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  1. #1
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    2008 TOKEN T50 weights...

    I just weighed a pair of 2008 TOKEN T50 tublar wheels.

    Weight-

    Front: 624g
    Rear: 819g (campy so weight is a bit higher. (20+/-g)

    These are with Ceramic Hybrid Bearings and the nerwer desgined hubs.





    Wheels spin really nice in the tuing stand. The rear hub is pretty loud. Overall quality looks pretty good. Not the absolute best, best really nice.

    I have a RBR testing these as will post a ride report later. others here have them and reported back with a very positive feedback.

    I am going to get another pair for myself soon. For the price these go fo on a Full CF Tubular with Ceramic bearings is very nice.

    Any question let me know and I will do my best to answer.
    Last edited by DIRT BOY; 11-10-2007 at 06:22 AM.
    DIRT BOY

    "Pain is a big fat creature riding on your back. The farther you pedal, the heavier he feels. The harder you push, the tighter he squeezes your chest. The steeper the climb, the deeper he digs his jagged, sharp claws into your muscles." - Scott Martin


  2. #2
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    i cant believe anyone actually bothered to buy those wheels. i wouldnt ride em even if someone gave them to me-. they look cheap.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by swerv512
    i cant believe anyone actually bothered to buy those wheels. i wouldnt ride em even if someone gave them to me-. they look cheap.
    Hell, heck, I guess they are cheap, then. Thanks for clearing that up. I didn't realize you could learn so much and see so much detail--like construction quality, design quality--in low res forum photos. I hope the magazine testers learn this, 'cuz that'll save the publishers lots o' money since testing will only have to involve doing a Google image search.

    Or.........you really don't know what you're talking about and have no basis from which to make any informed judgement.

    It's likely those rims are seen branded as rims for companies with much more popular names. Same for the hubs. They appear to have CX-Rays or Aerolite spokes, likely the former. Sure the decals are ugly, but that's easy to fix.

    I wouldn't own them, but then I have different requirements for deep sectioned CF tubulars. For someone needing a less expensive aero tubular, these are probably a great buy. Their weight is a bit large, but weight matters so very little, unless most of your time is spent climbing 8-10+% grades.

    The simple fact is that things are getting better for people wanting aero rims/wheels because there are more than a few manufacturers in the Far East puttiing out damned fine/serviceable wheels at very nice prices. The technology is trickling down to the average cyclist very quickly.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forrest Root
    Hell, heck, I guess they are cheap, then. Thanks for clearing that up. I didn't realize you could learn so much and see so much detail--like construction quality, design quality--in low res forum photos. I hope the magazine testers learn this, 'cuz that'll save the publishers lots o' money since testing will only have to involve doing a Google image search.

    Or.........you really don't know what you're talking about and have no basis from which to make any informed judgement.

    It's likely those rims are seen branded as rims for companies with much more popular names. Same for the hubs. They appear to have CX-Rays or Aerolite spokes, likely the former. Sure the decals are ugly, but that's easy to fix.

    I wouldn't own them, but then I have different requirements for deep sectioned CF tubulars. For someone needing a less expensive aero tubular, these are probably a great buy. Their weight is a bit large, but weight matters so very little, unless most of your time is spent climbing 8-10+% grades.

    The simple fact is that things are getting better for people wanting aero rims/wheels because there are more than a few manufacturers in the Far East puttiing out damned fine/serviceable wheels at very nice prices. The technology is trickling down to the average cyclist very quickly.
    Yes, CX-Rays. Rims are the same as many, many other companies. Same with all the CF frames now, but wheels.
    Hubs are Joy-Tech.
    yes for what these wheels sell for, it's a great deal if they hold up and perform well.

    Sure they are not Lews, Lightweights or Zipps. But a lot less as well.
    DIRT BOY

    "Pain is a big fat creature riding on your back. The farther you pedal, the heavier he feels. The harder you push, the tighter he squeezes your chest. The steeper the climb, the deeper he digs his jagged, sharp claws into your muscles." - Scott Martin


  5. #5
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    Token wheels are alright

    I own a set of Token C50 carbon clinchers that look identical to the T50. If the tubulars are anything like my clinchers, then you have a well-built and nicely priced wheelset. I rode my set today on a very long climb with a steep technical descent (Figueroa Mountain Road in Santa Barbara County). The wheels took some serious punishment today from the less than ideal road conditions. There were a couple of potholes that I had no choice but to pucker up, stand up and ride over. The wheels took the abuse in stride.

