebars were angled downwards and hoods were attached before the drop and angled upwards (like the bike pictured below)

    Reach to bars too long.-img_0282.jpg

    I've ridden it for a few thousand K's and got used to it.
    The other day i used a bike fit app and realised how un-level the bar-hood situation was so i leveled them out and now my reach has become ridiculous.

    Is this something i can remedy by moving my saddle forward a smidge, getting a shorter stem (mine is 100mm) and possibly shorter bars (are they even a thing?)

    My bars are currently 130mm to the drops.
    Reach to bars too long.-img_20170414_084758.jpg


    I've read that having a short stem will affect handling, but if my previous set up was a certain distance, having a short stem and the hoods in this position should feel the same as what i was used to, right?

    Thanks!

    Reach to bars too long.-screenshot_20170413-152641.jpgReach to bars too long.-screenshot_20170413-152727.jpg
    Last edited by Calam; 04-13-2017 at 02:52 PM.

  2. #2
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    Don't move the seat, shorter stem or new bars with shorter reach!
    I run a real short stem due to I am old on a young mans bike.
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  3. #3
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    Why do you think your reach to the bars is too long?

    Here's a way to determine if your reach to the bars is too long:

    From the photo of the rider in the photo, notice where the hands rest-nice and fully on the brake hoods. Typical rider will spend 70% of their time with their hands in this position. If you find that during a ride you're grasping the bars shy of the photo illustration then yes, your reach is too long. I've seen people who spend a lot of time with their hands farther up the bars/ away from the hoods-dead giveaway.

    From the photo, it looks like the brake levers are too low on the bars. That will make the reach seem excessive. Try changing their position, starting with the tips of the levers flush with the bottom of the bars. And start with the bottom of the bars parallel to the ground. Leave the bar position alone, but move the levers up the bars until something clicks. I think your problem lies with the shape of the brake hoods and the transition from the bars to the levers. A change in brake lever position will cure that.

    It will help to strip off the handlebar tape and leave it off until you're satisfied with the fit, or just kludge it in place with electrical tape until you're done; I don't care if it takes SEVERAL rides to iron out your position.

  4. #4
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    Thanks for the tips.

    I just feel very heavy on my hands and like my pelvis is tilted too far forward to try to reach them.

    Are you suggesting to rotate my bars clockwise as pictured to get the bottom of the drops level with the ground? Then move my hoods further up the bars, sort of how it looks in the first picture?

    I think i will definitely leave the bar tape off for a while until I get this sorted so i can play around with it a little bit.

    Do you guys think my saddle height and knee angle looks alright?

  5. #5
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    move your seat back.

    try

  6. #6
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    Your bars to hoods looks level. If you move your brakes up the bars, you will have a transistion like the bike in the first picture, where the flat part is the bars and the hoods sit rising from your thumb first finger split.
    Just depends on your preference.
    You do look like your reaching uncomfortably.
    I like the flat transition, so I would go with the setup you have and either get shorter reach bars or shorter stem.
    If you can ride the otherway, all you need to do is move it and see if you like it. I bet you will not.
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  7. #7
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    Move the shifters back up higher on the bars - they are too low, I agree with Peter P. Ride it for a couple weeks and see how it feels. Don't rotate the bars, they look fine as is, rotating will make the drops point down too much I think.
    Moderation is boring - do epic s##t

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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by duriel View Post
    I run a real short stem due to I am old on a young mans bike.
    Hehe, same here

  9. #9
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    Try resting a 12" ruler against the bottom tube of the bar so it extends out towards the front, then adjust the levers so the bottom tip just touches the ruler. This is a good baseline position that ensures one can still reach the levers while in the drops and not put the wrist in an awkward angle when riding on the hood. Adjust by rotating the bar instead of moving the levers.

    Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

  10. #10
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    On The Beast, the levers sit too high on the bars or the levers are just too high because the bars are rotated so the ends point down.

