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  1. #1
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    Mavic Road Tubeless

    I know Mavic has a bad reputation with a number of people, but I am really interested in these. I might grab one of the lower priced pairs to test and then go from there. Thoughts?

    Mavic Road UST promises hassle-free tubeless | VeloNews.com

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  2. #2
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    Meh. I could see their point that by creating a proprietary system they could optimize the rim/tire interface aerodynamics a bit. But that minuscule aero gain will require that you use a system that gives you exactly one tire choice. Given that, I think most people would sacrifice the 0.2W (just a guess) aero savings for more tire choices- even if it comes with some extra hassle.

  3. #3
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    Mavic no longer stands for quality, so now they have to rely on gimmicks and a proprietary system that locks you into buying only Mavic.
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  4. #4
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    Nice design. Solves the problem of tight or loose fitting tires. Big fail from the standpoint of only Mavic tires should be used with these rims/wheels. What we need is standardization for road tubeless. Are these rims backwards compatible with tubed tires? If not, another big fail.

  5. #5
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    This forum is the last place I expect anyone will express love of Mavic. Some of the criticisms I've read make sense, some of them don't. I see a tire and rim spec'd to work with each other as something that makes sense. Despite the reasons some express, I have to think that if Cannondale and AG2r-La Mondiale are riding Mavic, they are worth considering in general. Hard to say how much of the pro stuff trickles down to what's in the lbs and what us normal humans can afford. As noted above, it would be nice if things were a bit more standardized, It would be nice to have a choice of tires on the rim without having to resort to the trial and error route.

  6. #6
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    Locking myself into one brand and one model of tires ain't for me. Different rides and different times of year calls for different tires.
    Not to mention if this flops I'd be stuck with rims I can't get tires for.

  7. #7
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    Mavic Road Tubeless

    The bicycle industry shot itself in the foot on road tubeless due to lack of standardization. Shimano is different from Mavic which is different from Bontrager is different from Stans. Plus, tubeless road offers no real advantages over tubed and has significant disadvantages (cost, difficulty in mounting, lack of choice in tires). Tire manufacturers like Continental never got on board. Sealant is no panacea such that too often doesn't work and is a real mess when it doesn't.

  8. #8
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    I'm not interested in anything tubeless that I run at more than about 80 PSI. The hassles outweigh the benefits with pressures above that.

    And it's frustrating that you have to buy into some kind of proprietary combination of wheels and tires to get a reliable tubeless setup. The road tubeless world is basically the wild wild west in terms of rim and bead hook standards. Assuming that is ever brought under control to the point where you can safely run pressures above 90psi without the risk of blow-offs, etc... I might reconsider road tubeless.

    I do have three sets of wheels for gravel riding (60 psi is the highest pressure I run there). Several combinations of tire and wheel brands/models, and it's been working great so far. I'll probably stay with tubeless for those applications, but not for anything where volume is low and pressure is high.

    Until then, I'll happy roll along on my GP4000IIs with tubes on my road bikes.

    Jim

  9. #9
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    Road tubeless is as useless as road disc brakes.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    Locking myself into one brand and one model of tires ain't for me. Different rides and different times of year calls for different tires.
    Not to mention if this flops I'd be stuck with rims I can't get tires for.
    Not necessarily one tire.

    Wilderness Terrain Bikes (WTB) was one of 2 old-gen UST certified tire makers. SRAM and Fulcrum wheels were also old-gen UST certified IIRC.


    Granted those 3 are a drop in the bucket in the grand scheme of things.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    I'm not interested in anything tubeless that I run at more than about 80 PSI. The hassles outweigh the benefits with pressures above that.
    ...
    Assuming that is ever brought under control to the point where you can safely run pressures above 90psi without the risk of blow-offs, etc... I might reconsider road tubeless.
    I agree using road tubeless above ~90 PSI doesn't make sense, IME any big punctures will just spew sealant and not seal until the pressure drops to ~70 PSI or below. Also at those pressures the ride quality gets overly harsh and getting large punctures is much more likely.

