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Pillar to Post Race - My Disappointing Experience

3K views 23 replies 16 participants last post by  BrokenSpoke 
#1 ·
I just wanted to share my feelings about the experience I had trying to participate in my first race. Here's the letter I wrote to the event promoters and sponsors:

To Whom it May Concern -

I just wanted to write to express the extremely disappointing experience I had trying to participate in your race.

I am a recreational rider whose favorite ride is Lookout Mountain. When I heard about the Pillar to Post race I thought it would be an excellent introduction into the world of racing. After exploring the ACA and SEAR cycling websites, I got the feeling that the organizations as a whole welcomed new riders and wanted to introduce the sport to as many people as possible.

I looked forward to this race for over a month - there was even the added bonus of it taking place on my birthday - what a great gift! I got up early this morning and went over my bike with a fine tooth comb to prepare for the race. My girlfriend cooked me a wonderful pre-race breakfast.

I set off for the start on my bike bringing only my ID and enough money for a Clifbar, $5.00 for what I thought the entry cost would be for a Citizen, and $10.00 to spare. Unfortunately I read the entry instructions wrong and didn't bring enough money to the start of the race - I was $14.00 short. After arriving at the start, the people helping at the entry desk were very helpful and sympathetic that I didn't have enough money. They were so helpful - they referred me to an older lady who was apparently in charge. I asked her if it would be possible for me to leave my ID and pay after the race (my girlfriend was going to meet me at the top after the race). She asked me what class I was racing and I told her Citizen. After she heard that she said, "ABSOLUTELY NOT!" She would only consider it if I were an ACA member. I was stunned. Not only was she unsympathetic and rude, but she gave the impression that I wasn't worthy enough of a break because I wasn't an elite racer - I was only racing Citizen class.

I understand that it is my responsibility to read the entry instructions and I should have been better prepared by bringing more money, but I was really hurt and disappointed at the way I was treated by the older lady in charge. I really have the impression that the race, its promoters, and its sponsors are only concerned about collecting the entry fees and not about promoting the sport of cycling and introducing such a wonderful sport to as many as people as possible.

Sincerely,

Geoff Warner
Wheat Ridge, Colorado
 
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#2 ·
Geoff, my man, you misread the entry form. If you misread the menu at McDonalds, would you send them a letter like this expressing your outrage at not giving you food in exchange for leaving your ID and a promise to pay later? I wouldn't. So your letter is pretty silly in that respect and I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you, waiting for a gracious apology for your goof.

Promoters aren't getting rich off of promoting. Now you know how much it costs and you'll be prepared next time. The only reason I could see for extending the courtesy to an "elite" racer is that these are the folks that the promoters see week in and week out and they know them. The likelihood of getting stiffed is much less than if it's some dude out for his first race.

Personally, I always try to have the entry form filled out, a check written and my license paperclipped to them the night before the race. Just minimizes the stress.

Let it go, be prepared next time, and come out and race!
 
#4 ·
First of all Geoff, I rode for the SEAR team last year when I lived in Colorado and they are an absolutely great group of people. They are, in fact, dedicated to helping new people get into the sport. They are partly a developmental team and they truly have developed many young riders in the front range area who rode for them for a few years, learned how to race, and then moved on to elite teams in the area such as Vitamin Cottage. There is a core group of Masters riders on that team (Marty, Paul, Train, D-cup, you know who you are) that go out of their way to help young riders and I can tell you they helped me out immensely as well. I was primarily a mountain biker who wanted to get into road racing and the SEAR team was instrumental to me making that transition.

Next, I will tell you that I worked the Lookout mountain hill climb myself last year at the registration desk. There was one specific incident that occurred where an un-attached Cat 4 showed up just before the race was about to start (Cat 4 in Colorado is as low as they go, they don't have a Cat 5 for ACA, or didn't last year anyway). He said that he had mailed in his pre-registration although we didn't have it. Now this has happened to me personally when racing myself so I ALWAYS bring my checkbook to the registration booth even when I have pre-registered. But I felt bad for the guy so I let him race. Guess what? We never got his check.

So finally Geoff I do feel bad for you that you fu&^ed up and didn't get to race. It really sucks for you to have gone through all that preparation and then make a stupid mental error on race day. We have all been there and you obviously won't make this mistake again. But don't criticize the race promotors for not cutting you some slack and doing you a favor. Sure it would have been nice for them to do that but they don't know you and had no guarantees that they'd ever get their money from you. It's called personal responsibility Geoff and you'd do well to try to develop some for yourself. This board is not the place to come if you are looking for some people to hold your hand and cry with you about the in-justice of the race-promotors in Colorado. Go to the Pearl street mall in Boulder and find some hippies to take some bong rips with if that is what you need. Just go ride your bike and quit being such a freakin' pansy.
 
#6 ·
Huh, you screwed up numerous times and expected other people to bail you out, and then whined here when they didn't?

Take personal responsibility for your lack of attention to detail.

Further, even though you have no proof other then your vague impressions (based on what- you have never even raced before!) that they wouldn't bail you out because you were new- you try and slag them here?

Well, the long train of responses should be a real eye opener for you.
 
#8 ·
Ouch.

I'm not looking for sympathy or anything like that, I was just looking to express my disappointment.

I agree I should have been better prepared. I agree that I learned my lesson. I agree that I should have known that racing is more expensive than the $17.00 I carried with me to the start. I guess I just felt that I should have been treated better by a representative of the race and its sponsors - or maybe I'm wrong. The consensus seems to be that I'm out of line for feeling like I was mistreated. I appreciate all the responses - maybe I do need to get real.

Geoff
 
#9 ·
Ouch indeed!

NoCoasting said:
I'm not looking for sympathy or anything like that, I was just looking to express my disappointment.

I agree I should have been better prepared. I agree that I learned my lesson. I agree that I should have known that racing is more expensive than the $17.00 I carried with me to the start. I guess I just felt that I should have been treated better by a representative of the race and its sponsors - or maybe I'm wrong. The consensus seems to be that I'm out of line for feeling like I was mistreated. I appreciate all the responses - maybe I do need to get real.

Geoff
Wow. Although the responses above appear to be correct they also seem to be a little harsh. You are admittedly extremely new to the sport. While we all try to promote the sport as best possible you have to understand that races can be hectic events especially for the promoter if they are a little terse it's understandable. Because you're not an ACA member there is no way to track you down in case you forget to come back and drop off the check. You may have noticed that the race was not attended in great numbers so every dollar counted.

It sounds to me like you had a great race experience, you didn't bring enough money- I've done that, you were treated coarsely by an official - I've had that happen (who hasn't, it's part of racing), nobody cut you any slack for your mistake - hey me too. So do you slink off or do you come back, fight and do it right?

With this in mind you may want to attempt to get the letter that you sent to the promoter back and instead ask them if you could join them on a group ride so you can actually learn about racing so you don't make all the rookie errors on your own.

Incidentally, did you compare your best time to the times the citizens posted?
 
#11 ·
I'm on NoCoasting's side

I started racing a few months ago, and from my experiences, I think there are a lot of things broken with how beginner road racing is handled in the US. It seems that every time a beginner posts up a bad first-time experience on this board, the reaction of many posters is to say, "You mean you didn't know X, Y, or Z??? Then it was YOUR FAULT!!" Hold on a sec ... the point of being a beginner is that it's a learning experience. You're not *supposed* to know everything from the start. Every time a beginner gets turned away by a bad first race experience (or by the attitude of others) that hurts cycling as a whole. Sports are like pyramids -- the bigger the base of beginners the higher and larger the top end of elite riders. Which means it's everyone's responsiblity and "fault" to make it easier for beginner racers.

To NoCoasting: Man, it really sucks that your first race turned out so poorly, especially on your birthday. If it's any consolation, I screwed up my first race too, so do a lot of people. Give it another shot -- after two or three events you'll have most of the logistics worked out. Tell yourself whatever you need about the race organizers that will get you out there again. Don't be surprised, though, if you bump into the same woman two or three races down the road and find out she's just a harried race-day volunteer. The best advice I received after fudging my first race was to look for a local "training race" series -- slightly more forgiving environment, lower entry fees, and more frequent races to give you experience quickly. Ask at your shop or try some web searches. If you want to read about my and another guy's first race, search the board on "wake habitat" and read the posts that pop up.
 
#12 ·
ahaile said:
I started racing a few months ago, and from my experiences, I think there are a lot of things broken with how beginner road racing is handled in the US. It seems that every time a beginner posts up a bad first-time experience on this board, the reaction of many posters is to say, "You mean you didn't know X, Y, or Z??? Then it was YOUR FAULT!!" Hold on a sec ... the point of being a beginner is that it's a learning experience. You're not *supposed* to know everything from the start. Every time a beginner gets turned away by a bad first race experience (or by the attitude of others) that hurts cycling as a whole. Sports are like pyramids -- the bigger the base of beginners the higher and larger the top end of elite riders. Which means it's everyone's responsiblity and "fault" to make it easier for beginner racers.

To NoCoasting: Man, it really sucks that your first race turned out so poorly, especially on your birthday. If it's any consolation, I screwed up my first race too, so do a lot of people. Give it another shot -- after two or three events you'll have most of the logistics worked out. Tell yourself whatever you need about the race organizers that will get you out there again. Don't be surprised, though, if you bump into the same woman two or three races down the road and find out she's just a harried race-day volunteer. The best advice I received after fudging my first race was to look for a local "training race" series -- slightly more forgiving environment, lower entry fees, and more frequent races to give you experience quickly. Ask at your shop or try some web searches. If you want to read about my and another guy's first race, search the board on "wake habitat" and read the posts that pop up.
I agree...what would it have hurt the promoter to have one more citizen in the race? Why not take a chance? I'm guessing the odds were pretty good he'd have sent in the money. And if not what would they be out? A bib and some pins? Maybe a water bottle? They were running the race anyway with or without him. Why not give the newbie a break and let him race? It's not like Citizen's gives out prize money anyway. Probably just a certificate.
 
#13 ·
Bocephus Jones said:
And if not what would they be out? A bib and some pins? Maybe a water bottle?
No, they would have been out cash from their own pocket. If the rider doesn't pay for himself, the promoter would have to pay the insurance charge, the 1-day license fee, the ACA operational surcharge, and the BRAC surcharge (if there still is one). These are all calculated based on the number of racers.
 
#14 ·
asgelle said:
No, they would have been out cash from their own pocket. If the rider doesn't pay for himself, the promoter would have to pay the insurance charge, the 1-day license fee, the ACA operational surcharge, and the BRAC surcharge (if there still is one). These are all calculated based on the number of racers.
wouldn't the $15 the guy had on him have at least covered that?
 
#16 ·
Confusing flyer

Out of curiosity I downloaded the race flyer for this race, and I have to say, the statement about entry fees is poorly written and confusing:

<quote>Entry Fees: This is an ACA race. ACA membership is required. All senior riders pay $20. Racers 18 and under are free. Entry fees include ACA operation & insurance surcharges. One-day ACA membership is available for $5. There are no late fees and no Refunds (Citizens must purchase a one-day license).</quote>

All the information is there, but it's so scrambled around that it's hard to figure out the logic. Trying to read it with complete newbie eyes (i.e., as someone who didn't already know that citizen races always have two fees, a race entry fee and a one-day license fee), I think I would have read it as meaning this: "To enter the race you must join the ACA. Senior (meaining experienced) riders pay $20 for a membership, under 18 is free, and citizen racers pay $5 to join the ACA for a day." I can see why NoCoasting thought his total cost would be only $5.
 
#17 ·
My Take

I am on the side of NoCoasting. I have worked the regestration table many times and this type of thing DOES happen. I will let a rider go with a promise to pay, if and only if, he/she leaves his/her drivers license. I have yet to have someone fail to recalim his/her license. It appears form the letter that he did offer to leave his ID. In my opinion, SEAR showed poor judgement and should have handled it different.
 
#18 ·
confusing indeed

It kinda seems that the ACA and/or the local promoters don't try very hard to encourage Cat 4s - or new riders to the area for that matter. I got an earfull on Saturday from a guy who just moved here from Houston.

I, too, spent the first year I lived here getting lost and driving in circles going to races. I still fear and loathe going to Golden to try to locate any race course there, even the ones I've been to enough times to have a general sense of where I'm going. And I'm not terribly directionally challenged, either. The directions on our local race flyers are just plain vague. These guys probably just assume everyone else has been coming to the same races for the past dozen years that they have. If you don't know where it is, then they're not going to bother telling you. I guess it's one way to eliminate the competition. Half the time it's like they forget folks may be coming from more than one direction. If it's a Denver club, they don't give insightful directions from Boulder or Ft. Collins and vice versa. It's like they should award extra BAR/BAT points to first-year or out-of-area racers, just for finding the damn venues.

Not to mention you can forget about any kind of logical, user-friendly or centralised online type info warehouse. You have your choice of the ACA site; a hand-coded .html text aesthetic circa 1994 with mediocre knowledge transfer, no pithy "new rider" or training / coaching article archive, plenty of kludgy PDF downloads and limited info on how to contact your local ACA club (many of the links are obsolete, most are nonexistent). If that doesn't float your boat, there's any one of a dozen local club and/or promoters' sites, none of which have been updated for the past six months. By January, the current crop will all be defunct, and you'll have a dozen more new sites with pretty homepage graphics, some promising content, a wealth of "under construction" pages, and three or four dozen blurry digital pics of guys wearing their teamkit. These will languish until June, at which point they'll post a couple of "State Champion" news flashes and be done with it.

You're better off using Truesport, quite frankly. At least they have a comprehensive Rocky Mountain racing calendar that includes all area ACA, USCF, NCCA and NORBA events they can get their grubby little paws on, despite the fact that they're based out of Indianapolis. Given the chance, Truesport will even tie the event link to the promoter's own dynamic website for the race, something the ACA still doesn't quite grasp. Case in point: Estes Park Stage Race. The ACA listing is a 1-page static PDF flyer. The Truesport calendar link navigates you directly into Todd Plummer's Estes Cycling Classic website, giving you a full race bible with course maps and profiles, prize matrix, rules, start lists, and lots of other details that were left off the flyer.

To their credit, these guys out here do hold a lot of races. My advise to any new Front Range area racer is to hie thee unto a local team ASAP and car pool to events with someone more experienced. It'll help with the whole learning curve deal.
 
#19 ·
BrokenSpoke said:
I am on the side of NoCoasting. I have worked the regestration table many times and this type of thing DOES happen. I will let a rider go with a promise to pay, if and only if, he/she leaves his/her drivers license. I have yet to have someone fail to recalim his/her license. It appears form the letter that he did offer to leave his ID. In my opinion, SEAR showed poor judgement and should have handled it different.

I am going to guess that no pay equals not insured, equals huge liability if they cause/have an accident.
 
#20 ·
I don't think so.

Tri_Rich said:
I am going to guess that no pay equals not insured, equals huge liability if they cause/have an accident.
It really comes down to the release for insurance coverage. The fees are pooled so a race that has 200 racers is charged x amount by the ACA regardless of where the money comes from.

A lot of people that volunteer get free entry.

I wonder who that woman was. Was she an ACA official or promoter?
 
#21 ·
Not True

Tri_Rich said:
I am going to guess that no pay equals not insured, equals huge liability if they cause/have an accident.
The riders still fill out all the required paperwork, entry form, one day license if needed, and sign everything just as they would if they had the correct amount of cash with them. This way they are covered in case of injury. All that happens is that the entry fee is temporarily comped, just like we do for team members who are working the race and also racing that day.

By holding the drivers license, I hope to get the rider to honor his/her promise to return with the money for the race fee. Has worked every time so far.
 
#22 ·
BrokenSpoke said:
The riders still fill out all the required paperwork, entry form, one day license if needed, and sign everything just as they would if they had the correct amount of cash with them. This way they are covered in case of injury. All that happens is that the entry fee is temporarily comped, just like we do for team members who are working the race and also racing that day.

By holding the drivers license, I hope to get the rider to honor his/her promise to return with the money for the race fee. Has worked every time so far.
You would think that would be the case but insurance companies will be less than willing to pay if they don't have to. Additionally witness the situation in triathlon from a year ago when a racer racing under someone else's name was injured and then sued the race since they had not signed an official waiver.
It is unfortunate but with a citizen this kind of situation would be more likely to occur.
 
#23 ·
Tri_Rich said:
You would think that would be the case but insurance companies will be less than willing to pay if they don't have to. Additionally witness the situation in triathlon from a year ago when a racer racing under someone else's name was injured and then sued the race since they had not signed an official waiver.
It is unfortunate but with a citizen this kind of situation would be more likely to occur.
This is why every entrant must fill out an accurate release, but the issue here is who pays for the insurance. The insurance company doesn't get its payment from each individual rider. The promoter pays the permitting organization based on the number of riders and the organization pays the insurance company. Whether any one rider pays the insurance premium or not is irrelevant as long as the premium for all riders is payed.
 
#24 ·
Tri_Rich said:
You would think that would be the case but insurance companies will be less than willing to pay if they don't have to. Additionally witness the situation in triathlon from a year ago when a racer racing under someone else's name was injured and then sued the race since they had not signed an official waiver.
It is unfortunate but with a citizen this kind of situation would be more likely to occur.
That would be true. But in this instance, NoCoasting had filled out the required paperwork, entry form, waiver, one day license, etc.. and simply did not have enough cash. He offered to leave his ID as a promise to return after the race with payment. He was not attempting to race under someone elses name. I still think SEAR should have handled it differently. All too often clubs/teams take the high and mighty road when a little compassion and common sense would go a long way.
 
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