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  1. #26
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    No. Not until a utopia wherein traffic follows all the rules, as though a driving instructor is in the front seat, and the driver's license is on the line.

    Until then, a road is the best option for us. Act and ride predictably and responsibly. You'll never win in a fight with a 3500lb car, so even though the law may be on our side as cyclists, it's on us to pretend that everyone's out to get us.
    I lost my phone number. Can I have yours?

  2. #27
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    We are riding with our backs facing them, unable to see the danger.
    That one, at least, is easily solved with a radical new high-tech invention known as a "mirror." Mine work great.
    We are far from pefect,
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    We are bruised, we are broken,
    But we are goddamn works of art
    Works of art

  3. #28
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    I don't ride on the roads alone anymore. I have too much to lose and too many drivers are oblivious to their surroundings / incompetent / *******s. I'll ride in groups on the road, my logic being that at least we're much more noticeable.

    Luckily for me, I have an alternative: I have a crushed limestone MUP network right near my house with 100+ miles of trails. The trails are generally completely vacant early in the morning or when the temperature is below about 50. I have both geared and single speed bikes for riding the trails. I'll gladly ride the trails alone, they're terrific. I did 30 miles on the MUP today at road pace and saw two people the entire ride. I caught a great sunrise to boot.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCavilia View Post
    That one, at least, is easily solved with a radical new high-tech invention known as a "mirror." Mine work great.
    Not to make light of the situation, but does a driver that's about to hit you look radically different in a mirror than a driver that's about to pass you three feet away? I can never seem to tell the difference myself.

    Or is it more useful for simply changing lanes or turning off the road?

  5. #30
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    Bikes aren't really compatible with anything (hikers, horses, rollerbladers, etc.) and the behavior of some cyclists would be infuriating if you're stuck behind them in a car (so be responsible out there!) . I think our best bet is to hope gas gets back to 4-5$ per gallon, life on the road was easier back then.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmach View Post
    Who came first? The bike or the car?
    I hate to burst your bubble, but the bike was here first

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by factory feel View Post
    We're small, they're big and heavy. They go much faster than us.

    They can text and be drunk or high when we are mostly sober and focused.

    They zoom past us within a few feet or sometimes inches.


    As a society, more bicycle trails are needed.

    That is all.
    just get a mountain bike then. wife and I spent most of the winter on MTB, only now transitioning back to summery road riding. generally courteous drivers here. But there are hit&runs every year, even here...

    Teen cyclist might have been deliberately struck by motorist, witness says

    I look forward to the day human-driven cars are finally outlawed.
    Last edited by BCSaltchucker; 04-25-2017 at 09:35 AM.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    just get a mountain bike then. wife and I spent most of the winter on MTB, only now transitioning back to summery road riding. generally courteous drivers here. But there are hit&runs every year, even here...

    Teen cyclist might have been deliberately struck by motorist, witness says

    I look forward to the day human-driven cars are finally outlawed.
    There is definitely cause for concern as has been suggested by these posts. And the article about the deliberate road rage against a biker who is doing all they can to stay clear of drivers makes me want to do things to that driver that would incarcerate me for many years.
    However, we will keep on riding and cars aren’t going away any time soon—hence he need to maintain a peaceful co-existence. One thing that was only mentioned briefly is that this dance takes two, and bikers need to also be understanding of their own behavior on city/busy roads. Way too often do I see bikers who think they own the road, and that angers drivers as much as overly aggressive drivers anger bikers. I am fortunate to live in an area where I can find open country roads very close to my home where I can ride almost unfettered for many miles. But if to get to those roads I need to traverse a busy 4-lane city boulevard with no shoulder, I will NOT ride in a lane like I own it and assume all motor vehicles can “just go around me”. I try my best to stay out of the way and not force drivers to swing into other lanes or slow to 5 MPH for a quarter mile due to my blocking traffic. I will ride that ¼ mile on the sidewalk or as close to the edge of the lane as is safe, well before I will ride in the middle of a traffic lane, and IMHO, I feel all bikers should try their best to avoid "conflict" until they can get to a road with a shoulder or one lightly traveled. I truly love to ride but I also need to drive, so I try and act accordingly with both modes of transport. I am equally disdainful of the jerk in a car who does not give me a wide berth when they have room as I am of the group ride who tools through the city for 2-3 miles at 10 MPH with 24 riders taking up 1.3 lanes of a busy two-lane rode.

    Since bikers will still bike, and drivers will still drive, I say let’s do everything we can to stay cordial on “both sides of the street”

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    just get a mountain bike then. wife and I spent most of the winter on MTB, only now transitioning back to summery road riding. generally courteous drivers here. But there are hit&runs every year, even here...

