Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 26 to 50 of 61
  1. #26
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: velodog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,857
    Quote Originally Posted by JDCowboy View Post
    Do any of you commenting actually have carbon rims? Have any of you actually purchatsed a nice bike recently? They come with carbon wheels for everyday riding. If not, then you really do not have any real knowlege of what you're talking about. I want to hear from someone who actually owns and uses carbon wheels.
    What's a nice bike, a high end factory built carbon wonder bike or a custom hand built steel bike from one of the established builders? Or is it a custom Ti framed bicycle, again from one of the established builders?

    Do you have any real knowledge of what you are talking about other than what the pros are using?
    Too old to ride plastic

  2. #27
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    50
    Actually, I do appreciate the comments. The concerns are obviously valid. I'm not trying to emulate the pro's. Far from it. Wouldn't want tubulars, anyway. So I just bought a new Giant TCR and it has carbon wheels, no discs. Thought about waiting for the disc models, but local bike shop gave me 20% off. Decided not to pass that up. My Trek carbon wheels lasted 7 plus years. We'll see how long the Giant wheels last.

  3. #28
    CX'er
    Reputation: bikerector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    861
    Wow, this thread became a crap show quick. OP, chill and listen. You don't have to shoot down every opinion that is different than your own. Of course, facts are facts and that's different. I will say that some guys are being a bit over the top with stating the lack of aero benefits of a carbon rim over aluminum. Data suggests it's more aero at all yaw angles and speeds against a box section rim. It's the cost v benefit that's highly debateable since most aero benefits come from rider position 1st.

    Carbon rims fail and have a higher tendency to do so descending than aluminum because they overheat and can delaminate. With clinchers, the tubes can over-inflate from increased heat and blow off rim. With tubulars, the glue can soften. If you followed the tour of Oman well then I'm sure you're aware that the riders like to pump the tires to ridiculously high pressures because the pavement is super smooth and the race is fast and pro riders can be more nostalgic than logical sometimes. Pair the high heat with the excessively high pressure and you get exploding tires.

    A "nice bike" has many different version based on a perspective. A nice bike to one person is something from a bike shop vs Walmart. Another person may only want a carbon bike. In your case, sounds like you only want the best bike available as usually on the most expensive models have carbon wheels. Most manufacturers accept that those buying higher end bikes probably already have nice wheels to go with so you often see wheels lower spec'ed than the rest of the bike, until you get to the top of the line.

    Simply because people state "use aluminum" doesn't mean they haven't used carbon. I don't care for carbon clinchers, at all. I've owned 2 pairs and never again. I will only ride carbon in tubulars. I guess that's not quite true as I would try carbon clinchers or tubeless with disc brakes for CX or gravel, but I would likely still stick with a shallow aero aluminum and do tubeless because it's cheaper and generally easier to maintain.

    You don't have many posts on the forum so you're probably not aware that many people are "set in their ways" in some regards. Wheels come up all the time as does tire width. Carbon wheels have a place but it's not at the value end of the bike industry, in most scenarios. If you bought Chinese rims, which have a negative stigma here, then we would assume you're not willing to pony up for something nicer, or at least you weren't but now you are.

    Another thing to consider if you're going to buy the top of the line bike is that disc brakes seem to be the way the industry is headed. Rim brakes aren't going anywhere but disc brakes are here to stay. I expect there to be some sorting out of hub/axle/thru-axle standards like there was in mtb but it does seem to have settled much better than the mtb world which seems to come out with a new one every other year. I think there are two fork standards for road/cx right now, 12mm and 15mm. Then of course the QR but I think those are on the way out fast for disc brakes.

  4. #29
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    50
    Velodog, Giant TCR Advanced SL 0 is a nice bike (which I bought). Tarmac S-Works is a nice bike. Trek Emonda SLR is a nice bike. Cannondale Supersix Evo's are nice bikes. Those are the major brands available in my local shops and I want to stay local. Yes, I do know what I'm talking about other than what the pro's use. I average over 4,000 miles a year on my road and mountain bikes, race and do a dozen centuries a year. And I have 63 years of mistakes behind me.

