Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 33
  1. #1
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Christine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    14,801

    Snakes on a Plane

    Turns out the snake they dragged off the plane had quite a history:
    Doctor dragged off flight was convicted of trading drugs for sex | New York Post

    I mean, I know prescription drugs are expensive, and a lot of people hate Obamacare, but do you really need to pay in *sex*?!

    Does he still deserve a beat-down? Sure, but not for refusing to give up his seat.

  2. #2
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by Christine View Post
    Turns out the snake they dragged off the plane had quite a history:
    Doctor dragged off flight was convicted of trading drugs for sex | New York Post

    I mean, I know prescription drugs are expensive, and a lot of people hate Obamacare, but do you really need to pay in *sex*?!

    Does he still deserve a beat-down? Sure, but not for refusing to give up his seat.
    Yes, he's not quite the hero he was initially made out to be but he will soon be a rich man. United needs to get this out of the news and will probably want to settle quickly. I hope this whole fiasco will eventually help the average flier

  3. #3
    gazing from the shadows
    Reputation: QuiQuaeQuod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    24,924
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    Yes, he's not quite the hero he was initially made out to be ...
    I saw plenty of people calling him a victim, but zero calling him a hero.

    It has become standard PR practice to dig up any and all dirt in such situations to smear the victim, whether deserved or not. But in almost every instance, the person's past has zero to do with what happened to them in the case that gains attention. What such dirt digging does is takes the attention off the bad behavior in the present. It's a defense tactic, not a valid justification for bad behavior on the part of, in this case, the airline and security.
    .
    Stout beers under trees, please.

  4. #4
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by QuiQuaeQuod View Post
    I saw plenty of people calling him a victim, but zero calling him a hero.

    It has become standard PR practice to dig up any and all dirt in such situations to smear the victim, whether deserved or not. But in almost every instance, the person's past has zero to do with what happened to them in the case that gains attention. What such dirt digging does is takes the attention off the bad behavior in the present. It's a defense tactic, not a valid justification for bad behavior on the part of, in this case, the airline and security.
    Hero was a bad choice of words. I think the damage to United is already done. However, the reports about the victim, mainly those about anger issues, may lend credibility to the claim that he struck law enforcement officers during the encounter. I am hopeful that this whole situation will end up in some level of improvement in the way airlines treat their customers

  5. #5
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: BCSaltchucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,191
    Well if his intention was to perform civil disobedience for the cause of getting airlines to adjust their policies on overbooking/bumping passengers .. then that is mildly heroic, imho. Heroic as in 'hero for a cause of a very first world problem.'

    I imagine his purpose was just being so piszed off and annoyed and feeling sorry for himself that he misbehaved. But I still appreciate the effort.

  6. #6
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: BCSaltchucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,191
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    Yes, he's not quite the hero he was initially made out to be but he will soon be a rich man.
    he will not win much from the courts on this, if anything. Unless he can manage to get in front of a jury!

    He's not a great and wonderful symbol of piety and volunteerism, he did not cure cancer nor go to the moon. In fact maybe the guy is a low life dislikable dude. But then if we're going ad hominem, let's look at United Air lines too: they recently had their CEO resign for a bribery scandal .. and the politician he bribed was recently convicted. Gotta wonder how much this corruption infects the company's decision making in general?

  7. #7
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Christine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    14,801
    Of course his past convictions aren't a reason to treat him badly. However, his bad behavior could have been a factor in being removed, and could hurt his case somewhat.

    But the bottom line is that they had no right to do that, whether or not he's a deplorable character. He's now got plenty of money to pay cash for gay hookers, which is slightly better than writing them prescriptions.

  8. #8
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    Well if his intention was to perform civil disobedience for the cause of getting airlines to adjust their policies on overbooking/bumping passengers .. then that is mildly heroic, imho. Heroic as in 'hero for a cause of a very first world problem.'

    I imagine his purpose was just being so piszed off and annoyed and feeling sorry for himself that he misbehaved. But I still appreciate the effort.
    One of the passengers that was interviewed said he seemed inebriated when he returned to the plane (after being removed). The video seems to confirm this. That could be because they drugged him to get him to comply or he could have showed up that way. That could have been a factor is him not cooperating. From a legal standpoint, it was airport police that dragged him out, not United, so the airline is legally clean there.

