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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by love4himies View Post
    So would that mean that the "dna" of a pitbull changed in the last 20 years?

    The rates used in the my link were fatalities based on the prevalence of each breed. As I'm sure you are aware dog breeds popularity can change from year to year so the number of fatalities by breed can screw the risk of that breed.
    So dog ownership has gone up by 20 million since 2000 and AKC registrations have gone down. How can your linked stats be proof of anything other than some APBT sellers are very passionate about their products? How about unregistered dog attacks by breed, got any data on those? The data used for that Pitbull advocacy group is outdated and and has a flawed assumption at it's base.

  2. #102
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    This is a great article:

    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/arin-...b_5521281.html

    It’s Time to End the Prejudice Against Pit Bulls

    A research paper is cited in this article:

    https://avmajournals.avma.org/doi/ab...ma.243.12.1726

    Sample—256 DBRFs occurring in the United States from 2000 to 2009.

    Procedures—DBRFs were identified from media reports and detailed histories were compiled on the basis of reports from homicide detectives, animal control reports, and interviews with investigators for coding and descriptive analysis.

    Results—Major co-occurrent factors for the 256 DBRFs included absence of an able-bodied person to intervene (n = 223 [87.1%]), incidental or no familiar relationship of victims with dogs (218 [85.2%]), owner failure to neuter dogs (216 [84.4%]), compromised ability of victims to interact appropriately with dogs (198 [77.4%]), dogs kept isolated from regular positive human interactions versus family dogs (195 [76.2%]), owners’ prior mismanagement of dogs (96 [37.5%]), and owners’ history of abuse or neglect of dogs (54 [21.1%]). Four or more of these factors co-occurred in 206 (80.5%) deaths. For 401 dogs described in various media accounts, reported breed differed for 124 (30.9%); for 346 dogs with both media and animal control breed reports, breed differed for 139 (40.2%). Valid breed determination was possible for only 45 (17.6%) DBRFs; 20 breeds, including 2 known mixes, were identified.

    Conclusions and Clinical Relevance—Most DBRFs were characterized by coincident, preventable factors; breed was not one of these. Study results supported previous recommendations for multifactorial approaches, instead of single-factor solutions such as breed-specific legislation, for dog bite prevention.
    So if you really want to prevent dog fatalities, you have to go after the owner. It is they who are responsible for ensuring their dog is not a danger to society.
    While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions. - Stephen R. Covey.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    Many cities have laws against them.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-...#United_States

    Denver for instance:
    It [is] unlawful for any person to own, possess, keep, exercise control over, maintain, harbor, transport, or sell within the city any pit bull.
    Out of 3,007 counties in the U.S., per that link, 19 counties banned or ban on new Pitbulls and 4 counties have restrictions. Very small percentage. Maybe it's not an epidemic...
    In the mean time, an average of 102 people died per day in motor vehicle crashes in the U.S. in 2016. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_...n_U.S._by_year

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by love4himies View Post
    So if you really want to prevent dog fatalities, you have to go after the owner. It is they who are responsible for ensuring their dog is not a danger to society.
    Or the pitbull advocate? https://pilotonline.com/news/local/c...958dde3bb.html
    50$ for a life?
    I agree bad owners are largely responsible but adopting an unknown likely poorly socialized dog into your family is playing a lethal game of chance. Bigger dogs also have a greater risk due to their strength. Shouldn't more onus be put on breeders to cull out aggressive traits in their breeding stock? A $50 shot of Pentobarbital can save generations of trouble.
    Last edited by kiwisimon; 1 Week Ago at 01:07 AM. Reason: wrong cost