    Teen cyclist might have been deliberately struck by motorist, witness says

    I look forward to the day human-driven cars are finally outlawed.
    The sooner we get flying cars, the sooner we'll have the roads to ourselves! I do see some real benefits to collision avoidance technology and self-driving cars. Although not perfect, computers don't get drunk, or text, or purposely intimidate cyclists

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    The sooner we get flying cars, the sooner we'll have the roads to ourselves! I do see some real benefits to collision avoidance technology and self-driving cars. Although not perfect, computers don't get drunk, or text, or purposely intimidate cyclists
    oops, wrong place.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by chembio View Post
    There is definitely cause for concern as has been suggested by these posts. And the article about the deliberate road rage against a biker who is doing all they can to stay clear of drivers makes me want to do things to that driver that would incarcerate me for many years.
    However, we will keep on riding and cars aren’t going away any time soon—hence he need to maintain a peaceful co-existence. One thing that was only mentioned briefly is that this dance takes two, and bikers need to also be understanding of their own behavior on city/busy roads. Way too often do I see bikers who think they own the road, and that angers drivers as much as overly aggressive drivers anger bikers. I am fortunate to live in an area where I can find open country roads very close to my home where I can ride almost unfettered for many miles. But if to get to those roads I need to traverse a busy 4-lane city boulevard with no shoulder, I will NOT ride in a lane like I own it and assume all motor vehicles can “just go around me”. I try my best to stay out of the way and not force drivers to swing into other lanes or slow to 5 MPH for a quarter mile due to my blocking traffic. I will ride that ¼ mile on the sidewalk or as close to the edge of the lane as is safe, well before I will ride in the middle of a traffic lane, and IMHO, I feel all bikers should try their best to avoid "conflict" until they can get to a road with a shoulder or one lightly traveled. I truly love to ride but I also need to drive, so I try and act accordingly with both modes of transport. I am equally disdainful of the jerk in a car who does not give me a wide berth when they have room as I am of the group ride who tools through the city for 2-3 miles at 10 MPH with 24 riders taking up 1.3 lanes of a busy two-lane rode.

    Since bikers will still bike, and drivers will still drive, I say let’s do everything we can to stay cordial on “both sides of the street”
    Well said! Yes, it takes two to tango.

    Interestingly enough, in DC years past, motorists were unwilling to accomodate bicycles in groups taking the lane. They honked, tailgated, and passed dangerously close. Can't remember any hits, but the anxiety and hostility was always there.

    Out in Longview and Tyer, TX, the two bike clubs stayed on the shoulders, if there was one, called "car back" and got over single file so cars could pass. We were accommodated quite well, like the owner of the fast food stop we refreshed our water bottles who'd say, "Here's the Tour de France!"

    Generally speaking, we make our own nests. Ride like a holes, we'll be treated like a holes. Show respect and we get respect back. Once that occurs, motorists look out for us as a legitimate, normal, component of the traffic mix, no problem.
    Last edited by Fredrico; 04-25-2017 at 07:45 PM.

  12. #37
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    Ballan, we have a problem.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoWu View Post
    I hate to burst your bubble, but the bike was here first
    The car was first! Haven't you seen the documentary series called "The Flintstones?"
    Ballan, we have a problem.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoWu View Post
    I hate to burst your bubble, but the bike was here first
    Idiots on their high wheelers terrorized all the folks out walking and driving their horse drawn carriages for a couple of decades until cars came along.

    Trains were faster than them all until the interstates, really. But at one point, bicycles were the fastest vehicles on the roads.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlatlandRoller View Post
    Bikes aren't really compatible with anything (hikers, horses, rollerbladers, etc.) and the behavior of some cyclists would be infuriating if you're stuck behind them in a car (so be responsible out there!) . I think our best bet is to hope gas gets back to 4-5$ per gallon, life on the road was easier back then.

    No it wasn't. Gasoline is inelastic.

    https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=19191
    "‘Photograph me on horseback,’ wrote Teddy Roosevelt in 1908. ‘Tennis, no. And golf is fatal.’ "

  16. #41
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    The other day I came to an intersection that traffic was being routed around due to a little league(baseball) parade. Cars pulling trailers with the different teams being cheered by the neighbors and well wishers.
    They were slow enough moving with enough room between following vehicles that I could pass through without disrupting anything, so I asked the guy re-routing traffic if I could pass through and he snarled a No wait till they pass. Okay, no problem.
    Seeing as there was no oncoming traffic to the parade I rode towards the rear of the parade to cross around the last float without disrupting things.

    The kids on the floats were throwing candy and trinkets to the well wishers and as I road past they started intentionally pelting me with the treats. Once it started it continued, float to float, laughing and aimed fire, so to speak.