    As for the poster who thinks they look cheap, you are entitled to your opinion. However, mine is based on fact and experience with this product.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forrest Root
    I wouldn't own them, but then I have different requirements for deep sectioned CF tubulars.

    yeah me too. my only requirement is product reliability- something i take serious seeing how much time i spend in the saddle, racing and training. until i see or hear of token in the mainstream I'M going to be wary.... everyone should have their own opinion. hey it's only your butt on the line. maybe witht he money saved with token wheels you could get some extra dental coverage... you may need it.

    read this ENTIRE thread: you'll soon understand:
    http://www.cyclingforums.com/archive.../t-237404.html
    Last edited by swerv512; 11-10-2007 at 10:11 PM.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by swerv512
    yeah me too. my only requirement is product reliability- something i take serious seeing how much time i spend in the saddle, racing and training. until i see or hear of token in the mainstream I'M going to be wary.... everyone should have their own opinion. hey it's only your butt on the line. maybe witht he money saved with token wheels you could get some extra dental coverage... you may need it.

    read this ENTIRE thread: you'll soon understand:
    http://www.cyclingforums.com/archive.../t-237404.html
    Token has been around for a long time and a carbon house that has put other big name labels on their products. If you search I think you might find a few failures but nothing to the degree of a company that is four letters long and begins with Z.
    For my next trick I will now set myself on fire!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juanmoretime
    Token has been around for a long time and a carbon house that has put other big name labels on their products. If you search I think you might find a few failures but nothing to the degree of a company that is four letters long and begins with Z.
    Token's not really a carbon house. They just rebrand someone else's product.

    The rims are made by Gigantex (their Equinox wheel division). As DB said, the spokes are CX-Rays (though they used Pillar spokes as well), and hubs are by Joy-Tech's Novatec division.

    The wheels are a pretty good deal (especially if you get them unbranded).

    Token doesn't make anything. They just get stuff from Trigon, Gigantex, etc. and slap their name on it. Still good stuff.

    BTW, DB, I weighed my unbranded wheels with the PSR spokes and they came in at I think 1568 grams last year.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by swerv512
    yeah me too. my only requirement is product reliability- something i take serious seeing how much time i spend in the saddle, racing and training. until i see or hear of token in the mainstream I'M going to be wary.... everyone should have their own opinion. hey it's only your butt on the line. maybe witht he money saved with token wheels you could get some extra dental coverage... you may need it.

    read this ENTIRE thread: you'll soon understand:
    http://www.cyclingforums.com/archive.../t-237404.html
    Well, your link sheds no light on "product liability."

    Dental coverage? I guess fear-mongering is a valid technique for argument now. You have zero basis from which to make that comment. All you have is your own bias and misconceptions about materials, construction, design, and more likely, where things are made, and what people made them.

    A little education would be helpful for you.

  10. #10
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    Well said, Forrest!

  11. #11
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    Please, I try to be a little bit more polite to ask you about this question... "Please" define "LOOKS CHEAP"!.. Just remember that, if you like to answer this question, you will be answering this question to a person who has been in the carbon fiber manufacturing business for more than 20 years.. THANKS!!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equinox
    Please, I try to be a little bit more polite to ask you about this question... "Please" define "LOOKS CHEAP"!.. Just remember that, if you like to answer this question, you will be answering this question to a person who has been in the carbon fiber manufacturing business for more than 20 years.. THANKS!!
    Sounds as though Equinox got word of this thread. They're right. These wheels certainly do not look cheap, and I'd wager they're pretty solid. I sold both my pairs to friends, since I didn't race this year because our first kid was born.

    My friend who bought one set loves them. They're braded as Pro-Lite Gavias.

  13. #13
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    Token

    Dirt Boy,
    Weights are pretty much the same as mine which were probably 2007 models. The C50's were about 100 grams heaver.

    Just to let everyone know - I have been using my C50's on my cyclocross bike without any issues. I have taken several hits that bottomed out the tire hard into the rim - no damage and still in perfect true. Granted I only have (had) 3 races with the wheels so far - threw my back out so am done racing for the year. I weight 180lbs.

    We have a Cat 1/2/3 team around here that are sponsored by Token - Monster Health. If the wheels (and other carbon components) they sell are good enough for these guys.....