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwisimon View Post
    Or the pitbull advocate? https://pilotonline.com/news/local/c...958dde3bb.html
    750$ for a life?
    I agree bad owners are largely responsible but adopting an unknown likely poorly socialized dog into your family is playing a lethal game of chance. Bigger dogs also have a greater risk due to their strength. Shouldn't more onus be put on breeders to cull out aggressive traits in their breeding stock? A $50 shot of Pentobarbital can save generations of trouble.
    Absolutely breeders should be doing that. And responsible breeders do just that, but there are virtually no regulations on breeders and there are those who breed in abhorrent conditions and those puppies are poorly socialized from day 1. Mix that with irresponsible pet owners and you have a recipe for disaster.
    While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions. - Stephen R. Covey.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    Out of 3,007 counties in the U.S., per that link, 19 counties banned or ban on new Pitbulls and 4 counties have restrictions. Very small percentage. Maybe it's not an epidemic...
    In the mean time, an average of 102 people died per day in motor vehicle crashes in the U.S. in 2016. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_...n_U.S._by_year
    False equivalences are false.
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  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    False equivalences are false.
    Which is more pressing issue, human fatality from auto accidents or Pitbull attack?
    What I'm getting at is, bureaucrats take actions based on priority and some priorities are their own, unfortunately.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    Which is more pressing issue, human fatality from auto accidents or Pitbull attack?
    And.... false equivalences are STILL false.
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  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    Which is more pressing issue, human fatality from auto accidents or Pitbull attack?
    What I'm getting at is, bureaucrats take actions based on priority and some priorities are their own, unfortunately.
    Agree. This happens all the time, all over the world.
    While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions. - Stephen R. Covey.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    And.... false equivalences are STILL false.
    Then switch out auto accidents with something else that kills people. Lets see your pick.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    Then switch out auto accidents with something else that kills people. Lets see your pick.
    bicycles! But if you are talking about transport which is safer, a car or a bicycle?
    Dogs, Rottweilers or border collies?

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by love4himies View Post
    So would that mean that the "dna" of a pitbull changed in the last 20 years?

    The rates used in the my link were fatalities based on the prevalence of each breed. As I'm sure you are aware dog breeds popularity can change from year to year so the number of fatalities by breed can screw the risk of that breed.
    Based on your reasoning, the far greater abundance of Golden Retrievers (a large strong breed) should cause many more fatalities than Pit Bulls, which are much less abundant in the U.S. How many fatalities caused by Golden Retrievers do you hear about?

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwisimon View Post
    bicycles! But if you are talking about transport which is safer, a car or a bicycle?
    I don't know why we're talking about auto accidents in a thread about pit bulls. It's just silly.

    Cancers kills almost 20x more people than auto deaths. Clearly that's the only thing we can focus on.
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  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve98501 View Post
    Based on your reasoning, the far greater abundance of Golden Retrievers (a large strong breed) should cause many more fatalities than Pit Bulls, which are much less abundant in the U.S. How many fatalities caused by Golden Retrievers do you hear about?
    Goldens are wonderful dogs, but they are not considered one of the "strong breeds".
    While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions. - Stephen R. Covey.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve98501 View Post
    Based on your reasoning, the far greater abundance of Golden Retrievers (a large strong breed) should cause many more fatalities than Pit Bulls, which are much less abundant in the U.S. How many fatalities caused by Golden Retrievers do you hear about?
    What about the owners of GR vs PB? You know, the ones with the most influence on the dog.

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    I don't know why we're talking about auto accidents in a thread about pit bulls. It's just silly.

    Cancers kills almost 20x more people than auto deaths. Clearly that's the only thing we can focus on.
    OK, the bureaucrats are passing legislation after legislation to fight cancer, be it preventive messages, environment safety rules, treatment R&D...etc. They are also doing a lots of things about traffic safety as well. Both are much bigger issues than fatality caused by Pitbulls.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by love4himies View Post
    Goldens are wonderful dogs, but they are not considered one of the "strong breeds".
    I was in the elevator with one recently. Very friendly GR and I pet it on the head for maybe 2 seconds. I got off the elevator and smelled my hand that just touched that dog. Peeee-u, it stunk! That's got to be the smelliest dog I've ever encountered! Name:  puke.gif
Views: 21
Size:  2.6 KB I blame the owner.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    What about the owners of GR vs PB? You know, the ones with the most influence on the dog.
    And breeders. Puppy socialization starts with the parents. Who are the ones who are irresponsibly breeding pits versus goldens?
    While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions. - Stephen R. Covey.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    OK, the bureaucrats are passing legislation after legislation to fight cancer, be it preventive messages, environment safety rules, treatment R&D...etc. They are also doing a lots of things about traffic safety as well. Both are much bigger issues than fatality caused by Pitbulls.
    For the most part of car crashes it's the driver who is at fault. The one in control of the vehicle knowing they have control of a potential deadly weapon but are careless with it anyways.
    While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions. - Stephen R. Covey.

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