    Start with the bottom of the bars parallel to the ground and the tips of the levers as nova_rider explains.

  11. #11
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    I'm assuming your bike is the S-Works, not the BeastMode. In either case, I think its a problem of bar shape, not necessarily size. That looks like an SL2, maybe SL3 S-Works and Specialized sold a lot of those bikes with their Ergo bend bars which were sort of a mid-way point between a traditional bend and the current style of compact bend bars. A friend of mine had picked up an older Allez for a second bike and he had the same bars and tried to do exactly the same thing as your trying to do because he didn't want to buy new bars... he never had much luck. Here's an image showing the different shapes.



    Your bars are more like the middle ones... and I'd say that most current compact bars currently even have the top reach portion straight out, as opposed to angling down. Personally, I just think you're not keen on the shape of the bars you have.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by TricrossRich View Post
    I'm assuming your bike is the S-Works, ...I just think you're not keen on the shape of the bars you have.
    I will agree that the bars could be a contributing factor. I was hesitant to offer that as a cause however, because I am not inclined to blame the equipment first.

    Now that someone else has said it, I'll come out of the closet!

  13. #13
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    Calam...it would be a mistake to move your saddle to adjust reach (if it's set relatively well). Stem length and/or bar reach would be the way to go for me. Changing a stem to a 90 isn't a big deal and the easiest/least work to swap. You may or may not notice any change in handling.

    If you have reservations about a shorter stem then look for a bar with a touch shorter reach. Search compact bars...Looks like you are riding the 3T Ergosum bar which has a reach of 89mm and a drop of 128mm. The 3T Ergonova has a reach of 77mm for example. FSA, Easton and Deda all have compact bars with reaches right around 77-80mm IIRC.

  14. #14
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    I recently changed my stem for a slightly shorter one and have been very happy with the resulting difference in reach and feel.

  15. #15
    Corey213
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calam View Post
    Thanks for the tips.

    I just feel very heavy on my hands and like my pelvis is tilted too far forward to try to reach them.

    Are you suggesting to rotate my bars clockwise as pictured to get the bottom of the drops level with the ground? Then move my hoods further up the bars, sort of how it looks in the first picture?

    I think i will definitely leave the bar tape off for a while until I get this sorted so i can play around with it a little bit.

    Do you guys think my saddle height and knee angle looks alright?
    Hey Calam, you may want to look into a shallow flare bar. Bontrager has some that the reach is shorter which I think is exactly what you are looking for.

    https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/e...vr-sf/p/14838/

    I've used them and talked to some others and they are much more comfortable.

  16. #16
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    Age has nothing to do with it. Flexibility does.
    If your opinion differs from mine, ..........Too bad.
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  17. #17
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    What brand and series of components do you have? Older Shimano stuff you could adjust reach to levers with shims, newer Shimano stuff there is a reach adjustment screw you can use to bring the levers in a bit. Depending on the version you have to be careful, the plastic version of the screw is a little brittle (replaced mine with the metal ones).

    This isn't say the other things you are considering to adjust might not be better, but if you're just talking about the levers feeling a little too far away, look into this.

  18. #18
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    If it were me, I'd just put the whole set up back to the way you liked it. The position of the hoods on the bars should be based on overall comfort, not some "fit app" or aesthetics.

    And like others said, don't move your saddle to adjust reach, you adjust it for position over the pedals. That's a basic rule of bike fit. If your app tells you to move the saddle to adjust reach - or doesn't tell you not to - it's a poor app.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodys737 View Post
    Calam...it would be a mistake to move your saddle to adjust reach (if it's set relatively well). Stem length and/or bar reach would be the way to go for me. Changing a stem to a 90 isn't a big deal and the easiest/least work to swap. You may or may not notice any change in handling.

