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Thread: Dipping tobacco

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixed View Post
    Nicotine is bad for you. End of discussion.
    FWIW, nicotine, in and of itself is not necessarily bad for you, it's the delivery methods that cause the problem.
    Often wrong, never in doubt

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixed View Post
    Nicotine is bad for you. End of discussion.
    OK, please don't take this as being snarky, because this is an honest question:

    Is nicotine truly bad for you, or is it the delivery method? I understand how its addictive properties could be bad for you in conjunction with delivery methods that cause cancer.

    With chewing tobacco, is nicotine the main component which causes cancer, or is it something else? With cigarettes, I imagine it would be all the chemicals created by the burning tobacco, tar, and whatever else is in there rather than the nicotine itself.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridgetop View Post
    packed their lips with sunflower seeds.
    I think the only reason sunflower seeds are sold around here is due to the population of people wanting to emulate the cowboy tradition or who are trying to quite real chew, either temporarily or permanently.

    Who has the patience to shell enough f---g sunflower seeds to satisfy hunger? Spitting shells is just as gross as tobacco spit.

  4. #29
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    yup

    Toxicology
    See also: Nicotine poisoning
    NFPA 704

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    The LD50 of nicotine is 50 mg/kg for rats and 3 mg/kg for mice. 4060 mg (0.5-1.0 mg/kg) can be a lethal dosage for adult humans.[55][56] Nicotine therefore has a high toxicity in comparison to many other alkaloids such as cocaine, which has an LD50 of 95.1 mg/kg when administered to mice. It is unlikely that a person would overdose on nicotine through smoking alone, although overdose can occur through combined use of nicotine patches or nicotine gum and cigarettes at the same time.[57] Spilling a high concentration of nicotine onto the skin can cause intoxication or even death, since nicotine readily passes into the bloodstream following dermal contact.[58]
    Historically, nicotine has not been regarded as a carcinogen and the IARC has not evaluated nicotine in its standalone form and assigned it to an official carcinogen group. While no epidemiological evidence supports that nicotine alone acts as a carcinogen in the formation of human cancer, research over the last decade has identified nicotine's carcinogenic potential in animal models and cell culture.[59] [60] Nicotine has been noted to directly cause cancer through a number of different mechanisms such as the activation of MAP Kinases.[61] Indirectly, nicotine increases cholinergic signalling (and adrenergic signalling in the case of colon cancer[62]), thereby impeding apoptosis (programmed cell death), promoting tumor growth, and activating growth factors and cellular mitogenic factors such as 5-LOX, and EGF. Nicotine also promotes cancer growth by stimulating angiogenesis and neovascularization.[63][64] In one study, nicotine administered to mice with tumors caused increases in tumor size (twofold increase), metastasis (nine-fold increase), and tumor recurrence (threefold increase).[65]
    Though the teratogenic properties of nicotine may or may not yet have been adequately researched, women who use nicotine gum and patches during the early stages of pregnancy face an increased risk of having babies with birth defects, according to a study of around 77,000 pregnant women in Denmark. The study found that women who use nicotine-replacement therapy in the first 12 weeks of pregnancy have a 60% greater risk of having babies with birth defects, compared to women who are non-smokers.[citation needed]
    Effective April 1, 1990, the Office of Environmental Health Hazard Assessment (OEHHA) of the California Environmental Protection Agency added nicotine to the list of chemicals known to the state to cause developmental toxicity, for the purposes of Proposition 65.[66]

    Quote Originally Posted by mcsqueak View Post
    OK, please don't take this as being snarky, because this is an honest question:

    Is nicotine truly bad for you, or is it the delivery method? I understand how its addictive properties could be bad for you in conjunction with delivery methods that cause cancer.

    With chewing tobacco, is nicotine the main component which causes cancer, or is it something else? With cigarettes, I imagine it would be all the chemicals created by the burning tobacco, tar, and whatever else is in there rather than the nicotine itself.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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  5. #30
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    I tried dip once back in college. At that time Hokie and I smoked cigarettes some and a few of my more country friends (well most of our friends were redneck) dipped. Figured I would see what it was like. First thought, the taste left something to be desired. Second thought, this whole spitting things sucks. Third thought, HOLY $H!T THAT'S A NICOTINE HIGH!!! Then my stomach turned over and I ran straight to the bathroom. The whole experience lasted about 20 minutes and I never tried it again. Interestingly enough I tried chew about a year later and didn't have the same problem, though it was a small amount for a limited time. Having to spit all the time turned me off from that too.

    Strange thing about all this is I never found it hard to stop a nicotine product. Decided I didn't want to dip or chew and didn't. Only ever smoked a max of 3 cigs during a day and never had the urge for more, well except when at a bar a few times while drinking. When I decided to stop smoking I just did. It's all about what you want to do and not what you feel you should do. Maybe I'm just lucky.
    "Sticking feathers in your butt doesn't make you a chicken"
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  6. #31
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    Growing up in a steel/coal mining town in the 50's/60's, almost everyone smoked or chewed. They couldn't smoke in the mines or mills so they all chewed. Like the dust, air pollution, toxic fumes, asbestos and radon gas wasn't bad enough. Gee, had to believe cancer in the town is epidemic.
    Of course I'm sure...that doesn't mean I'm right......