    So was this just kids being kids, or kids who will one day be young adults terrorizing cyclists as they drive past in their cars?

    If it's the 2nd option, it will take a coupe or few generations before we are universally accepted on the roads, if ever, no matter our good and courteous habits.
    Too old to ride plastic

  17. #42
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    There's a funny things about folks getting permits to hold special events--say like the tour de france. Once you have the permit you kind of expect people to have enough common sense not to crash the event. Have you considered riding your bike through the Macy's Parade? I'm pretty sure you'd get the kind of welcome you deserve.

    For these kids, that parade was likely important enough to expect people to show some respect. I understand that, for the self absorbed, nothing deserves respect.
    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    The other day I came to an intersection that traffic was being routed around due to a little league(baseball) parade. Cars pulling trailers with the different teams being cheered by the neighbors and well wishers.
    They were slow enough moving with enough room between following vehicles that I could pass through without disrupting anything, so I asked the guy re-routing traffic if I could pass through and he snarled a No wait till they pass. Okay, no problem.
    Seeing as there was no oncoming traffic to the parade I rode towards the rear of the parade to cross around the last float without disrupting things.

    The kids on the floats were throwing candy and trinkets to the well wishers and as I road past they started intentionally pelting me with the treats. Once it started it continued, float to float, laughing and aimed fire, so to speak.

    So was this just kids being kids, or kids who will one day be young adults terrorizing cyclists as they drive past in their cars?

    If it's the 2nd option, it will take a coupe or few generations before we are universally accepted on the roads, if ever, no matter our good and courteous habits.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwiftSolo View Post
    There's a funny things about folks getting permits to hold special events--say like the tour de france. Once you have the permit you kind of expect people to have enough common sense not to crash the event. Have you considered riding your bike through the Macy's Parade? I'm pretty sure you'd get the kind of welcome you deserve.

    For these kids, that parade was likely important enough to expect people to show some respect. I understand that, for the self absorbed, nothing deserves respect.
    Dude, I showed plenty of respect. I didn't crash the parade and rode on the side of the road that wasn't closed off. I am not self absorbed and did nothing to infringe on the parade, but off course you have your own opinion and So What.
    Too old to ride plastic

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    Dude, I showed plenty of respect. I didn't crash the parade and rode on the side of the road that wasn't closed off. I am not self absorbed and did nothing to infringe on the parade, but off course you have your own opinion and So What.
    Heck no, man. Those kids knew you were trying to get through their parade and were retaliating with the candy.

    Or gosh, maybe they though you were a Tour rider out training and were showering you with fast calories so you could have a nice ride home, eh? Grade school kids, right?

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    So was this just kids being kids, or kids who will one day be young adults terrorizing cyclists as they drive past in their cars?
    first, it's a mob mentality. they felt safe (and obvious joy) disrespecting you in their numbers.

    people wonder why individuals might snap and just go postal one day. they shouldn't really wonder though.
    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    Dude, I showed plenty of respect.
    No, you didn't. Riding through/with parade was disrespectful to the event, its participants, the individuals there to watch it, and its organizers. The current ego-centric world view probably allows one to justify the conduct.

    You were not part of an organization participating in the parade. You had no business being in it. You had choices: wait for the parade to end, walk on the sidewalk around it, ride your bike on a different route, or watch the parade. But, no. You chose the "I am more important and refuse to be inconvenienced by this public event" choice and rode through the parade.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by crit_boy View Post

    No, you didn't. Riding through/with parade was disrespectful to the event, its participants, the individuals there to watch it, and its organizers. The current ego-centric world view probably allows one to justify the conduct.

    You were not part of an organization participating in the parade. You had no business being in it. You had choices: wait for the parade to end, walk on the sidewalk around it, ride your bike on a different route, or watch the parade. But, no. You chose the "I am more important and refuse to be inconvenienced by this public event" choice and rode through the parade.
    Dude, what the heck are you talking about?

    I didn't ride through the parade, I went around it. The parade was going south and I went north to go around the tail end of it.

    I did not impact the parade or the spectators or infringe on anyones enjoyment.
    Too old to ride plastic

  23. #48
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    Sounds like you peed on their Parade. Way to go.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    I didn't ride through the parade, I went around it.
    Still, it was insensitive to even ASK if you could crash the parade. (But goodonya to do the asking, at least.)

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    Dude, what the heck are you talking about?

    I didn't ride through the parade, I went around it. The parade was going south and I went north to go around the tail end of it.

    I did not impact the parade or the spectators or infringe on anyones enjoyment.
    You originally wrote the candy pelting continued from "float to float" as you "road past" (spelling errors in original). Either your original story was wrong or you are now changing it.

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