View Poll Results: Will you join me in calling out riders who are unsafe?

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30. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, because I love cycling and America

    13 43.33%
  • Yes, and I promise to use nice language too

    11 36.67%
  • No because I am spineless

    5 16.67%
  • No because I have no vocal cords, and anyway, fight the power.

    1 3.33%
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  1. #1
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    when auto drivers "wave you through" an intersecion

    That's a nice gesture.

    But.

    In some situations it's dangerous and scary.

    I'm thinking of a few of the rogue / quasi-racer group rides that blow thru stop signs, red lights, taking a large group into a left turn in front of oncoming traffic... etc... these herd mentalities have sort of "trained" the drivers into just stopping when they see a group.

    It's really kind of sad... as individuals, every one of these riders will assert their right to be on the road, and that they are "safe" riders. But put them on somebody's wheel and they'll blindly follow into danger. Put them at the front of a group and they will take a risk with no concern at all for the riders behind them.

    I know, I know, that's just how hammerfest rides behave. Well I reject that. I call people out. By name, if I know it. If not, it's "hey dude in the Rapha kit on the Cervelo, you're supposed to stop for stop signs... you're endangering everybody here when you blow through like that. "

    Humans are herd animals. We have to call each other out; silence is assent.

    Will you join me in naming and shaming riders who screw things up for the rest of us?
    * posted by Creakybot 2013 all rights reserved.
    * not actually waterproof.

  2. #2
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    What is your question????????????????

  3. #3
    Fecal indicator
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    no. well maybe, it depends, but probably not...
    eff all y'all...

  4. #4
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    This OP started on one topic, but went through about 4 more before getting to the point at the end... which in no way was related to the title.

    Drivers waving people through is more to do with the type of driver than the riders. I agree that people should obey traffic laws (within reason, I am not saying I stop at every sign on my 5 am ride when no one is in site in any direction) but that will not change drivers waving someone else through when they have the right of way and creating a confusing and possibly dangerous situation. Typically when I am being waved through, and the other car clearly has the right of way, I just sit there. I am not going to pay the price when they change their mind and run me over.
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  5. #5
    RoadBikeReview Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creakyknees View Post
    quasi-racer group rides that blow thru stop signs, red lights, taking a large group into a left turn in front of oncoming traffic... etc... these herd mentalities have sort of "trained" the drivers into just stopping when they see a group.

    It's really kind of sad... as individuals, every one of these riders will assert their right to be on the road, and that they are "safe" riders. But put them on somebody's wheel and they'll blindly follow into danger. Put them at the front of a group and they will take a risk with no concern at all for the riders behind them.

    I know, I know, that's just how hammerfest rides behave.
    Where the hell do you get these ideas? I happen to regularly lead one of those "hammerfests", and neither I nor any of our riders behave this way. And, yes, we do call out people who misbehave.

  6. #6
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    Went on a local group ride that was how you describe, I just ended up peeling off and doing my own ride. They would just leave behind people who stopped for lights or stop signs which is also uncool. As far as I am concerned I am a vehicle and obey the laws as such. Also I do not trust people in general especially with my life so there is no way I am blowing through a light just because some yahoo waves me through.

  7. #7
    Anphaque II
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirx View Post
    Where the hell do you get these ideas? I happen to regularly lead one of those "hammerfests", and neither I nor any of our riders behave this way. And, yes, we do call out people who misbehave.



    I call out when appropriate.
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  8. #8
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    I run stop signs all the time. For one thing, the stop signs are unnecessary but are there to slow down traffic. There are more than double the stop signs now in my suburb compared to the 80s. In fact, I can make a phone call to the Traffic division in my area and request a stop sign wherever I wish and most times it will be erected.

    Traffic lights I always respect and seldom go through a red light unless I am absolutely sure no vehicle is coming. The roads are over-regulated with stop signs.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sisophous View Post
    I run stop signs all the time. For one thing, the stop signs are unnecessary but are there to slow down traffic. There are more than double the stop signs now in my suburb compared to the 80s. In fact, I can make a phone call to the Traffic division in my area and request a stop sign wherever I wish and most times it will be erected.

    Traffic lights I always respect and seldom go through a red light unless I am absolutely sure no vehicle is coming. The roads are over-regulated with stop signs.
    well I for one trust your judgement.
    Blows your hair back.

  10. #10
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    This is a crazy question. First of all, I trust no one in a car. They wave you through, and then the guy behind him cusses you out for running the stop.