  7. #32
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    What! You mean all those government mandated warnings on cigarettes and other tobacco products isn't working! How could that be? Didn't liberal, government busybodies tell us that once all tobacco products were exposed as instant death, young people would run screaming from them.

    How could government busybodies be so wrong on this. They're liberal; they're elite; they're arrogant; they know so much more then the rest of us. How did we ever get along without them in the past?

  8. #33
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    Use of chewing tobacco is high in the military.

    I chewed for a number of years when I was in college & the Army Reserves. The time I spent deployed to Kuwait & Iraq was over a can a day until I started smoking, then it was a pack a day + can a day at my peak. I quit both pretty much cold turkey in 2004 after 4 years of chewing and/or smoking.

    Chew is nasty stuff... turns my stomach just to smell it today. I've tried putting in a lipper twice since I quit and ended up vomiting both times. The amount of nicotine that is put directly into your bloodstream with that is crazy.

    I can't even smoke a cigar today as a result. I get dizzy & sick to my stomach.
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    But I'm not a douche. I'm awesome.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve98501 View Post
    I've read a coupla' places that kicking cigarettes is harder than kicking heroin.
    As a person who has gone through withdrawals from both I will tell you this. While withdrawal from heroine is more violent and earth shattering the worst of it is over in 2-3 days and it feels like you went 10 rounds with a prize fighter. Nicotine takes weeks to get out of your system enough to get rid of the cravings, the headaches and the nausea. In the years I smoked I used the patch, the gum, hypnosis, acupuncture and then Chantix. After several weeks on Chantix and technicolor nightmares I decided I was done with smoking. It has been 18 years since I drank and used and 4 years off of cigarettes! If anyone asks me to give up anything to better my health they can KMA!
    Quote Originally Posted by Catzilla;
    Like, if "troubling" were a level seven worry, "concerning" would be a six, with "frightening" being an eight and "unexplained genital rash" being a nine.

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  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by NUTT View Post
    I can't even smoke a cigar today as a result. I get dizzy & sick to my stomach.
    Cigars do the same thing to me, not to mention I can't stand the taste left in my mouth or the smell on me later. I do love the way an unlit cigar smells though.
    "Sticking feathers in your butt doesn't make you a chicken"
    -Tyler Durden

  11. #36
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    I've quit several times.

  12. #37
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    For those who can't smoke a cigar or chew without getting sick to your stomach I offer that alcohol is an antidote to nicotine poisoning. I can't handle tobacco as it has been too long since I was a regular user but a few beers followed with nicotine and there is no long a penalty.

    Like many things I suppose tobacco is a problem when you fail at moderation. I choose to believe that a cigar a few times a year is not going to cause any problems.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcsqueak View Post
    I imagine it would be all the chemicals created by the burning tobacco, tar, and whatever else is in there rather than the nicotine itself.
    a little detail most people overlook, is that nicotine is referred to as a 'drug'...

    given the ridiculously expensive (and ridiculously ineffective) war on other drugs, it's absolutely pathetic that the tobacco industry receives govt subsidies to produce this crap.

    take a look at the other healthy tidbits you get in addition to the nicotine...some really good stuff...

    Smoking and cancer: What's in a cigarette? : Cancer Research UK
    eff all y'all...

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by desertgeezer View Post
    What! You mean all those government mandated warnings on cigarettes and other tobacco products isn't working! How could that be? Didn't liberal, government busybodies tell us that once all tobacco products were exposed as instant death, young people would run screaming from them.

    How could government busybodies be so wrong on this. They're liberal; they're elite; they're arrogant; they know so much more then the rest of us. How did we ever get along without them in the past?
    so you looking to get this thrown into PO?
    Of course I'm sure...that doesn't mean I'm right......

  15. #40
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    Here in Virginia dipping is pretty common. I quit dipping back in August after close to a can a day for 12 years. Quitting was the hardest thing i have ever done, the mood swings were the worst.

  16. #41
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    I hate smoking but I dipped for a long, long time, something like 13 out of 20 years in the Navy. IME, it was because smoking is so restricted on ships and in federal facilities that dipping became so popular among my peers. The law states no tobacco use of any kind, but everyone looks the other way with dip.

    Frankly, I enjoy it. I didn't spit and I packed it discretely so hardly anyone ever knew, and it didn't affect my athletic endeavors the way smoking probably would have. But it's expensive and the feeling of being addicted (needing something beyond my control) eventually irked me enough to quit. Plus there's that pesky, half-your-face--rotting-off to potentially deal with.