    Let's face it, we often buy nicer things than we need. I am fortunate to be able to afford an expensive bike so I want to buy one. Would I be happy on a less expensive bike? Of course!

    I appreciate the comments, even though I may sound like I disagree. I'm an attorney, so I want to understand where comments are coming from. I discount those from people just spouting off and value those from people with actual experience. Crit_Boy, ergott and November Dave made some very good points and I appreciate the feedback.
    Last edited by JDCowboy; 08-04-2017 at 10:16 AM.

  5. #30
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    50
    Quote Originally Posted by bikerector View Post
    Wow, this thread became a crap show quick.
    Yeah! Might as well have asked opinions on tubes or tubeless, or go to a motorcycle forum and ask about motor oils! Decided to buy a new bike with carbon clincher wheels. We'll see how they hold up. If they fail, I'll eat my words and buy an aluminum rimmed replacement!

  6. #31
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    1,172
    Nice bike. Congratulations.

  7. #32
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Srode's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    2,594
    Quote Originally Posted by JDCowboy View Post
    Do any of you commenting actually have carbon rims? Have any of you actually purchatsed a nice bike recently? They come with carbon wheels for everyday riding. If not, then you really do not have any real knowlege of what you're talking about. I want to hear from someone who actually owns and uses carbon wheels.
    Yes, I have carbon clincher rim brakes and aluminum disc brakes, not carbon wheels with disc brakes though, and my comments on discs are based on my experience. I haven't had nor plan to do any rides with fast technical desents that would require lots of hard braking so the brake track heat isn't a concern for me with carbon and some of the new brake tracks on carbon wheels stop at least as good if not better than aluminum when wet although I do try to avoid wet day rides with them just from a wear and tear standpoint.
    Last edited by Srode; 08-05-2017 at 02:03 AM.
    Moderation is boring - do epic s##t

    Trek Domane
    Niner RLT9 (Gravel Bike)
    Trek Crockett

  8. #33
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    7,661
    Quote Originally Posted by bikerector View Post
    Wow, this thread became a crap show quick. OP, chill and listen. You don't have to shoot down every opinion that is different than your own. Of course, facts are facts and that's different. I will say that some guys are being a bit over the top with stating the lack of aero benefits of a carbon rim over aluminum. Data suggests it's more aero at all yaw angles and speeds against a box section rim. It's the cost v benefit that's highly debateable since most aero benefits come from rider position 1st.
    I think everyone knows and acknowledges that deep carbon clinchers are more aero than box alloy rims. The argument is that even in the best of conditions it's not enough to impact anyone's race results (time trials excluded) nevermind offer benefits to just riding around. Especially once you factor in that you can use latex tubes with alloy rims which save watts but can't with carbon clinchers (although you could probably get away with it for many rides) and deep rims can suck in crosswinds.

    No doubt carbon clinchers would be fine in certain conditions but I think the assumption with this and most questions is that the question pertains to 'all round' riding which includes rain, hills and wind.

  9. #34
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: No Time Toulouse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    795
    Quote Originally Posted by JDCowboy View Post
    Check out the Tour of Oman. Carbon tubular tires failed in the heat--not the rims!
    What, now they're selling carbon tires???? Wow.....I gotta get that!!!!
    "L'enfer, c'est les autres"

  10. #35
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Srode's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    2,594
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    Especially once you factor in that you can use latex tubes with alloy rims which save watts but can't with carbon clinchers (although you could probably get away with it for many rides)
    Huh? Why not? I've probably got 7,000 miles on my carbon wheels with latex tubes without any issues?
    Moderation is boring - do epic s##t

    Trek Domane
    Niner RLT9 (Gravel Bike)
    Trek Crockett

  11. #36
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    7,661
    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    Huh? Why not? I've probably got 7,000 miles on my carbon wheels with latex tubes without any issues?
    https://enve.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/ar...lincher-Wheels

    From Challenge:

    It is correct to say that latex tubes should not be used in carbon clincher wheels. It is correct to say that latex does not handle heat well compared to butyl.