    In regards to the other question, I refuse to call out cyclists who are not following the rules. They can just ride however they want. It's not really up to me to try and change their minds.
    With people like Peter P. around, I am done posting on this website. Mean people have driven me off after 9 plus years. Good luck newbies beware.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by cda 455 View Post



    I call out when appropriate.
    Seriously? Did you find anything objectionable in my post? Not sure given your smiley... Maybe I'm just confused. On topic, when I'm in the lead, and the crossing is clear such that I know that everyone in the group can safely cross, then I'll call out "Clear!" and lead the pack across, possibly without stopping. We don't ever run red lights, no matter what. Mind you, of course that pre-supposes that I know exactly who is behind me, and how far back they are. In addition, if we have a situation where only part of the gang gets across, while the rest has to wait, the unwritten rule is for the guys/gals ahead to soft-pedal it until the rest has caught up.
    Last edited by Pirx; 04-09-2013 at 01:46 PM.

  12. #12
    Yea that's right.
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    I can't find the, clearly the OP is on crack, poll option.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirx View Post
    Seriously? Did you find anything objectionable in my post? Not sure given your smiley... Maybe I'm just confused. On topic, when I'm in the lead, and the crossing is clear such that I know that everyone in the group can safely cross, then I'll call out "Clear!" and lead the pack across, possibly without stopping. We don't ever run red lights, no matter what. Mind you, of course that pre-supposes that I know exactly who is behind me, and how far back they are. In addition, if we have a situation where only part of the gang gets across, while the rest has to wait, the unwritten rule is for the guys/gals ahead to soft-pedal it until the rest has caught up.
    I should have added, "My thought, exactly!"


    I found your question rather funny, hence the laughing smiley.
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  14. #14
    Resident Curmudgeon
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    I never call out "CLEAR." Everybody is responsible for their own safety. I've called out "clear" in the past & missed something that had the right of way. I'd be surprised if anyone that has ridden more than a few years can honestly say they haven't made a mistake of this kind. Personally, I'd feel terrible if I called clear, misjudged a vehicle's speed, missed seeing it at all, or somebody at the back of the group couldn't make it across. If somebody was injured or killed it would be my fault. I'd have to live with that for the rest of my life and that's a responsibility I'm not willing to take. You get to an intersection you decide for yourself whether it's safe to procede & I will do the same. When riding in a group & someone calls "clear" I ignore it & take a close look for myself.
    Before you criticize someone walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them you'll be a mile away & you'll have their shoes.

  15. #15
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    Regarding the thread title, I don't like when people wave me on at a stop sign. Follow the rules of the road!!!
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Versatile View Post
    You get to an intersection you decide for yourself whether it's safe to procede & I will do the same.
    Unfortunately, that's not quite the way it works. I had a case a few years back, where I crossed the intersection with a car coming from the right. Now, I knew that this might get tight for the guy behind me, and, of course, I hadn't yelled "Clear!", but for whatever reason I had not given a warning, either. I think somehow I just assumed that the guy behind me should be responsible for his own safety. Well, turns out I was wrong, and the guy had just followed me blindly. Thankfully nothing happened, but it was a close call, and I did feel bad about it. In addition, at that time I was fairly new to the area and the group I was riding with, so I asked them whether what I had done (or rather, not done) was wrong. Just like you, they assured me that I was fine, but I promise you, if that guy had been hit, nothing would have kept me from feeling guilty.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sisophous View Post
    the stop signs are unnecessary but are there to slow down traffic.
    Okay, so the next time I come to a stop sign at a busy road I'll just slow down. That should work just fine!

    Please, stop signs are there to STOP traffic, not slow it down. I agree that sometimes they are unnecessary but are most often there for a reason. I don't always come to a complete stop at a stop sign, but I definitely do not ignore them either. In my opinion if pedestrians and drivers see me blow through a stop sign it just further reinforces their already tarnished opinion about cyclists. Additionally, I'm not perfect either. If I choose to run a stop sign it might just be the one time that I don't see a car doing the same thing. And we all know who loses those battles.

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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sisophous View Post
    I run stop signs all the time. For one thing, the stop signs are unnecessary but are there to slow down traffic.
    Like speed bumps?

    There are more than double the stop signs now in my suburb compared to the 80s. In fact, I can make a phone call to the Traffic division in my area and request a stop sign wherever I wish and most times it will be erected.
    Then stop calling them.