    It's tough to quit, though. Even after four or five years I occasionally still get strong cravings.
    "If you have the guts to be yourself, other people'll pay your price." - Rabbit Angstrom

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcsqueak View Post
    I was on a plane from Dallas to Frankfurt am Main, Germany and was seated next to an older gentleman who was chewing tobacco and spitting it into a coke can.

    It was absolutely disgusting. I am not sure if that is allowed or not, but apparently he hid it well enough for the flight attendants not to notice, and I didn't say anything.

    I did try one of those Camel "snuss" packets once, basically a bit of chew in a pouch so it isn't loose, about the size of a chicklet. Gave me a MASSIVE nicotine high, then made me sick to my stomach about 20 minutes later. I've never tried chewing before, and that was the last time I had one of those.
    There are quite a few girls I know who are into "snuss"
    Now there's an image of class and ladylike elgance

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by desertgeezer View Post
    What! You mean all those government mandated warnings on cigarettes and other tobacco products isn't working! How could that be? Didn't liberal, government busybodies tell us that once all tobacco products were exposed as instant death, young people would run screaming from them.

    How could government busybodies be so wrong on this. They're liberal; they're elite; they're arrogant; they know so much more then the rest of us. How did we ever get along without them in the past?
    so, as an enlightened, non-liberal, non-elite, non-arrogant type, you're in favor of removing the warnings?
    eff all y'all...

  19. #44
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    ask baseball great Tony Gwynn how that dippin' is treating him
    one nation, under surveillance with liberty and justice for few

    still not figgering on biggering

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonlime View Post
    I hate smoking but I dipped for a long, long time, something like 13 out of 20 years in the Navy. IME, it was because smoking is so restricted on ships and in federal facilities that dipping became so popular among my peers. The law states no tobacco use of any kind, but everyone looks the other way with dip.

    Frankly, I enjoy it. I didn't spit and I packed it discretely so hardly anyone ever knew, and it didn't affect my athletic endeavors the way smoking probably would have. But it's expensive and the feeling of being addicted (needing something beyond my control) eventually irked me enough to quit. Plus there's that pesky, half-your-face--rotting-off to potentially deal with.

    It's tough to quit, though. Even after four or five years I occasionally still get strong cravings.
    All true. When I joined the Navy in 85, it seemed like everyone smoked, it was what you did. I lived in barracks while I went to tech school and my roomates smoked in the room, I was the non-smoker. The walls on ships and in buildings were a pale yellow color from the smoke and nicotine. Then the military cracked down on smoking and everyone started dipping. I am in a position of some authority so I occassionally ban dipping in the areas I am responsible for, this is usually the result of someone leaving a spit bottle laying out and having the contents spill. I also won't tolerate anyone talking to me while they have a dip. It's a bad habit and I'm trying to provide motivation to quit by making it a hassle at work.
    Retired sailor

  21. #46
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    This must be some kind of national ritual at band camps. I have heard this story so many different ways. It's funny (sick) about every time I hear it.
    Quote Originally Posted by tuck View Post
    This one time...at band camp...I dipped, and I got sick.

  22. #47
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    While working at a sports camp in western Mass, a ton of my coworkers from around the globed dipped. Just because they couldn't get it anywhere but here.

  23. #48
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    Nicotine sucks. I have been a smoker off and on since i was 16. I'm now about to be 30 and I can't do this crap any more I have spent almost half my life with a stupid stupid habit. I have kicked it a few times. Hell one time was for over a year. I wish I would have never started. Today is day 1 of quitting again. I hope it's the last time but it's so hard not to want one.

    I've been in the military for about 11 years now and smoking and dipping is still huge everywhere I have been. Many people who don't normally smoke or dip do it when they are deployed. Sometimes it seems like a social thing. The military definitely has cracked down on it and offers many ways to help quit though as bigbill said.

  24. #49
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    My mom-in-law smoked of 30 years, but when the cigs hit $3.00 a pack she quit cold turkey and has not touched them since. She had tried to quit before, but did not have the proper motivation. Now when she looks back she grieves over the money she sent up in smoke.

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by old_fuji View Post
    Like, has dipping become more popular over the past 4-5 years, or have I just not noticed it before?
    I didn't find any national prevalence numbers that recent, not in the 10 seconds I looked. State numbers are easier to find.

    In Indiana the monthly use among 12th graders has gone up from 9.1% in 2007 to 10.7% in 2011. I doubt you would notice a small rise like that. But your local situation might be very different, since kids do influence kids and when a behavior gets into a population it tends to spread.

    Lifetime users among the same group up 4.2%. http://s.ph-cdn.com/newman/gfx/news/...wardtrendi.jpg More regular users means more kids who will be exposed and try it at least once. (Smoking rates are down, btw).

    Note: I have serious questions about the study that graph comes from, for a variety of reasons, but the CHANGE IN prevalence rates, that's most likely ok.
    .
    Stout beers under trees, please.

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