  9. #9
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    7,329
    Quote Originally Posted by Christine View Post
    Of course his past convictions aren't a reason to treat him badly. However, his bad behavior could have been a factor in being removed, and could hurt his case somewhat.

    But the bottom line is that they had no right to do that, whether or not he's a deplorable character. He's now got plenty of money to pay cash for gay hookers, which is slightly better than writing them prescriptions.
    As in all of these matters, until all of the facts are known, it's not possible to form a rational opinion.

    What the video does not show is full altercation that led to the outcome. I have a suspicion that the "victim" may not have been as innocent as we'd like to believe.

    Also, I'm not clear on whether these security officials were employees of United?

  10. #10
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by SwiftSolo View Post
    As in all of these matters, until all of the facts are known, it's not possible to form a rational opinion.

    What the video does not show is full altercation that led to the outcome. I have a suspicion that the "victim" may not have been as innocent as we'd like to believe.

    Also, I'm not clear on whether these security officials were employees of United?
    They were not United employees there were from the Chicago Department of Aviation.

    "The aviation department said Monday afternoon that it had placed the security officer who pulled the man out of his seat on leave pending a “thorough review” of the situation.

    The aviation department said in an emailed statement that the incident wasn’t in accordance with its standard operating procedure and the officer’s actions “are obviously not condoned by the Department.”

    The department confirmed that all three men who were seen on video talking to the man who was removed from the flight were aviation security officers."

    I think that because the flying experience has become so awful, folks were quick to side against United. Add to that the incredibly lame and heartless response from Munoz, and the whole thing turned into a PR disaster

  11. #11
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    7,329
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    They were not United employees there were from the Chicago Department of Aviation.

    "The aviation department said Monday afternoon that it had placed the security officer who pulled the man out of his seat on leave pending a “thorough review” of the situation.

    The aviation department said in an emailed statement that the incident wasn’t in accordance with its standard operating procedure and the officer’s actions “are obviously not condoned by the Department.”

    The department confirmed that all three men who were seen on video talking to the man who was removed from the flight were aviation security officers."

    I think that because the flying experience has become so awful, folks were quick to side against United. Add to that the incredibly lame and heartless response from Munoz, and the whole thing turned into a PR disaster
    Thanks for clearing that up.

    It seems like United would have been quick to point out that these were not United employees and that United does not condone what appears to have been inappropriate behavior.

    On the other hand, we still don't have definitive evidence of what happened in the early portion of the altercation. I'm guessing that there is a possibility that the victim may have a role causing his forcible removal.

    Finally, I despise the business model that airlines have degenerated to in general. They have become really easy to hate. Flying has become like taking a bus in a third world country

  12. #12
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    3,499
    One question needs to be asked; assuming that after asking for volunteers to leave the overbooked plane (for compensation, of course), United staff "selected" someone to be removed from the plane, HOW did they select the passenger? Was it truly random, as has been reported?

    I agree that the Dr. had some role in his eventual removal. Pity all those passive-aggressive viral videographers didn't AHEM, capture and air the entire episode. I'm also surprised the police didn't try to confiscate all the cameras as they claim it interferes with the execution of their job. Comments?

  13. #13
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter P. View Post
    One question needs to be asked; assuming that after asking for volunteers to leave the overbooked plane (for compensation, of course), United staff "selected" someone to be removed from the plane, HOW did they select the passenger? Was it truly random, as has been reported?

    I agree that the Dr. had some role in his eventual removal. Pity all those passive-aggressive viral videographers didn't AHEM, capture and air the entire episode. I'm also surprised the police didn't try to confiscate all the cameras as they claim it interferes with the execution of their job. Comments?
    My understanding was that United employees tried to block the video taking. Also it was reported that they moved folks nearby this passenger to the back of the plan so maybe no one had a good shot. Technically, United is within its legal right to remove passengers and there are no laws governing who gets picked. One article I saw said selection is probably based on ticket cost and airline status (miles)

  14. #14
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    7,329
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter P. View Post
    One question needs to be asked; assuming that after asking for volunteers to leave the overbooked plane (for compensation, of course), United staff "selected" someone to be removed from the plane, HOW did they select the passenger? Was it truly random, as has been reported?

