View Poll Results: Is the leve of force enough/adequate, too much, or not enough

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  • Enough/adequate for the circumstance

    25 46.30%
  • Too much for the circumstance

    23 42.59%
  • Not enough for the circumstance

    6 11.11%
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  1. #1
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    Is this level of force used by the LEO in this situation OK?

    Just saw this video footage and am somewhat shocked. Personally, I think the amount of force used by the officer was more than needed, especially since backup could have been called and the situation dealt with without a 17 year old girl getting punched in the face. A punch like that can do some serious damage. Just wondering what everybody on PO thinks about it.

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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by fabsroman
    Just saw this video footage and am somewhat shocked. Personally, I think the amount of force used by the officer was more than needed, especially since backup could have been called and the situation dealt with without a 17 year old girl getting punched in the face. A punch like that can do some serious damage. Just wondering what everybody on PO thinks about it.

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    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ynews/ynews_ts2638
    there's already a thread on this in Teh Lounge. After seeing the video I think the level of force was warranted though it doesn't look good on video to have a white officer punching a black minor in the face. What if she had a knife or gun? It might have been a totally different ending. If anything, I think the officer was in danger of letting her get that close in the first place when he was detaining another person who was trying to resist arrest.

    J's first day as a beat cop doesn't go well...
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bocephus Jones II
    there's already a thread on this in Teh Lounge.
    No time for The Lounge tonight. I'm actually in the process of writing my Senate representative in the State of Maryland regarding the 1970's wiretap law that they are prosecuting a kid for because he recorded a conversation with a law enforcement officer and posted it to the web. I'm taking the position that anything that a public official does in public, while discharging his public duties, should be open for recordation, with or without the consent of the officer.

    I'm sitting here wondering if they ask for consent to use the dashboard cams and to record interrogations in the interrogation room. If not, they should be open to video recordation of their acts/speech whenever they are in public.
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  4. #4
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    Looks like he was just plain lashing out, which IMO is never ideal for an LEO. Even if you think a suspect deserves whatever they get for failing to comply, the problem is that he is using a an ineffective means to subdue her which puts everyone in even more danger.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Looks like he was just plain lashing out, which IMO is never ideal for an LEO. Even if you think a suspect deserves whatever they get for failing to comply, the problem is that he is using a an ineffective means to subdue her which puts everyone in even more danger.
    There may have been a better way for him to subdue her, but let's face it. If you are a cop all alone and there is an angry mob trying to prevent you from arresting a perp and somebody comes up to you and shoves you what do you do?
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bocephus Jones II
    There may have been a better way for him to subdue her, but let's face it. If you are a cop all alone and there is an angry mob trying to prevent you from arresting a perp and somebody comes up to you and shoves you what do you do?
    Retreat and call for back-up. If those are the circumstances, I doubt training indicates that a lone officer should handle an angry mob by escalating the situation.

    I would sooner he pull out his gun, threaten to use deadly force and use it if necessary. At least in that case, the stakes are crystal clear to everyone involved. I doubt the average teenage girl ever expects to punched in the face by an adult male (making it something of a sucker punch).

    BTW, it doesn't look good to me to have an officer of any color punch any civilian in the face. Again, because that is not an effective response and suggests to me a lack of professionalism.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Looks like he was just plain lashing out, which IMO is never ideal for an LEO. Even if you think a suspect deserves whatever they get for failing to comply, the problem is that he is using a an ineffective means to subdue her which puts everyone in even more danger.
    If you watch all of the video available in this matter, I can't imagine how any rational person could reach the conclusion you have reached. In the end, he did subdue the main culprit and the fat chick who attacked/shoved him as well. Virtually any other options would have endangered or affected onlookers in a negative manner (pepper spray or taser)

    I do appreciate the post that suggests he call for backup! Perhaps calling for a state legislative order would have solved the problem as well! When immediate action is called for--call for back-up! In the interim, the perps will not get more than a couple of miles away.

  8. #8
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    It was ugly but he was just trying to do his job.

  9. #9
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    Granted, I watched the video provided and responded, as requested.

    BTW, you might want to lay off the hard-boiled cop dramas, mate.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snakebit
    It was ugly but he was just trying to do his job.
    Poorly.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Poorly.
    Got 'em both in the car didn't he?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snakebit
    Got 'em both in the car didn't he?
    And earned himself and his Dept. a $hitstorm for his trouble.

    Then again, who knows what mayhem these two would have caused if they escaped while he was waiting for back up. He was citing them for jaywalking, after all.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    And earned himself and his Dept. a $hitstorm for his trouble.

    Then again, who knows what mayhem these two would have caused if they escaped while he was waiting for back up. He was citing them for jaywalking, after all.
    Then why didn't they just take their citations and tell it to the judge?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Looks like he was just plain lashing out, which IMO is never ideal for an LEO. Even if you think a suspect deserves whatever they get for failing to comply, the problem is that he is using a an ineffective means to subdue her which puts everyone in even more danger.
    His means of subduing her seemed pretty effective to me. I think he may have been a little rough but it's her fault to begin with.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snakebit
    Then why didn't they just take their citations and tell it to the judge?
    Exactly.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwiftSolo
    If you watch all of the video available in this matter, I can't imagine how any rational person could reach the conclusion you have reached. In the end, he did subdue the main culprit and the fat chick who attacked/shoved him as well. Virtually any other options would have endangered or affected onlookers in a negative manner (pepper spray or taser)

    I do appreciate the post that suggests he call for backup! Perhaps calling for a state legislative order would have solved the problem as well! When immediate action is called for--call for back-up! In the interim, the perps will not get more than a couple of miles away.
    I think you're armchair quarterbacking here.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snakebit
    Then why didn't they just take their citations and tell it to the judge?
    Are you suggesting that they were hard core criminals and this cop got lucky, so to speak? I'm guessing they were incredulous at being singled out for what, in this day and age, amounts to petty harassment. Citing kids for jaywalking!?

    Anyway, dumb teenagers. Dumb cop. The former is practically axiomatic. The latter shouldn't be tolerated, period.

  18. #18
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    somebody is gonna be an ex-cop.
    eff all y'all...

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Are you suggesting that they were hard core criminals and this cop got lucky, so to speak? I'm guessing they were incredulous at being singled out for what, in this day and age, amounts to petty harassment. Citing kids for jaywalking!?

    Anyway, dumb teenagers. Dumb cop. The former is practically axiomatic. The latter shouldn't be tolerated, period.
    If you try to rough a cop up when he's detained you or your friend then you shouldn't be too surprised when he fights back. That girl's parents raised her wrong to behave like that.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Are you suggesting that they were hard core criminals and this cop got lucky, so to speak? I'm guessing they were incredulous at being singled out for what, in this day and age, amounts to petty harassment. Citing kids for jaywalking!?

    Anyway, dumb teenagers. Dumb cop. The former is practically axiomatic. The latter shouldn't be tolerated, period.
    Ain't nothing to tollerate. The physical part of it was all their fault. I was 19 once and I knew better than to behave like that. They got arrested for the physical aspect that they initiated, not jaywalking if that was indeed all it was about. Shut your mouth, take your ticket and get on with whatever it was you were doing. The cop did his job, period.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Are you suggesting that they were hard core criminals and this cop got lucky, so to speak? I'm guessing they were incredulous at being singled out for what, in this day and age, amounts to petty harassment. Citing kids for jaywalking!?

    Anyway, dumb teenagers. Dumb cop. The former is practically axiomatic. The latter shouldn't be tolerated, period.
    Supposedly the girl that was originally arrested has a history of resisting arrest.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bocephus Jones II
    If you try to rough a cop up when he's detained you or your friend then you shouldn't be too surprised when he fights back. That girl's parents raised her wrong to behave like that.
    Stipulated.

    Also, that cop's parents raised him wrong and his department trained him wrong.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bocephus Jones II
    Supposedly the girl that was originally arrested has a history of resisting arrest.
    Sheesh. I wonder how many times she has been punched by an officer after crossing against a light.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snakebit
    Ain't nothing to tollerate. The physical part of it was all their fault. I was 19 once and I knew better than to behave like that. They got arrested for the physical aspect that they initiated, not jaywalking if that was indeed all it was about. Shut your mouth, take your ticket and get on with whatever it was you were doing. The cop did his job, period.
    Damn...I actually am agreeing with Snake here. Back in the day when I was a teenager we'd get pulled over by the cops on occasion for various whatnot--the only people I ever knew that were actually arrested were the idiots that lipped off or tried to be a tough guy. If you were nice and respectful you generally were let off with a warning--at the worst you got a ticket.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeanutButterBreath
    Stipulated.

    Also, that cop's parents raised him wrong and his department trained him wrong.
    Not saying the cop punching her was the "best" move he could have made, but in the circumstances I can see why it happened and I don't think it was unjustified. This isn't a Rodney King situation IMO.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

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