    If you have reservations about a shorter stem then look for a bar with a touch shorter reach. Search compact bars...Looks like you are riding the 3T Ergosum bar which has a reach of 89mm and a drop of 128mm. The 3T Ergonova has a reach of 77mm for example. FSA, Easton and Deda all have compact bars with reaches right around 77-80mm IIRC.
    Wow you're good! Yes it's the 3T ergosum bar. I have no idea how you could know that just from looking at it!

    For others who have asked it is an SL4 and running 10 speed dura ace di2. I think it's 7970.


    I think I'll drop down to a 90mm stem and get some compact bars. It'll result in approx 3cm shorter reach but that's ok as the current set up has my weight about 5-6cm In front of the contact point of my tyre.

    Also from my years of browsing I hate seeing when so many good ideas are out forward and the op never reports back on their solution haha.

    Pics to follow when I get my gear ;)
    Last edited by Calam; 04-14-2017 at 02:19 PM.

  20. #20
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    Forgot to mention Specialized since you are riding a Specialized. They have some bars with 75mm reach and alloy for under $50 if you are trying to keep cost down. Check them out HERE.

  21. #21
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    You are *way* stretched out. Here are my thoughts:

    -Zipp service course 70 handlebar. 70 reach. Inexpenisve.
    -Shorter stem. How much shorter? A lot. None of us can tell you that without seeing you on it.
    -Point that stem to the sky. My guess is you never ever use your drops, based on handlebar alignment and how low you are in the hoods. Get your hoods in a place where it feels ride-all-day comfortable. Go to the drops when you want to get after it. Embrace being a middle aged inflexible white guy, or start going to yoga.
    -I'm guessing your saddle is a bit high, but it's only a guess, I'd need to see you at point of terminal extension to know for sure.
    -Your bike won't look as cool. But the only time you care about that is when it's in your garage.

    Honestly, it really seems like you need to get a fit from a fitter, not an app. Someone who can set your saddle where it needs to be. Someone who can try different length/rise stems for you. If you plan on riding with any sort of regularity, it would probably be well worth the money.

    *full disclosure, I fit bikes

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR_GRUMPY View Post
    Age has nothing to do with it. Flexibility does.
    True.

    Reach to bars too long.-168d299af31b41e2a3feea9a2c468c2f.jpg

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Camilo View Post
    If it were me, I'd just put the whole set up back to the way you liked it. The position of the hoods on the bars should be based on overall comfort, not some "fit app" or aesthetics.

    And like others said, don't move your saddle to adjust reach, you adjust it for position over the pedals. That's a basic rule of bike fit. If your app tells you to move the saddle to adjust reach - or doesn't tell you not to - it's a poor app.

    The part in bold is the answer to this thread.

    Regarding not moving the saddle to adjust reach. That's generally true and the good default answer however it not a hard and fast 'rule'. If a rider moves the bars for a more aggressive position they likely would want to move the seat forward a little bit accordingly.
    And I don't mean an arbitrary move of the bars but because the rider became more flexible, or changed from riding centuries to riding crits, or whatever logical reason (as opposed to for aesthetics or whatever arbitrary reason as seem the case in this thread).

    The proof (for lack of a better word) of this is the general fact that frames with really short head tubes tend to come with 75ish seat angles and high head tube frames will be 73ish. If we assume frame designers know what they're doing this illustrates that a more aggressive position calls for a more forward seat. A more extreme example is to compare the seat tube angle of a TT bike to a beach cruiser.

  24. #24
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    Bars with shorter reach or a shorter stem is likely the answer

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    The proof (for lack of a better word) of this is the general fact that frames with really short head tubes tend to come with 75ish seat angles and high head tube frames will be 73ish. If we assume frame designers know what they're doing this illustrates that a more aggressive position calls for a more forward seat. A more extreme example is to compare the seat tube angle of a TT bike to a beach cruiser.
    The seat tube angle on a racing bike is 75 cause you can make the chain stays shorter for quicker handling. Most run setback seatposts with racing bikes. Don't even go into TT bikes, they are setup for minimum aero drag and riding straight courses and handle like crappo.
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