    Butyl rubber can support much higher temperatures for longer periods of time.

    The reason why latex works on carbon clincher wheels (this is my personal opinion), is due to the ability of the rider. Expert riders are able to do descents with limited use of brakes and [thus] give the possibility to the equipment to cool down. Never reach extreme heating. The heat is generated on the external part of the rim and will take time to transfer inside the rim. Generally between tire and rim strip, the tube has no direct contact to the carbon rim and if there is no rim strip it is on the cool part of the rim.

    Heat in carbon [rims] does not dissipate fast and generally seems to be concentrated in the braking area.

    Criterium and other types of riding do not have [the] problem of wheels heating, so latex can be used with no problem. As manufacturers, we do not know how consumers will use the product, and, to be on the safe side, we prefer to give warning not to use it.
    — Alex Brauns
    President, Challenge Tech


    https://www.curvecycling.com.au/pages/tech

    From Competitive Cyclist: Despite the removable valve cores, we strongly recommend against using latex tubes with carbon clincher wheels—a sentiment shared by most major wheel, tube, and tire manufacturers. Since the carbon braking surface heats up more than alloy, it can cause latex tubes to burst and fail. If you're running carbon clinchers, go with butyl tubes.

  12. #37
    hfc
    hfc is offline
    Doesn't like subtitles
    Reputation: hfc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    3,210
    True high end bikes for the most part are sold as frame and fork and built out to the buyer's spec, so OP I wouldn't think you're limited to carbon wheels. That being said, I would think durability of a reputable carbon wheel is fine. I have had a set of Zipp 202's and 303's for about 3 years, admittedly fairly low miles as I spread my mileage amongst several bikes. I've been happy with the Zipps and found them to hold up well. Last year on a descent at between 25-30 mph I hit a pothole that blew out both my tubes, the sidewall on the front tire, both tires eaten up during the deceleration, without a mark in the 202's.

    I also rode a Gran Fondo metric Century a few months ago where a friend told me a couple of people somehow screwed up their carbon wheels on a steep winding descent but my 202's held out fine. I am a good descender though and didn't work my brakes too hard😉

    I'm not a carbon wheel fan boy but recognize their advantages. I have a couple of bikes with 30 year old Mavic G40 rims that ride great. I am in general, not a fan of disc brakes, unless you do a lot of wet weather riding in the hills or off road riding. Rim brakes are just fine for a skilled rider and IMO not worth the trade off in added weight, aesthetics, and maintenance burden.

  13. #38
    CX'er
    Reputation: bikerector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    861
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    I think everyone knows and acknowledges that deep carbon clinchers are more aero than box alloy rims. The argument is that even in the best of conditions it's not enough to impact anyone's race results (time trials excluded) nevermind offer benefits to just riding around. Especially once you factor in that you can use latex tubes with alloy rims which save watts but can't with carbon clinchers (although you could probably get away with it for many rides) and deep rims can suck in crosswinds.

    No doubt carbon clinchers would be fine in certain conditions but I think the assumption with this and most questions is that the question pertains to 'all round' riding which includes rain, hills and wind.
    I believe there was an argument that aero wheels in sprints gave a significant enough advantage to be the difference from winning and losing because it would give you those extra few inches when the difference from winning and losing is a bike throw.

    I suppose you could factor in that latex tubes could make a difference to even out the difference some. I prefer tubulars for carbon anyway so that argument wouldn't apply to my circumstance but I can see where it could apply.

    I also see more tubeless carbon wheels coming out so I wonder if the latex tube part starts to fall flat when/if that becomes more widely adopted. Mavic seems to have an interesting road tubeless system coming out. Not there yet but soon.

    Personally, I think I would rather get a rim like a boyd altamont or velocity quill (should be re-released by now) that has some aero benefits (aero profile) than a carbon clincher both for cost and for better all-around use (better braking and wet riding braking). Are the aero benefits better than a box section? Not much probably but they cost about the same so why not.

  14. #39
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    628
    People seem unaware of the actual differences in aerodynamics between wheels. Tour Magazine most credibly placed a 13w difference between a Mavic Ksyrium and a Zipp 404 (and DT Swiss 65 and one other in this particular test) in the test they published in their issue 8 of 2016 (can't link but it's worth downloading thru their app if you are interested in the actual truth of this versus the promotional hoopla). So that's 13w between what's always been the "dog" of the bunch and the deepest wheels that most people ride for rec or even road racing use. They also tagged a 3w difference between a 303 and a 404, and 303 was more or less equal to Bora 50 and Shimano C50.

    Then we coordinated a test in February of this year, the results of which are here. Short answer? A competent ~30mm alloy rim gives ZERO aerodynamics away to a 303. Which by extension means it gives nothing away to a Bora or Shimano 50. And with the difference between latex and normal butyl tubes repeatably coming in at 3w per wheel, you're actually 3w better off with a good set of 30s and latex tubes than 404s and butyl tubes.

    303 rims also weigh more than 500g, so the carbons have no weight disadvantage to aero-equivalent carbons, and our anecdotal customer feedback puts stiffness in favor of alloys.

    Put simply, there's really no justification for carbon clinchers unless you are in a very specific high speed time trial case where super deep and very incremental gains are the name of the game. And even there, you're likely better off with a HED Jet+ with aluminum brake track.

    The more you know...

  15. #40
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    26
    The argument for alloy wheels seems to depend on three propositions:

    1. Rim brakes on an alloy brake track are desirable.
    2. Carbon's advantages aren't worth the cost
    3. It's latex, butyl, or bust

    I disagree on all counts.

    I've had rim-braked bikes forever. I have three of them now. Rim brakes, on alloy, in the dry, are pretty decent when the wheel is clean. When the wheel isn't clean, or it's the slightest bit out of true, or it's wet or even just humid, they suck. This isn't something you can tune your way out of. I'm a maintenance fanatic and I still think they suck. What you're buying with discs is consistency, and by extension, confidence. Forget hydraulic; I'd take my mechanical TRP Spyres over every rim brake in existence.

    I like the mechanical simplicity and the other advantages of a long, symmetrical lever arm for braking, but there's no question the future is in discs, and the trend didn't start because they were fashionable.

    Discs open the door to carbon. For the same wheel profile, carbon can be lighter and stiffer. That's indisputable: I've got a spreadsheet of ~30ish-profile rims in front of me that all undercut the AI33 and XR31T by some margin, they're all Chinese (and therefore under $250 a rim), they'll all hold me off the floor without being laced, and a properly-assembled set won't ever fatigue or need to be trued. And these are the off-brands. ZIP isn't the only premium brand in town; if you really to throw down the bucks, a number of places will build wheelsets 200g lighter than anything comparable (even the word is a stretch if you value stiffness) in alloy.

    The third leg in our future tripod is tubeless. I don't know how many of you guys mountain bike, but all roadies are doing is borrowing the stuff that industry figured out years ago. Less rolling resistance, more comfort, less weight, (way) more resistance to flats: there's a lot to like when you ditch the tubes. By contrast, nobody likes latex. (Why would you? You have to reinflate it every ride.) It doesn't matter to me an iota that I can't use my latex tubes on a carbon rim.

    In sum: while deep-section rims may well have only marginal aero benefits (or not; 13W isn't inconsequential and some data sources show bigger differences), I believe carbon is a superior disc platform, that's where we should be headed, and that's where we are headed.

  16. #41
    dcb
    dcb is offline
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    478
    I live in a mountainous area and long, technical descents are all over the place. I was in my buddies bike shop a couple of weeks ago and he had a heat warped carbon fiber clincher wheel that he had sold to a customer that was ready to go back to the manufacturer for warranty replacement. This wheel was from a major brand. I won't mention the name because I've got no interest in slamming their product, and I suspect wheels from other brands wouldn't have fared any better. I can't say anything about how they were actually used because I don't know who they belonged to.

    I also have a buddy I ride with occasionally who is on his 3rd pair of the same carbon clinchers. Again, these are from a major (but different) manufacturer associated with very high end wheels. He climbs a lot - standard after work ride is a 3k+ HC climb that he does 1-2 times a week. This guy keeps on going back to the same wheel because he really likes the ride quality and just accepts that they're going to fail at some point due to heat generated while braking. He's never had an accident and never blown a tire off the rim either when it's happened. I hope his luck holds out.

    The take home message for me is that if you ride where you're going to stress your wheels with long, techy descents, any brand of carbon wheel can fail.

  17. #42
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    26
    Quote Originally Posted by dcb View Post
    The take home message for me is that if you ride where you're going to stress your wheels with long, techy descents, any brand of carbon wheel can fail.
    At 170 lbs, I took this as a given when I bought a set of rim-braked carbon clinchers. Nobody's using magic resin. The probability of one brand failing over another is a difference of degree, not kind. My area doesn't have many hills or I wouldn't have bothered at all. It amazes me that so many people do.

  18. #43
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: terbennett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    2,228
    Quote Originally Posted by JDCowboy View Post
    I am afraid I disagree. I know there's a marketing aspect to carbon wheels just like electronic shifting. Carbon wheels are lighter and more aerodynamic, which is why I want them. I just don't want to worry about them.

    To be fair, I had Trek carbon wheels on my bike for 7 years before I put on the cheaper Chinese wheels. The Trek carbon wheels worked fine and I had no problems bombing down hills with tight turns and hard braking.

    Did the Trek carbon wheels aka Bontrager have aluminum braking surfaces? If not, you just got lucky. However, I recall Bontrager carbon wheels were actually rebadged HED wheels, and HED was dead set on not having carbon braking surfaces. Newwer ones might, but I haven't had a pair in years. As for lightweight, carbon wheels are not always lighter. If you went with a low profile wheel, sub 30 mm, carbon would be a horrible choice outside of climbing and sprints. the reason? Carbon doesn't dissipate heat very well. That's why deep dish carbon or more resilient to it than low profile ones...Since there is less surface space on low profile carbon wheels, they will be more prone to failure from excessive braking. That's what causes carbon to fail. A set of lightweight aluminum wheels can weigh the same and not have the issue at all (American Classic 350 Sprints, for example weigh 1250 grams). You're looking at bikes and assuming that those are the best wheels because the bikes are top tier. The components are expensive, but that doesn't make them better. Maybe they are better for racing, but horrible as an all-around wheel. I race crits and I have two sets of carbon wheels, one is Mavic Cosmic Ultimates and the other is a set of Chinese carbon. I ride and race on the Chinese carbon. No issues whatsoever. Been riding and racing on them since March 2015 and they have been to hell and back. Hubs spin like butter. I use the Ultimates for special rides because I'm not ruining $2800 wheels in a crit crash. If my ride is hilly, common sense dictates you don't use carbon wheels with carbon braking surfaces. They will eventually fail. This problem is why manufacturers have introduced disc brakes. Can't solve the braking issue so they moved the brakes. By the way carbon tubulars don't have the issue. It's an issue exclusive to clinchers.
    Last edited by terbennett; 2 Weeks Ago at 12:55 PM.

  19. #44
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: terbennett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    2,228
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    They also have tubular rims and a team car full of wheels not far behind. Tubulars and clinchers are apples and oranges in this context.

    Getting carbon clinchers for the irrelevant aero 'advantage' then using wind catching disc brakes is especially amusing.
    +1. I've been wondering about this for a long time.

  20. #45
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: terbennett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    2,228
    Quote Originally Posted by ergott View Post
    I think I know a thing or two about carbon wheels;-)















    I still say your reasoning for wanting them are silly. Because all the pros do, because nice bikes come with them, really? You haven't given us any real reason as to why you think they might be advantageous for your riding. Rather, you have personal experience with carbon rims failing albeit, cheap ones that might not have fared as well as others. As I said already, there's no guaranty that even the best carbon rims will stand up to all braking conditions. Look no further than other forums to see cases of even Enve rims failing. It happens.