    I agree that the Dr. had some role in his eventual removal. Pity all those passive-aggressive viral videographers didn't AHEM, capture and air the entire episode. I'm also surprised the police didn't try to confiscate all the cameras as they claim it interferes with the execution of their job. Comments?
    Yep, I just don't understand why these "videographers" wait until an conversation degenerates to a confrontation before turning on their cameras. Seems only right that they'd video every conversation from the beginning. After all, passengers who don't want to be recorded could simply opt to neither communicate nor sit by anyone who does.

  15. #15
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    6,178
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    ...........One article I saw said selection is probably based on ticket cost and airline status (miles)
    Hmmmm


    Interesting

    Check it out

    Last edited by dougclaysmith; 04-13-2017 at 05:53 AM.

  16. #16
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    532
    OK, devil's advocate here -

    Suppose they were truly overbooked or had a legal right to reduce passengers (turns out they were booting four to make room for a United flight crew that needed to come back to Louisville to run their own scheduled flight) and the passengers were randomly selected (who knows), then I think the airline had a right to get the passengers off the plane, and do whatever it takes. What else would they do?

    "Oh, you REALLY don't want to get bumped and you protested enough, so you can stay. We'll bump someone else"

    or maybe "Well then, this plane is just going to sit here until you get up and leave"

    If the passenger is trying to make a statement about the airlines' mismanagement/mistreatment of their customers, then this is not the platform to do that with a plane fueled up and boarded and ready to take off. I agree there's a lot to be said about the management and execution in their day to day business, but that's another story with a lot of futility. And why would anyone ever invest in a major airline?

  17. #17
    Darling of The Lounge
    Reputation: Retro Grouch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    3,707
    It's time for United to employ a better PR campaign and hire a trustworthy spokesperson.


  18. #18
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: bobf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    142
    Quote Originally Posted by SwiftSolo View Post
    Yep, I just don't understand why these "videographers" wait until an conversation degenerates to a confrontation before turning on their cameras. Seems only right that they'd video every conversation from the beginning. After all, passengers who don't want to be recorded could simply opt to neither communicate nor sit by anyone who does.
    HA! Yeah, privacy is so last century. Let's give Google glasses to everyone ... with no 'off' switch for the camera.

  19. #19
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by ogre View Post
    OK, devil's advocate here -

    Suppose they were truly overbooked or had a legal right to reduce passengers (turns out they were booting four to make room for a United flight crew that needed to come back to Louisville to run their own scheduled flight) and the passengers were randomly selected (who knows), then I think the airline had a right to get the passengers off the plane, and do whatever it takes. What else would they do?

    "Oh, you REALLY don't want to get bumped and you protested enough, so you can stay. We'll bump someone else"

    or maybe "Well then, this plane is just going to sit here until you get up and leave"

    If the passenger is trying to make a statement about the airlines' mismanagement/mistreatment of their customers, then this is not the platform to do that with a plane fueled up and boarded and ready to take off. I agree there's a lot to be said about the management and execution in their day to day business, but that's another story with a lot of futility. And why would anyone ever invest in a major airline?
    In hindsight if they had simply increased the amount of money they were giving to volunteers they would have eventually gotten 4 people to leave.

  20. #20
    biding my time
    Reputation: SystemShock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    30,384
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    In hindsight if they had simply increased the amount of money they were giving to volunteers they would have eventually gotten 4 people to leave.
    Could be wrong, but I think the max they're allowed to offer is $1,350, and they offered at least $800 prior to 'the incident'. Not sure if the $550 difference would've moved butts or not, if that was the deal.

    Perhaps the regulation/law/policy/whatever should be changed to allow more money than the current limit to be offered, AND to stipulate that no one gets involuntarily de-boarded unless the max allowed amount of money has been offered first.

    It also might be smart to reduce the # of seats that they can overbook by per flight, but, that's almost too much common sense to hope for, I'd imagine.
    System: Fake news?? Trump is a Fake President™, for god's sake.

    Monk: I want to go like my Dad did – peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    EJ Dionne: Modern-day conservatism isn't conservatism. It's reaction rooted in deep pessimism that isn't in keeping with the American character.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  21. #21
    biding my time
    Reputation: SystemShock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    30,384
    Quote Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
    It's time for United to employ a better PR campaign and hire a trustworthy spokesperson.



    It's amazing how goofy and crass Spicey looks in literally any get-up.


    Huh... that's strange. I seem to hear a motorized podium coming towards me, for some reason...
    System: Fake news?? Trump is a Fake President™, for god's sake.

    Monk: I want to go like my Dad did – peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    EJ Dionne: Modern-day conservatism isn't conservatism. It's reaction rooted in deep pessimism that isn't in keeping with the American character.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  22. #22
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by SystemShock View Post
    Could be wrong, but I think the max they're allowed to offer is $1,350, and they offered at least $800 prior to 'the incident'. Not sure if the $550 difference would've moved butts or not, if that was the deal.

    Perhaps the regulation/law/policy/whatever should be changed to allow more money than the current limit to be offered, AND to stipulate that no one gets involuntarily de-boarded unless the max allowed amount of money has been offered first.

    It also might be smart to reduce the # of seats that they can overbook by per flight, but, that's almost too much common sense to hope for, I'd imagine.
    The rules dictate how much the airlines HAVE to pay depending on how delayed you are. The regulation states you get 400% of your one-way fare up to a $1350 maximum if you are delayed more than 2 hours. They are allowed to give more. For $1350 I would have rented a car and just driven there (this was a Chicago to Louisville flight)

  23. #23
    gazing from the shadows
    Reputation: QuiQuaeQuod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    24,924
    Standard process application:

    The gentleman arrested Thursday and tried before Pontius Pilate had a troubled background.

    Born (possibly out of wedlock?) in a stable, this jobless thirty-something of Middle Eastern origin had had previous run-ins with local authorities for disturbing the peace, and had become increasingly associated with the members of a fringe religious group. He spent the majority of his time in the company of sex workers and criminals.

    He had had prior run-ins with local authorities — most notably, an incident of vandalism in a community center when he wrecked the tables of several licensed money-lenders and bird-sellers. He had used violent language, too, claiming that he could destroy a gathering place and rebuild it.

    At the time of his arrest, he had not held a fixed residence for years. Instead, he led an itinerant lifestyle, staying at the homes of friends and advocating the redistribution of wealth.

    He had come to the attention of the authorities more than once for his unauthorized distribution of food, disruptive public behavior, and participation in farcical aquatic ceremonies.

    Some say that his brutal punishment at the hands of the state was out of proportion to and unrelated to any of these incidents in his record.

    But after all, he was no angel.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...=.25e925755111
    .
    Stout beers under trees, please.

  24. #24
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    4,099
    Quote Originally Posted by QuiQuaeQuod View Post
    As it was foretold, Christ has returned in the body of an old, drug addled, gay Korean man. Praise the Lord!

  25. #25
    biding my time
    Reputation: SystemShock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    30,384
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
    As it was foretold, Christ has returned in the body of an old, drug addled, gay Korean man. Praise the Lord!




    ...
    System: Fake news?? Trump is a Fake President™, for god's sake.

    Monk: I want to go like my Dad did – peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    EJ Dionne: Modern-day conservatism isn't conservatism. It's reaction rooted in deep pessimism that isn't in keeping with the American character.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Get these snakes...
    By Wookiebiker in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-12-2013, 04:03 AM
  2. We got MF'in snakes!
    By BenWA in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-27-2007, 04:01 PM
  3. Replies: 16
    Last Post: 09-08-2006, 12:11 PM
  4. We've got m&%$%^f&*king snakes!
    By Kram in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 08-27-2006, 01:42 PM
  5. Snakes on a Plane
    By Brick Tamland in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: 08-19-2006, 04:46 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •