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  1. #1
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    Training beyond the limit...helpful?

    Is it helpful to do hill repeats where I explode and then keep pushing as hard as I can over the top?

    Or is it better to just stay just under exploding and finish the hill?

  2. #2
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    So many ways to do a hill, and different ways of doing them at different times of the year.

    Base Periods: Spin up hills zone 2 during long rides. Intervals up hills zone 3 or 4. (depending on period)
    Build Periods: Spin uphils zone 2 during rides. Intervals up hills zone 4,5, or 6.

    Zone 6 hills is the one I start and end with sprint. Seems good to practice because in Masters racing (even when I raced Masters cat 4-5), every critical crest seems to have a sprint on top to create a break.

    VO2max intervals is probably also good to end with sprint, since this looks like most race files, at least in my area.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by rs_herhuth View Post
    Is it helpful to do hill repeats where I explode and then keep pushing as hard as I can over the top?

    Or is it better to just stay just under exploding and finish the hill?
    Nothing wrong with this as long as it does not become a habit to effectively misjudge the effort. Occasionally I blow up during a CP20 or some other interval and although the temptation is there to just stop, I prefer to finish the interval with lowering power output just enough to stay alive. But again, this should be the exception.
    My rides:
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  4. #4
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    There was a good thread a while back that I can't seem to find, but it was a link to a blog post about how to correctly do hill intervals. The gist of it was that many people start too hard and "blow up" during the interval. Their power output for the duration of the interval looks like a huge spike, then dramatically falls off. What a lot of coaches and trainers say to do instead is progressively increase your output/effort during the interval. So if your hill interval is 3:30 maybe something like 70% the first couple minutes, 80% perceived effort the third minute and all out (100%) for the last :30 which is the part where you jump out of the saddle and sprint.

    Like Ponch posted a lot of riders die going over the top of a hill, as others accelerate away.

    In terms of the hill what I like is one that starts off a little steeper, then flattens a bit, then ramps up again. This way the grade makes me work hard at the bottom, I can then shift onto the big ring as it eases up and finally continue sprinting in the big ring as it ramps up again at the end. I just find a constant steep grade to be difficult to get the most from intervals.
    miles to posts ratio is > 30:1

  5. #5
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    I think this also dabbles into the philosphy of separating different efforts versus combining them.

    i.e., instead of doing a long climb, and then ending in a sprint, have a dedicated climb day with flat power output (like the article Kris talks about), and have a dedicated sprint day where you concentrate on breaking 1000W each sprint (for example).

    Seems like most coaches like separation for interval work and sprints. Like the old rule: "if you don't ride at 30mph, then you'll never go 30mph"...or....(my throught here) "if you never break 1000W, then you will never break 1000W".

    Very hard to hit your true peak wattage after you've been climbing at Vo2max for 3 minutes (for example).

  6. #6
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    Great points. If you can do both types of intervals you can respond to the surges and stay up front the last couple k of a race when the pace cranks up, and still have a sprint left in the legs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Poncharelli View Post
    I think this also dabbles into the philosphy of separating different efforts versus combining them.

    i.e., instead of doing a long climb, and then ending in a sprint, have a dedicated climb day with flat power output (like the article Kris talks about), and have a dedicated sprint day where you concentrate on breaking 1000W each sprint (for example).

    Seems like most coaches like separation for interval work and sprints. Like the old rule: "if you don't ride at 30mph, then you'll never go 30mph"...or....(my throught here) "if you never break 1000W, then you will never break 1000W".

    Very hard to hit your true peak wattage after you've been climbing at Vo2max for 3 minutes (for example).
    miles to posts ratio is > 30:1

  7. #7
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    In terms of improving fitness if you're doing repeats, I would target an effort slightly under blowing up. Once you've blown up your day is likely over for good training, plus most of the training benefits from the higher level effort are available at a sweat spot just a tick below.

  8. #8
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    Both Carmichael and Friel i believe say if you are not hitting your target for an interval, bag it. You are not effectively doing what you intended for your day's workout.
    Cook

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