    You also ask about disc brakes so rim failure is not an issue all the while acknowledging that the setup will end up being heavier. Again, why do you want carbon so bad? A high end road bike with quality alloy rims can still be very light and will be ideal in mountainous terrain. What pros do doesn't apply to us. They ride closed roads so never have to drag their brakes. They are usually far more skilled than the average rider so less likely to brake with poor technique. They are also typically a lot lighter than even the likes of most Cat 3 or lesser racers. Finally, they don't use carbon clinchers in the mountains, none of them do.

    I have chosen various carbon rims over the years mainly to try them out so I know what I'm recommending. I love them and can afford them. I don't kid myself into saying I need them, never.

    I leave it up to others to know if they want them. I surely never tell people to buy carbon wheels because pros ride them.
    He wants them because he's a newb drinking the marketing Kool Aid. Has no idea what he is getting and is judging based on perception, kinda like I'm doing right now. However, noone with actual knowledge would be asking this question in the first place, so my perception is warranted. You're a wheel builder. If he doesn't believe you, there's no hope for him.

  21. #46
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: terbennett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    2,228
    Quote Originally Posted by no time toulouse View Post
    what, now they're selling carbon tires???? Wow.....i gotta get that!!!!
    ....lol!

  22. #47
    30 mpdb
    Reputation: beeristasty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Posts
    957
    Quote Originally Posted by terbennett View Post
    This problem is why manufacturers have introduced disc brakes. Can't solve the braking issue so they moved the brakes. By the way carbon tubulars don't have the issue. It's an issue exclusive to clinchers.
    What you're saying is that road disc brakes only exist because carbon clincher rims can delaminate after extended braking sessions.

    And Campy, Shimano, and SRAM decided to spend all that R&D money to fix a problem that is the responsibility of carbon clincher rim manufacturers... out of the goodness of their own hearts?

    I think you may be reaching a bit there.
    Last edited by beeristasty; 2 Weeks Ago at 07:57 PM.

  23. #48
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Lombard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    4,950
    Quote Originally Posted by terbennett View Post
    Did the Trek carbon wheels aka Bontrager have aluminum braking surfaces? If not, you just got lucky. However, I recall Bontrager carbon wheels were actually rebadged HED wheels, and HED was dead set on not having carbon braking surfaces. Newwer ones might, but I haven't had a pair in years. As for lightweight, carbon wheels are not always lighter. If you went with a low profile wheel, sub 30 mm, carbon would be a horrible choice outside of climbing and sprints. the reason? Carbon doesn't dissipate heat very well. That's why deep section carbon or more resilient to it than low profile ones...
    Fixed. We're talking wheels, not pizza. Just so you know.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  24. #49
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation: Lombard's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    4,950
    Quote Originally Posted by ergott View Post
    What pros do doesn't apply to us. They ride closed roads so never have to drag their brakes. They are usually far more skilled than the average rider so less likely to brake with poor technique. They are also typically a lot lighter than even the likes of most Cat 3 or lesser racers. Finally, they don't use carbon clinchers in the mountains, none of them do.
    Also, the pros' wheels don't need to last longer than the race they are in. Most have their wheels given to them. The rest of us like our wheels to last longer than one or even a few rides.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  25. #50
    RoadBikeReview Member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    50
    Quote Originally Posted by terbennett View Post
    He wants them because he's a newb drinking the marketing Kool Aid. Has no idea what he is getting and is judging based on perception, kinda like I'm doing right now. However, noone with actual knowledge would be asking this question in the first place, so my perception is warranted. You're a wheel builder. If he doesn't believe you, there's no hope for him.
    Yes, I'm a newb! After 85 centuries and countless road and mtb races, I'm still trying to figure out what those thingys on the handlebars do!

    Thank you for your experienced wisdom.

    I do appreciate Dave's input as he has the backgound to back up what he says.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Velocity A 23 Rim Durability Question
    By Enoch562 in forum Wheels and Tires
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 01-11-2015, 07:11 PM
  2. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 06-09-2013, 07:09 AM
  3. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-26-2012, 04:13 PM
  4. Carbon Rim durability question
    By niteschaos in forum Components, Wrenching
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 04-10-2004, 08:22 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •