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  1. #1
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    Imbalanced Dura-Ace C24 & 4000sII... suggestions?

    What would cause this imbalance? And would it be considered "out of the normal range" of imbalanced?

    EDIT: Not the tire - tested without the tire/tube... if anything, it's worse.

    With Tire: https://youtu.be/Db8uS40hUZQ
    Without Tire: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nRFKwOYwiI
    Last edited by OldZaskar; 03-02-2017 at 03:40 PM.

  2. #2
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    use a torque wrench

  3. #3
    jpz
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    Generally, with the hole(lighter) for the valve from the tube, and (usually) halfway around the rim the weld, or pins (heavier) a rim is slightly imbalanced. With out the tire & tube, I bet the valve hole is up top. Depending on the weight of the valve stem, this may or may not be true when tire/tube is mounted, typical of all wheels, especially hi end wheels with smooth rolling hubs.

  4. #4
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    @jpz that makes sense - and explains why the imbalance is worse without the tire and tube. I guess this is just "how it is" with mass produced stuff. Obviously Shimano knows a weld on one side and hole on the other will create an imbalance... you'd think they'd address this in the design/manufacturing of the rims. Maybe it's "invisible" all mounted up and on the ground.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Db8uS40hUZQ

  5. #5
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    It's not mass produced wheels. All wheels are out of balance to some extent. It's not addressed because it doesn't matter and impacts nothing.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    because it doesn't matter and impacts nothing.
    I get that all wheels are out to some extent. I've just never had one this bad. I'm banking your comment - that it has no impact

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldZaskar View Post
    I get that all wheels are out to some extent. I've just never had one this bad. I'm banking your comment - that it has no impact
    If you think it does, just install the product I linked to balance the wheels. Problem solved. I use them on a set of deep carbon wheels. They work perfectly as advertised. The wheels are perfectly balanced now. It's up to you to decided if it matters or not.
    use a torque wrench

  8. #8
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    Rims are designed with the weld/joint at one end and the valve hole at the other for a good reason. Once the tire is mounted, the valve stem balances out the weight from the weld/joint at the other end.

    I own many wheels and can't say I've ever seen one this out of balance. That being said, do you feel it as in vibrations when you ride the bike? If not, it's a non-issue. And it won't be an issue unless you regularly ride at speeds of greater than 40mph.

    If you are feeling really OCD, you can try the magnets MMsRepBike mentioned. Though a cheaper fix would be to put some of those Schraeder valve converters on the end of your valve stems to add a little weight there.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  9. #9
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    If you hold the wheel with two hands and spin it fast (no idea if it's going 10 mph or 30 mph) it hops - hard to keep level. On the bike, it'd laser straight - side-to-side, up and down. But to say I feel it on the road... nah. Too many other factors I guess.

    I may go the route MMsRepBike suggested.

    Thanks guys

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    If not, it's a non-issue. And it won't be an issue unless you regularly ride at speeds of greater than 40mph.
    you're shooting from the hip on that one. I won't matter over 40 either.

  11. #11
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    Just for the record, seeing how I might still be the only one who has these things, I'll say it in this thread again.

    Yes, they did their job balancing the wheels. I didn't have to use any of the weights or magnets, just the stick on rubber things. On the road I don't feel anything different at all. No improved speed, handling or stability, zero difference of feel on the road. On the stand when spinning the wheels there's a difference for sure, balanced vs not balanced, but it's only on the stand.
    use a torque wrench

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMsRepBike View Post
    Just for the record, seeing how I might still be the only one who has these things, I'll say it in this thread again.

    Yes, they did their job balancing the wheels. I didn't have to use any of the weights or magnets, just the stick on rubber things. On the road I don't feel anything different at all. No improved speed, handling or stability, zero difference of feel on the road. On the stand when spinning the wheels there's a difference for sure, balanced vs not balanced, but it's only on the stand.
    $36 retail seems like a bit much to spend for something that only matters when the bike is in the stand.
    Too old to ride plastic

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    $36 retail seems like a bit much to spend for something that only matters when the bike is in the stand.
    It seems to really bother the OP, so maybe it's worth it to him.

    Otherwise you're mostly right.

    If you use a rear magnet on your wheel for speed, or on the front, whatever, this can offer a slick integrated solution to house that magnet.

    I don't use a rear magnet, I don't use any speed sensors. So for me the product basically has zero value and this may be the case for many.

    So like many things from Silca, it's just not necessary and they're going after people with more money than sense.
    use a torque wrench

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    you're shooting from the hip on that one. I won't matter over 40 either.

    Probably not. Shall we just say if you don't feel it while you ride the bike, it won't matter.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Probably not. Shall we just say if you don't feel it while you ride the bike, it won't matter.
    There is no 'probably' or 'if' about it. It doesn't matter period.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldZaskar View Post
    What would cause this imbalance? And would it be considered "out of the normal range" of imbalanced?
    Here I thought you were going to show us a video of a bike violently shaking in the workstand after you had spun up the rear wheel.

    There is absolutely zero issue here. Absolutely zero. Balancing wheels has been going on for 100 years all to no purpose. In order for wheel balance to be an issue, there would have to be enough force generated by the imbalance such that the tire was actually compressed by the force with each revolution. That does not happen because the forces are miniscule compared to the pressure in the tire.

    With aluminum rims, the heaviest point is typically at the opposite side from the valve hole due to the weld/pins. The valve stem balances that out a bit, but on all the wheels I have owned (Al rims) for decades, the weld/pin side is heaviest even with the tire mounted. With a CF rim you could spend some effort to eliminate this imbalance but it would be pointless.

  17. #17
    Huge in Japan
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    Sleeved rim joints can bias the weight quite a bit even with a tube and tire installed. I have had some that are as "bad" as yours. Even pushing a bit under 60 mph down hill I didn't notice it. I'm not saying no one would, perhaps there are folks out there discerning enough but I didn't notice.
    Interwebs bumpersticker goes here

  18. #18
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    I notice unbalance wheels/tires on my kawa, on a bicycle, not!
    BANNED

  19. #19
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    ugh you think this is bad?? Ever try spinning a rear wheel using tubeless tire with 2oz-3oz of sealant?? First time I did that I thought I broke my frame somehow because the rear was kicking and spasm'ing up and down so violently. Yet, on the road, I felt absolutely nothing, and I'm a weightweenie.

    But I do wonder what if i was descending at a fast speed and I did a sizable bunny hop? Would the shaking be enough to screw me up mid air?? I have not had an opportunity to try that stunt yet!

    and what's up with the $36 magnet??? Pretty damn sure I can jig up something that works just as well!

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    and what's up with the $36 magnet??? Pretty damn sure I can jig up something that works just as well!
    You think that's bad? Check out their other prices. My eyes!
    use a torque wrench

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMsRepBike View Post
    You think that's bad? Check out their other prices. My eyes!
    As crazy high as their prices are, I'd be tempted if I had money I didn't know what to do with. I handled one of their new frame pumps and it was about the smoothest operating most solid handling frame pump I've ever had in my hands. I wouldn't touch the track pump after that because I can do without a frame pump of that caliber, but if the track pump felt that good I'd be finding a way to buy one.
    Too old to ride plastic

  22. #22
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    The effect of wheel imbalance is not a question of up/down but of front/back. In the early days of spoke-mounted reflectors I rode a bike with very heavy ones. At speeds above 20mph or so, there was a noticeable front/back surge from the imbalance, especially if the wheels lined up so the reflectors were at the same place on each wheel. When I removed the reflectors the surging went away. I never felt any up/down bounce.

    So I believe wheel imbalance can matter, but I think it has to be pretty bad in order to affect the the ride.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobf View Post
    The effect of wheel imbalance is not a question of up/down but of front/back. In the early days of spoke-mounted reflectors ........
    Ahhhh, now there's an idea. New bikes still come with them. They're a lot cheaper than those magnets.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas."
    -- Warren Buffett

    "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't. -- Pete Seeger



  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Ahhhh, now there's an idea. New bikes still come with them. They're a lot cheaper than those magnets.
    Or you could go old school and wrap a few turns of solder around a spoke or two.

  25. #25
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    use a torque wrench

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