  19. #19
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    Putting aside that dangerous group rides have nothing to do with drivers waving cyclists through...

    Group rides: The responsibility to communicate danger falls to the ride leader or whoever is pulling at the front, but you are still responsible for your own safety. On my club's group rides, I've never seen anyone blow stop signs or red lights with traffic approaching or pull lefts across oncoming traffic. Whoever's at the front slows/stops as necessary, checks, and gives the "Clear!". And we all call out cars as we see them - car back, car left, etc... It's a courtesy like calling out gravel or potholes, but I agree with the poster above who said you still need to evaluate yourself and not blindly follow a "clear" signal.

    Drivers waving you through - I treat this just like I do when I am driving. If someone wants to be courteous at a 4-way stop or whatever and wave me through, I take them up on it, *assuming it is safe to do so*! But I'm not going to pull out in front of oncoming traffic because some other driver gave me a wave.

    At the end of the day, like most things in life, it comes down to personal responsibility. You are responsible for your own safety - not the motorists, not other cyclists. If your group is riding like a bunch of a$$holes, stop riding with them. If a motorist signals you to ride into the path of an oncoming 18-wheeler, maybe you use your head for a second and wait for a safe crossing.

    I really don't think this is that complicated.

  20. #20
    hooligan21
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    Quote Originally Posted by lootcorp View Post
    Putting aside that dangerous group rides have nothing to do with drivers waving cyclists through...

    Group rides: The responsibility to communicate danger falls to the ride leader or whoever is pulling at the front, but you are still responsible for your own safety. On my club's group rides, I've never seen anyone blow stop signs or red lights with traffic approaching or pull lefts across oncoming traffic. Whoever's at the front slows/stops as necessary, checks, and gives the "Clear!". And we all call out cars as we see them - car back, car left, etc... It's a courtesy like calling out gravel or potholes, but I agree with the poster above who said you still need to evaluate yourself and not blindly follow a "clear" signal.

    Drivers waving you through - I treat this just like I do when I am driving. If someone wants to be courteous at a 4-way stop or whatever and wave me through, I take them up on it, *assuming it is safe to do so*! But I'm not going to pull out in front of oncoming traffic because some other driver gave me a wave.

    At the end of the day, like most things in life, it comes down to personal responsibility. You are responsible for your own safety - not the motorists, not other cyclists. If your group is riding like a bunch of a$$holes, stop riding with them. If a motorist signals you to ride into the path of an oncoming 18-wheeler, maybe you use your head for a second and wait for a safe crossing.

    I really don't think this is that complicated.
    Spot on.....totally agree
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  21. #21
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    The general gist of the OP’s message seems to be that it can be dangerous to ride with a group because of some of the actions of some of the people in that group. So I get that and have experienced it.

    It’s not often but I’ve seen people call out “that guy” but haven’t done it myself. When I go on a group ride I am there for enjoyment so although I understand some of the things the OP is getting at, it’s not enjoyable to be a policeman while on a ride. And, being a policeman can also make you “that guy”, just a different “that guy”. In general don’t really like either – the person who is being an idjut or the person yelling at the idjut (unless the idjut is way out of line I guess). The conflict is unwelcome. I just want to ride, not save the world.
    I ride mostly in the honorable pursuit of being kissed on both cheeks at the same time by one blond and one brunette. But not redheads, they scare me.

  22. #22
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    As to the title of the thread, I hate when someone stops and waves me through. I really do appreciate their helpfulness but many times it just screws things up.

    At a stop sign there is an order to follow that's defined by the traffic laws and deviating from that throws the whole intersection off.

    But I'm thinking more like when you're wanting to turn left out of a driveway or parking lot. When someone stops to let you in front of them they're interrupting the normal flow of traffic and pissing off everyone behind them.
    And their friendly wave doesn't necessarily mean that your way is clear to cross into the other lane.

    My point is that whether we're driving or riding, we should always do what others expect us to do.
    Doing the unexpected causes accidents, even if someone is trying to be considerate.

  23. #23
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    The OP is clearly an idiot and should not be trusted to operate a vehicle on the public roads.

    Also, this is an awesome song.

    * posted by Creakybot 2013 all rights reserved.
    * not actually waterproof.

  24. #24
    Dr. Buzz Killington
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    The only stop sign I'd consider running is an all-way stop and only if no one else is approaching it.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by den bakker View Post
    well I for one trust your judgement.
    Hmmm, I don't! I would never ever go for either a drive with him in his car, or ride a tandem with him.

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