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  1. #1
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    TRANSPLANTS: Would you accept a transplanted organ from a criminal?

    Here is a link to an article about research that indicated that some people would be "creeped out" by accepting an organ donation from a criminal or an animal. Would you accept an organ donated by a criminal? | Michigan Today We are not talking about organs being harvested on an as needed basis from people who are executed (something that China once was rumored to do). But, a normal transplant. I have never thought about it. But, it would not bother me to have a transplant from a criminal or an animal. Back in the 1980s, my father had heart replacement surgery that included tissue transplanted from a pig. He actually got great amusement from the fact and would make jokes about having a permanent supply of bacon inside his body. What is your take on this?
    I try to be perfectly civil, until someone really pisses me off.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkS View Post
    Here is a link to an article about research that indicated that some people would be "creeped out" by accepting an organ donation from a criminal or an animal. Would you accept an organ donated by a criminal? | Michigan Today We are not talking about organs being harvested on an as needed basis from people who are executed (something that China once was rumored to do). But, a normal transplant. I have never thought about it. But, it would not bother me to have a transplant from a criminal or an animal. Back in the 1980s, my father had heart replacement surgery that included tissue transplanted from a pig. He actually got great amusement from the fact and would make jokes about having a permanent supply of bacon inside his body. What is your take on this?
    Meh, a heart that functions is better than one that don't no matter the source.

  3. #3
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    I have some experience in this area.

    The problem with any cadaver organ is that you can't know the lifestyle of the donor. You may get lucky and receive from a non-smoker/drug free/healthy eater or you could get the opposite from a drug user that wrecked their body. How many "criminals" live a healthy lifestyle?
    I wonder how the medics choose/screen which organs to transplant. Do they refuse those from suspected abusers?

    But if you're in desperate need would you turn down any organ?
    "When you know absolutely nothing, anyone who knows 1% more than nothing sounds like an expert."

  4. #4
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    Dr. Frederick Frankenstein: [to Igor] Now that brain that you gave me. Was it Hans Delbruck's?
    Igor: [pause, then] No.
    Dr. Frederick Frankenstein: Ah! Very good. Would you mind telling me whose brain I DID put in?
    Igor: Then you won't be angry?
    Dr. Frederick Frankenstein: I will NOT be angry.
    Igor: Abby someone.
    Dr. Frederick Frankenstein: [pause, then] Abby someone. Abby who?
    Igor: Abby... Normal.
    Dr. Frederick Frankenstein: [pause, then] Abby Normal?
    Igor: I'm almost sure that was the name.
    Dr. Frederick Frankenstein: [chuckles, then] Are you saying that I put an abnormal brain into a seven and a half foot long, fifty-four inch wide GORILLA?
    [grabs Igor and starts throttling him]

  5. #5
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    The donor would make ZERO difference to me, unless we are talking about a brain transplant - which might be possible one day.
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  6. #6
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    What about the flipside- would you still donate an organ if somehow you knew the recipient was a criminal? What if the guy had a functioning artificial heart, but is rich enough to upgrade to a real one if he wants? Would you rather your heart went instead to someone who needed it more badly but wasn't rich enough to jump to the front of the line?

  7. #7
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    would you still donate an organ if somehow you knew the recipient was a criminal?

    It's why these things are anonymous. No matter WHO the recipient is, you could find fault with him/her. NOBODY would get transplants!!

    I'm all about giving blood, but it never occured to me that the recipients might be "unworthy" somehow. Maybe there's a drug dealer walking around with my blood right now? I don't waste time thinking about it.

    An organ is a whole different commitment, of course, but I'd still like to donate my usable organs when I die. If somebody needs it, great, have at it.

    That said, I have a hard time when people suggest going to see the Bodies exhibit, since I heard those are the bodies of prisoners, or something like that. Wouldn't surprise me if they were killed specifically for the purpose of a money-making exhibit, though I doubt THAT is the case! Still bothers me.

  8. #8
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    I have someones ACL.. who cares as long as it works

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy99CL View Post
    I have some experience in this area.

    The problem with any cadaver organ is that you can't know the lifestyle of the donor. You may get lucky and receive from a non-smoker/drug free/healthy eater or you could get the opposite from a drug user that wrecked their body. How many "criminals" live a healthy lifestyle?
    I wonder how the medics choose/screen which organs to transplant. Do they refuse those from suspected abusers?

    But if you're in desperate need would you turn down any organ?
    I believe the screening methods are better than they used to be, at least I hope so. A friend of mine received a kidney transplant 20+ years ago. A few years after her transplant, she developed hepatitis -- turns out her donor had it.
    It's all fun and games until someone ends up in a cone.

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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by serious View Post
    The donor would make ZERO difference to me, unless we are talking about a brain transplant - which might be possible one day.
    That's might take as well.

    I know pretty weird, but I told my wife, if I die, donate all my organs, expect my brain. Just kind of creeps me out to think I could "wake up" years from now in some other body and life.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christine View Post
    That said, I have a hard time when people suggest going to see the Bodies exhibit, since I heard those are the bodies of prisoners, or something like that. Wouldn't surprise me if they were killed specifically for the purpose of a money-making exhibit, though I doubt THAT is the case! Still bothers me.
    Yes, they're Chinese political prisoners. When they're "disappeared" the State sells their remains to these plasticizer workshops. Saw a story on 60 Minutes or similar show about it- the guy that ran the plasticizer workshop apologized and seemed genuinely remorseful. No word at all from Chinese gov't.

  12. #12
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    My remains are going to be donated to my alma matter's Medical School. I know that it will make a difference, helping to teach Doctors who then help others.

    It was a hard decision, getting over the ick factor.

    But my mother came to me in a vision. She was drunk, chain smoking. She slurred 'what the f&ck do you care? You'll be dead. Are you missing the point of dead?'

    So now I'm at peace with my decision.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. He will only drag you down to his level and beat you on experience." (Twain)

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  13. #13
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    I donated part of my liver to a friend. He was a fat, overweight guy who collected stamps. He now rides a road bike and makes smart-assed remarks on stamp collecting message boards.

    If I needed an organ and it was medically certified I don't where it came from, as long as it would keep me going.
    "I felt bad because I couldn't wheelie; until I met a man with no bicycle"

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by dougclaysmith View Post
    That's might take as well.

    I know pretty weird, but I told my wife, if I die, donate all my organs, expect my brain. Just kind of creeps me out to think I could "wake up" years from now in some other body and life.
    I think the brain transplant thing is pretty much beyond the purpose of transplants. They are intended to lengthen a life. a new brain would either be blank or would ultimately be someone else which would equate to a body transplant for the owner of the brain. In either case, this old body is probably never going to be a good candidate. I've about used it up. My brain, however, is hardly used.

  15. #15
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    Yea, I won't go see those exhibits precisely because I think there is zero chance there was informed consent for those people.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy99CL View Post
    The problem with any cadaver organ is that you can't know the lifestyle of the donor.
    I can say that prisoners generally are considered elderly at the age of 50. That accelerated aging, the early onset of diseases of aging, is generally due to the life they have led.
    .
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  17. #17
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    I can't imagine that such a program would be coercion free. There is a whole literature on the issue of consent, and how it is unlikely to be voluntary and free of coercion, when dealing with prisoners. In fact, many IRBs consider it to be virtually impossible.

    For example:

    The primary issue surrounding the participation of prisoners in research has always been whether prisoners have a real choice regarding their participation in research, or whether their situation prohibits the exercise of free choice. A secondary issue is whether confidentiality of participation and of data can be adequately maintained in the prison.

    The circumstances common in prisons create environments in which the offer to participate in research is necessarily coercive or creates a undue influence in favor of participation. To the extent that living conditions in prison are bad and the provision of health care is minimal or even nonexistent, the lack of control allowed prisoners and the desire to obtain the advantages offered to those who agree to participate may preclude their ability to weigh fairly the risks and benefits involved in participation. For example, the investigator may propose to move the research participants to special units where they are given medical care and where the living conditions are better than those provided to the general prison population. Another coercive situation would be where prisoners must earn money to purchase the means by which to maintain their health and personal hygiene, and one way to earn that money is by participating in research. Other rewards for participation, such as offering parole or a reduction in sentence, would constitute an undue inducement. Even the opportunity to leave the prison cell and interact with people from outside the prison may act as an undue inducement to participate in research.
    IRB Guidebook: Chapter VIii Special Classes of Subjects (HHS pdf)
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by dougclaysmith View Post
    Just kind of creeps me out to think I could "wake up" years from now in some other body and life.
    You must be young, right?
    At 61 I'd love to wake up in an 18 year old body!
    "When you know absolutely nothing, anyone who knows 1% more than nothing sounds like an expert."

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy99CL View Post
    You must be young, right?
    At 61 I'd love to wake up in an 18 year old body!
    Either sex?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuiQuaeQuod View Post
    I can say that prisoners generally are considered elderly at the age of 50. That accelerated aging, the early onset of diseases of aging, is generally due to the life they have led.
    Sort of like parenthood, huh?

  21. #21
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    My remains are going to be donated to my alma matter's Medical School

    I tried filling out the online DMV organ-donor form, but kept going in circles with it- will have to get the paper version. Ideally, part myself out, then buried w/o a casket in a shallowish grave, to rejoin nature. Or cremated, since that's probably all that's allowed!

    The other night, saw an episode of Larry the Cable Guy (of all things) where he visited a "body farm," where forensic students study the effects of decomposition. Apparently, these "farms" have plenty of body donors, but there are only a couple in existence due to shortage of land for the purpose!

    The students are all women, b/c men seem to be too squeamish to handle the work. They treated the bodies with care and respect- it's part of the job in any case! I thought, that's not so bad, either.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy99CL View Post
    You must be young, right?
    At 61 I'd love to wake up in an 18 year old body!
    For years I often woke up inside a beautiful young womans' body. Then she divorced me.
    "When you know absolutely nothing, anyone who knows 1% more than nothing sounds like an expert."

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dougclaysmith View Post
    ..I know pretty weird, but I told my wife, if I die, donate all my organs, expect my brain. Just kind of creeps me out to think I could "wake up" years from now in some other body and life.
    Quote Originally Posted by Randy99CL View Post
    You must be young, right?
    At 61 I'd love to wake up in an 18 year old body!
    LOL. Also older [here].... and it seems I have woke up in different bodies and life's a few times already. The body I woke up in today is a lot better the one I was waking up in 5... or even 10 years ago. And there had been changes before then too.

    People make choices everyday... people in prison made at least one really bad choice. Often drugs are involved... they're just people too... like the rest of us. Needed spare parts.... are what they are. It doesn't matter where the parts came from.
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  24. #24
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    Re: TRANSPLANTS: Would you accept a transplanted organ from a criminal?

    Quote Originally Posted by serious View Post
    The donor would make ZERO difference to me, unless we are talking about a brain transplant - which might be possible one day.
    Wouldn't that be a body transplant? I think at the point of moving the brain the person is gaining a body, not losing a brain. If there is one thing YOU ARE, it's your brain.

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