    I don't get your remark about tubeless blow-offs though. I've been closely following road tubeless for many years and have heard of few (if any) cases of this happening- idiots trying to run tubed clinchers as tubeless notwithstanding.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by cooskull View Post
    I don't get your remark about tubeless blow-offs though. I've been closely following road tubeless for many years and have heard of few (if any) cases of this happening- idiots trying to run tubed clinchers as tubeless notwithstanding.
    I'm not sure how you can blow off tubeless tires either.

    I've been riding them for about 4 months now and have changed both the front and rear tires ... I have to use a set of pliers to get the tires off the bead once seated! If anything, I would say they have a much "Lower" chance of blowing off the rim than a tubed tire.
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  13. #13
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    It just takes the wrong combination of rims, tires and a little too much pressure
    Last edited by Migen21; 2 Weeks Ago at 07:47 PM.

  14. #14
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    [QUOTE=Migen21;5163150]It just takes the wing combination of rims, tires and s little too much pressure

    Perhaps the Mavic system is a good step away from this likelihood. The video doesn't tell us what sort of tire/rim combo, but 174 psi is more than a "little too much pressure." It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

  15. #15
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    [QUOTE=bleckb;5163156]
    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    It just takes the wing combination of rims, tires and s little too much pressure

    Perhaps the Mavic system is a good step away from this likelihood. The video doesn't tell us what sort of tire/rim combo, but 174 psi is more than a "little too much pressure." It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
    Why the eff would anybody want to use 174 PSI???
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

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  16. #16
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    174psi is what it apparently takes to blow tires off of Mavic's proprietary setup.

    The blow-offs I've seen were on other peoples bikes, who who were experimenting with different wheel and tire options. I don't know the specifics, and it was a few years ago.

    You guys don't get all hung up on two little words in my post. I was just trying to make the point that, in general (and in my opinion), running tubeless in a traditional road situation doesn't provide enough value to justify the hassles.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    You guys don't get all hung up on two little words in my post. I was just trying to make the point that, in general (and in my opinion), running tubeless in a traditional road situation doesn't provide enough value to justify the hassles.
    Granted ... I'm new to road tubeless, and tubeless tires in general, but I don't see what the hassle is at this point.

    I can change a tire in about the same amount of time on my tubeless wheelset as I can on a tubed wheel ... and knowing I have the sealant in there, gives me more confidence I'm going to make it home. I've had multiple occasions so far where I've ran over something to have it seal up on the ride ... most of the time, not even knowing until I see sealant on the seat tube when I get home.

    The set up is just as light or lighter than tubed wheels and rolling resistance is lower.

    I'm not really seeing the downside here, however this is a n=1 scenario.
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  18. #18
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    This morning was my first ride using road tubeless on my new Ridley Fenix. I chose the most affordable but best reviewed combo/setup I could because I literally have no idea what to expect. It went as well as Wookie is describing this far. No problems at all. I am running Schwalbe Pro One tires on Chain Reaction Cycles Prime wheels. I have a lot of work to do on the engine, but the bike and the wheel combo were great. The guys at Peachtree bikes said it was one of the easiest road tubeless combos they have built up if any of that matters to anyone.
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    You guys don't get all hung up on two little words in my post. I was just trying to make the point that, in general (and in my opinion), running tubeless in a traditional road situation doesn't provide enough value to justify the hassles.
    I would agree that tubeless doesn't seem like it's worth the hassles. Then again, I have never tried it - on road or mountain. Who knows, if I did, I might actually go "Whoa, I can't believe I was missing this!". Though from what I can see from others I've seen deal with it, I'm in no rush to try it.
    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein

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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    I would agree that tubeless doesn't seem like it's worth the hassles. Then again, I have never tried it - on road or mountain. Who knows, if I did, I might actually go "Whoa, I can't believe I was missing this!". Though from what I can see from others I've seen deal with it, I'm in no rush to try it.
    MTB it works so well it is a standard (basically-floor bikes come tubed due to the shelf life of sealant). You can use tires not even designed as tubeless, that is how well non-UST works.



    And then there's the sucky kind of tubeless....AKA roadie tubeless...which due to high pressure and low volume, it sprays and loses more sealant everywhere, loses more pressure on puncture, and doesn't seal as well afterwards as reliably (if it even seals, sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't)....with the added perk of putting a tube in an absolute mess, in addition to your bike being covered in slop.
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  21. #21
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    It's kind of ironic that of the two guys saying tubeless isn't a hassle one had a bike shop do the work, the other needs a pair of pliers to take a tire off and it doesn't sounds like either has gotten flat that won't seal yet.