    When I was looking for INEXPENSIVE carbon wheels it was between Token and Neuvations - it was pretty much a toss of the coin, probably would end up with better customer service from Nuvation....but I have a history with using Sapim CX-Ray spokes (Neuvations do not use these spokes) in that I have NEVER broken one of these spokes on anywheelset I have owned (5 sets), but have broken other spokes - decided the CX-Rays were the selling point for me.

    Michael
    www.MLKimages.com

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by KMan
    Dirt Boy,
    Weights are pretty much the same as mine which were probably 2007 models. The C50's were about 100 grams heaver.

    Just to let everyone know - I have been using my C50's on my cyclocross bike without any issues. I have taken several hits that bottomed out the tire hard into the rim - no damage and still in perfect true. Granted I only have (had) 3 races with the wheels so far - threw my back out so am done racing for the year. I weight 180lbs.

    We have a Cat 1/2/3 team around here that are sponsored by Token - Monster Health. If the wheels (and other carbon components) they sell are good enough for these guys.....



    When I was looking for INEXPENSIVE carbon wheels it was between Token and Neuvations - it was pretty much a toss of the coin, probably would end up with better customer service from Nuvation....but I have a history with using Sapim CX-Ray spokes (Neuvations do not use these spokes) in that I have NEVER broken one of these spokes on anywheelset I have owned (5 sets), but have broken other spokes - decided the CX-Rays were the selling point for me.

    Michael
    www.MLKimages.com
    I guess they are not lighter then? LOL!

    Yes, I am NOT worried about the quality and I don't think they look cheap. The graphics are a bit big/much but that's it.

    They should be very capable and durable wheels if you know what they really are.
    DIRT BOY

    "Pain is a big fat creature riding on your back. The farther you pedal, the heavier he feels. The harder you push, the tighter he squeezes your chest. The steeper the climb, the deeper he digs his jagged, sharp claws into your muscles." - Scott Martin


  15. #15
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    KMan-

    That is a really nice looking team kit! Are the jerseys and shorts available for purchase to the general public (a.k.a. average joe rider like me)???

  16. #16
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    email

    email these guys - maybe they hace a contact http://www.monsterhealth.net/

    or Token direct for the jersey
    http://www.tokenproducts.com/05htm/p...s.php?pc1id=55

    Michael
    www.MLKimages.com


    Quote Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
    KMan-

    That is a really nice looking team kit! Are the jerseys and shorts available for purchase to the general public (a.k.a. average joe rider like me)???

  17. #17
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    Thanks for the info.

  18. #18
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    Graphics could definitely be more subtle, but that is just not how manufacturers are doing it these days.

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    My thoughts

    I found this old thread and i wanted to resurrect it and provide my 2 cents to hopefully aide in someone else looking for a quality and inexpensive carbon tubular.

    I have had my wheels for almost a year now. I bought them pretty much exclusively for cyclocross. With that said, I was going into this knowing that the wheels were going to see some harder abuse due to cyclocross demands.

    As noted already, the wheels are not the lightest out there, but for the bargain that they are, they are a great compromise. I did not feel that the wheels held me back at all. They spun up quite nicely and did very well in all aspects when dealing with rotational weight. I liked them here.

    Quality. They are of great quality. I ran them through everything. Dirt, mud, sand, grass, etc. They were extremely stiff in cornering and hard accelerations. The bearings were smooth and spun very nice. The rear hub engagement was spot on.

    My only complaint, if I can say this as a complaint, is the rear hub is a bit noisy. It did not bother me though, but it might bother someone else.

    Overall, the wheels are a great value. I have ridden all kinds of high end tubulars and for the money, the Tokens are a great option. I don't think that you can discount these wheels at all. I say give them a try and have a little faith in them. I give them a thumbs up.

  20. #20
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    These wheels are on the UCI approved wheel list, so must be okay. I'm thinking about branding my Yishun's as Token's in case they don't let me use them in races.

  21. #21
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    Weights

    and here are some updated weights. I have three sets of Token Wheels:
    C58's 675 front, 794 rear 1469 grams total for 58mm clincher wheelset
    2 sets of T50's used for cyclocross: both are pretty much dead on at 602 front, 782 rear 1384 total grams

    all sets are built using Sapim CX-Ray spokes. T50 are built using Tokens standard hubs and the C58 is built using their "upgraded and lighter" hubset.

    Michael

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