Two Tour stages to be run without radios

[Creakyknees]

YEAH!!!!11!11!!!!!1

2 not-so-flat stages.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/two-...without-radios

This will be interesting...

[that guy again]

I am very much in favor of this. I think the radios are the number one thing making cycling less fun from a spectating point of view. Let them have all the techno-wiz-bang bikes they want, but don't take away the strategy by letting someone in a car determine what happens in a race.

[loudog]

this is pretty cool.

[brentster]

Should be pretty interesting.

[Sojourneyman]

One of the days is Bastille day...seems like they're fishing for a frenchman win

[harlond]

Originally Posted by Sojourneyman

One of the days is Bastille day...seems like they're fishing for a frenchman win

How will the absence of radios enhance French chances?

[Andrew1]

Originally Posted by harlond

How will the absence of radios enhance French chances?

Lots of Frenchies in a big breakaway + no radio = less information and coordination among the teams of the sprinters (with regards to time gaps, names of riders in the break etc), leading to a higher probability of the break staying away.

[den bakker]

Originally Posted by Creakyknees

YEAH!!!!11!11!!!!!1

2 flat stages.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/two-...without-radios

This will be interesting...

flat?

[mohair_chair]

It doesn't say what the penalty is for using a radio. If it is only a small fine, like for wearing an unapproved jersey, then I expect teams to ignore the rule.

[Creakyknees]

on closer reading, the UCI approved the possibility, but ASO hasn't said it's definite yet.

that stage profile looks perfect for a break to stay away, even with radios

[wetpaint]

I'm excited to see this, I hate it how they can reel the break in at 5k to go with radios. Hopefully it will make the riders make decisions rather than the team car making them for them

[weltyed]

i dont know if any team would let a break get away on these days. knowing that you wont be able to know when to reel people in might make the group chase every break that tries to form.

or some underthetable deals could be made that morning...

astana better hope horner is up and riding again...

[harlond]

It seems to be an article of faith with many people that radios reduce the chances of successful breakaways. But in the recently-concluded Giro, 5 stages were won by riders in a breakaway. When you eliminate the mountaintop finishes and the time trials, half of the stages were won on breakaways. In the recently concluded Dauphine, 4 of 6 non-TT stages were won on breakaways. If the use of radios is preventing breakaways, it's hard to see from these examples.

If you have lots of French riders in the breakaway, that obviously increases the chances of a French winner. If the sprinters' teams don't cooperate, that increases the chance of a breakaway winner. But that's true irrespective of whether you have radios.

Many informed people believe radios are a problem, so I'm probably just missing the boat here, but the case that they are suppressing breakaways doesn't seem very compelling to me.

[ronbo613]

They'll just use cell phones instead.

[weltyed]

while stages may have been won by breakaways, the race was not decided by breakaways. the group was able to limit the damage done by the breakaways without having to shut them down completely.

riders will still be able to get general race info by going back to team cars. so this will really put the hurt on teh water carriers.

Originally Posted by harlond

It seems to be an article of faith with many people that radios reduce the chances of successful breakaways. But in the recently-concluded Giro, 5 stages were won by riders in a breakaway. When you eliminate the mountaintop finishes and the time trials, half of the stages were won on breakaways. In the recently concluded Dauphine, 4 of 6 non-TT stages were won on breakaways. If the use of radios is preventing breakaways, it's hard to see from these examples.

If you have lots of French riders in the breakaway, that obviously increases the chances of a French winner. If the sprinters' teams don't cooperate, that increases the chance of a breakaway winner. But that's true irrespective of whether you have radios.

Many informed people believe radios are a problem, so I'm probably just missing the boat here, but the case that they are suppressing breakaways doesn't seem very compelling to me.

[Creakyknees]

Originally Posted by harlond

It seems to be an article of faith with many people that radios reduce the chances of successful breakaways. But in the recently-concluded Giro, 5 stages were won by riders in a breakaway. When you eliminate the mountaintop finishes and the time trials, half of the stages were won on breakaways. In the recently concluded Dauphine, 4 of 6 non-TT stages were won on breakaways. If the use of radios is preventing breakaways, it's hard to see from these examples.

If you have lots of French riders in the breakaway, that obviously increases the chances of a French winner. If the sprinters' teams don't cooperate, that increases the chance of a breakaway winner. But that's true irrespective of whether you have radios.

Many informed people believe radios are a problem, so I'm probably just missing the boat here, but the case that they are suppressing breakaways doesn't seem very compelling to me.

It's not that breaks never succeed; it's more that only certain types of breaks, with certain types of riders, on certain types of stages. It's predictable: the stage profile has to be just right, the mix of riders in the break can't have any gc danger men, etc.

And it's also a case of the team leaders, gc contenders, not having to really risk anything on most days.

I suspect that without radios, a break might go that contains danger men, and you'll see one or more gc contenders isolated, or gapped, or at the very least some awesome racing as people realize they've missed an important move and have to boogie.

[harlond]

Originally Posted by weltyed

while stages may have been won by breakaways, the race was not decided by breakaways. the group was able to limit the damage done by the breakaways without having to shut them down completely.

Is your contention that in the pre-radio era, the GC in stage races was more frequently decided by a breakaway, rather than by TTs and mountaintop finishes? If it was common for this happen, I don't know about it, which is certainly possible. Examples? I know about Pereiro (with radios) and Walkoviak (without, I suppose).

[den bakker]

Originally Posted by Creakyknees

It's not that breaks never succeed; it's more that only certain types of breaks, with certain types of riders, on certain types of stages. It's predictable: the stage profile has to be just right, the mix of riders in the break can't have any gc danger men, etc.

And it's also a case of the team leaders, gc contenders, not having to really risk anything on most days.

I suspect that without radios, a break might go that contains danger men, and you'll see one or more gc contenders isolated, or gapped, or at the very least some awesome racing as people realize they've missed an important move and have to boogie.

so the general assumption here is that the average team of cat 4 riders is better to see who goes up the road in a stage race than the pros?

[uzziefly]

Of course, this could mean they start hauling their asses off and chase the break like hell from the 50k mark (50k after the start, not 50k to go) and hence, no one gets away. Could make for a day of crazy intense pacing indeed.

[uzziefly]

Originally Posted by weltyed

i dont know if any team would let a break get away on these days. knowing that you wont be able to know when to reel people in might make the group chase every break that tries to form.

or some underthetable deals could be made that morning...

astana better hope horner is up and riding again...

Horner is in the selection but he's fighting for his spot together with 6 other riders for the 3 remaining places on the Astana squad.

6 confirmed: Lance, Alberto, Levi, Andreas, Yaroslav, Haimar.

Seems pretty much fair to me that those 6 are definitely in. Horner has Brajkovic and Noval and Paulinho (IIRC) to fight with amongst a few more.I'd say Horner should be the surest to get that one out of 3 remaining slots if he's recovered well enough.

I'm surprised Chechu isn't riding the Tour with Lance. Just thought he would. Guess he'd do the Vuelta instead. Either that or, he didn't wanna be part of a Tour in which Lance didn't win!

[muscleendurance]

This is a really interesting step in the right? direction, they're also even not ruling out the possibility of banning them from the whole tour that would really rufffle a few feathers of some trains I mean teams

[weltyed]

Originally Posted by harlond

Is your contention that in the pre-radio era, the GC in stage races was more frequently decided by a breakaway, rather than by TTs and mountaintop finishes? If it was common for this happen, I don't know about it, which is certainly possible. Examples? I know about Pereiro (with radios) and Walkoviak (without, I suppose).

i was speaking to this years giro, as someone else mentioned. breakways survived, but they werent race-breaking breakaways. if there were some GC contenders in those breaks, they would have chased harder. knowing there arent GC hopefuls in a break, you can chase just hard enough to limit the damage.

[bas]

Originally Posted by wetpaint

I'm excited to see this, I hate it how they can reel the break in at 5k to go with radios. Hopefully it will make the riders make decisions rather than the team car making them for them

Umm, won't the motorcycles be there showing time splits?

They'll know the gaps and stuff.

[pedalruns]

Originally Posted by bas

Umm, won't the motorcycles be there showing time splits?

They'll know the gaps and stuff.

Umm, yes........ but the riders will have to communicate this with each other, no team director to calculate times, rider names/teams etc and just give orders over the radio... they will have to THINK & make DECISIONS as well as ride. I think this will be great!

[den bakker]

Originally Posted by pedalruns

Umm, yes........ but the riders will have to communicate this with each other, no team director to calculate times, rider names/teams etc and just give orders over the radio... they will have to THINK & make DECISIONS as well as ride. I think this will be great!

this is not rocket surgery. you guys honestly believe a schleck or a contador can just slide away in a rogue break?