    When I was young me and my friends used to catch big suckers in the river and during mating season sometimes a few of my nutty friends would squeeze them and spray fish sperm on each other just to be jerks.

    I had kind of forgotten about that and how nasty it was until last year when I pulled over my car to help a cyclist with a flat and saw him and his bike covered in white goop.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    It's kind of ironic that of the two guys saying tubeless isn't a hassle one had a bike shop do the work, the other needs a pair of pliers to take a tire off and it doesn't sounds like either has gotten flat that won't seal yet.
    You would be correct in the fact that I haven't had a puncture that wouldn't seal yet ... but that's kind of the point isn't it? The ability to get back home without having to change tubes.

    I have however had to fairly large punctures ... 1/4" across ... that did ruin the tire, but would have ruined any tire, and would have required a boot to get home on a tubed bike. Both tears sealed at around 40-45 PSI and allowed me to ride home in an uneventful fashion.

    As far as getting the tire off ... it's a matter of breaking the bead from the sidewall, once that first pop happens, the rest comes off as easy as a non tubeless tire. It's just tough to get it started with tubeless due to the design.

    The way I see it is tubeless will become more common very quickly as manufactures are starting to embrace it.

    • Do we need tubeless tires? Nope!
    • Do we need electronic shifting? Nope!
    • Do we need disc brakes on road bikes? Nope!
    • Do we need carbon frames? Nope!
    • Do we need index shifting? Nope! Do we really need gears? Maybe, but in reality ... Nope!



    In the end, why try and convince people that they are a bad idea, not needed or they shouldn't ride them? Ride what you like ... in the end, I'm guessing they will be the norm, not exception ... it's just a matter of time, much like electronic shifting, disc brakes, carbon frames, etc.

    Then of course ... I've always been an early adopter ... I was riding road disc brakes back in 2007(?) when I had a custom Curtlo built up with the Avid BB7 Road Disc brakes at the time.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    It's kind of ironic that of the two guys saying tubeless isn't a hassle one had a bike shop do the work, the other needs a pair of pliers to take a tire off and it doesn't sounds like either has gotten flat that won't seal yet.

    When I was young me and my friends used to catch big suckers in the river and during mating season sometimes a few of my nutty friends would squeeze them and spray fish sperm on each other just to be jerks.

    I had kind of forgotten about that and how nasty it was until last year when I pulled over my car to help a cyclist with a flat and saw him and his bike covered in white goop.
    The shop built my whole bike up actually. I am just confirming that I haven't had any issues thus far, that I like how they feel as if now, and that my shop said it was one of the easiest tubeless combos it has worked on. I personally think that has a lot to do with the Scwalbe tires, but that's just my opinion.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wookiebiker View Post
    In the end, why try and convince people that they are a bad idea, not needed or they shouldn't ride them?
    Well I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything but it would probably be the same reason someone would convince people they are a good idea, needed and should ride them. Whatever that reason is. It's an internet thing I guess.

    I really don't care what strangers on the internet do but it's apparently a big deal to some on both sides of any choice. I do have my opinions on what works and what doesn't and share it but I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything unless the person specifically asks for such guidance.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Strongbow View Post
    It's kind of ironic that of the two guys saying tubeless isn't a hassle one had a bike shop do the work, the other needs a pair of pliers to take a tire off and it doesn't sounds like either has gotten flat that won't seal yet.

    When I was young me and my friends used to catch big suckers in the river and during mating season sometimes a few of my nutty friends would squeeze them and spray fish sperm on each other just to be jerks.

    I had kind of forgotten about that and how nasty it was until last year when I pulled over my car to help a cyclist with a flat and saw him and his bike covered in white goop.
    I rode it for a few years...til I cut a tire so bad it wouldn't seal. As you say it was a big mess. Ditched it as soon as I got home, been using normal tires and tubes every since. Tubeless is great on mountain bikes but for me it's not worth the hassle on the road, even if it only happens once every couple of years.
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