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  1. #1
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    schwalbe pro one tubeless and Stans notubes tire sealant

    Hi,

    Wondering if anyone has been using the schwalbe Pro One tubeless and Stans notubes tire sealant. Is there any potential compatibility problem ?

    My Pro-One tire "exploded" on me in the middle of the night. I wasn't riding, but the tire is left on the shelves after a test ride.

    I hope this is a one off. My rear tire looks okie, but I will inspect tomorrow.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails schwalbe pro one tubeless and Stans notudes tire sealant-img_20170227_221144.jpg   schwalbe pro one tubeless and Stans notudes tire sealant-img_20170227_221202.jpg  
    Last edited by ongbenghui; 02-27-2017 at 06:27 AM.

  2. #2
    tlg
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    How many miles?
    I'm running Pro One's, not with Stans sealant (not that it should matter). No problems @ 1,200mi and they seem to be holding up well.
    Custom Di2 & Garmin/GoPro mounts 2013 SuperSix EVO Hi-MOD Team * 2004 Klein Aura V

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    How many miles?
    I'm running Pro One's, not with Stans sealant (not that it should matter). No problems @ 1,200mi and they seem to be holding up well.
    Err... miles ? :P maybe 2 ?

    I set it up, went for a test ride, back home, leave it on a shelves.

    But seriously, I hope it is a one-off.

  4. #4
    Bianchi-Campagnolo
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    AFAIR Schwalbe's own sealant is relabeled Stans.
    Couold be a manufacturing defect. Those things happen, and sometimes QC don't catch them.

    Some questions:
    What tyre pressure do you use?
    What rims are those?
    Is the unseating of the tyre a result of the bang or the reason for it?

    I'm using the tyres myself on a wheel set, but they haven't received the regular abuse yet, just going round in circles on the local indoor athletics track in the Norwegian winter.
    They do anything just to win a salami in ridiculous races. I take my gear out of the car and put my bike together. Tourists and locals are watching from sidewalk cafes. Non-racers. The emptiness of those lives shocks me. It was the illest of times, it was the dopest of times. And we looked damn good. Actually the autobus broke down somewhere on the Mortirolo.

  5. #5
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    I'd speculate the majority of tubeless users use Stan's for their sealant, so your setup is quite common. Unless you pumped the tires up excessively (>120 PSI), this was probably just a one-off manufacturer's defect.

    Still I'm not fond of Schwalbe's QC. Of the 4 or so tubeless tires I tried from them, most had some sort of QC issues or deformities/bulges. I wouldn't use them again even though they are relatively cheap tires, there are better value tubeless options out there.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by kbwh View Post
    AFAIR Schwalbe's own sealant is relabeled Stans.
    Couold be a manufacturing defect. Those things happen, and sometimes QC don't catch them.

    Some questions:
    What tyre pressure do you use?
    What rims are those?
    Is the unseating of the tyre a result of the bang or the reason for it?
    I am pumping to 110 for these tyres. they are mounted on Easton EA90RT wheelset.
    I think (hope) it is probably a one-off QC defect.

  7. #7
    tlg
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    Quote Originally Posted by ongbenghui View Post
    I am pumping to 110 for these tyres. they are mounted on Easton EA90RT wheelset.
    I think (hope) it is probably a one-off QC defect.
    110...holy Cr#p. You're defeating some of the best features of tubeless.

    I run 60-70 front and 70-80 rear.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tlg View Post
    110...holy Cr#p. You're defeating some of the best features of tubeless.

    I run 60-70 front and 70-80 rear.
    Will test by slowly reducing by 10.

  9. #9
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    Looks like a QC defect. there is an internal cut within that is align with the direction of cotton weave.

    Was a little disappointed with Schwalbe QC.

    schwalbe pro one tubeless and Stans notudes tire sealant-img_20170228_183032.jpg

  10. #10
    changingleaf
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    I've been running the Schwalbe S-one with Stan's sealant for two years with no problem. I have a set of the Pro One's setup at home with sealant, but haven't ridden them yet. It looks like they have a very soft compound.

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    I've used Ones, G-Ones, and Pro Ones with Stan's with no issue, but it looks like mystery solved otherwise.

    Which brings up another question that I've been meaning to float. And I bring this up with some grave hesitation because I know that opinions run strong on the whole tubeless debate, but here goes...

    Anecdotally, it seems that tubeless road tires have a higher rate of sidewall gashes than regular tube tires. By which I mean straight line, looks like it was cut with a razor, oriented more or less exactly along a 45* axis to the tire. My perception is that I hear a lot of people relating that a lot of the times when sealant wouldn't solve an issue was such an occurrence (and almost always joined with a "but a tubed tire would have had the same level of destruction in such an incident"). So the thing I'm wondering is whether that rejoinder is actually accurate, in that such gashes are indeed far more prevalent among tubeless tires in the first place?

    Personally, I have had one sidewall gash lifetime, and it was on a tubeless tire, as described. My response was also exactly as described - "that would have killed any tire!" But it looked so razor clean, like Freddy Krueger himself had done it, that I was sure I'd find the offending implement right there. Didn't. Fortunately I was not more than 300' from home when it happened.

    The only notable incidents of tubed tire sidewall gashes I'm aware of are that they were identified with a run of Continental GP4000s, and there have been some open tubulars that haven't played nice with carbon clinchers. As I'm aware, both of these would run along the direction of the bead, not in a 45* to it.

    I swear I have no horse in this race, just curious to find better info on whether this is a thing or not.

  12. #12
    changingleaf
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    I've been running tubeless road tires for 6 years and similar to yourself I did get a cut on the sidewall, which I recall only happening once before when I ran tubes. It was also in my first year of running tubeless and I had to fix it with a tube to get home, and yes it was a little messy with the sealant. This particular incident though would have surely sliced any tire. Some porcelain shards were in the side of the road possibly left from someone's house remodeling trash and it sliced my tire instantly. I didn't realize those small bits of white rocks were porcelain until I looked at them up close. Every puncture I've had since has been in the tread and the larger ones will only hold 10 or 20 psi, which was just enough pressure to ride home (with a tubeless-ready rim that is). These punctures I patched on the inside of the tire with a tube patch and reused the tire. I actually did patch the sliced tire as well and used it until the tread was gone.

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    I've never had a sidewall cut with either tubed clinchers (used to run Conti 4Ks) or in 25K+ miles of road tubeless use. But my rides are %40 with 1 or 2 other people and 60% solo. I never rely on others to call out road hazards, I always keep a watch out for myself so I don't get any surprises.

  14. #14
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    Schwalbe are famous for lousy QC. I've used a lot of their tires on road and MTb. I love their ride and grip and they tend to wear well. I've had several problems with sidewall tears. All encountered on first few rides. My lbs stopped stocking schwalbe because of high return rate.

    When they survive the first few rides they tend to behave very well. I've put ridiculous miles up on ultremos and one tubeless. One racing Ralph self destructed on its 4 th ride, the other two have lasted years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ongbenghui View Post
    Will test by slowly reducing by 10.
    Yep, I weigh ~210lbs and only run my tires at 72f/85r for 25c tires. Lower pressure (to a point) gives many benefits such as a comfier ride, better tire longevity and cornering, and ultimately stresses the tire less- which in my experience results in fewer and less severe punctures.

  16. #16
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    I just mounted up a Schwalbe Pro One tubeless using Orange Seal. I've always used Stan's in my MTB and CX tires but read reviews (tests) which showed Orange Seal did a better job sealing punctures. The road tires set up tubeless much easier than I anticipated but I have lots of experience with tubeless MTB and CX tires.

  17. #17
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    No issues with Schwalbe Pro One or G-one w/ stan's sealants. Been running them since they came out in tubeless edition. Have not experienced any of the QC issues mentioned here but I weight about 155 and run them at ... 70-100 psi depending on conditions.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by November Dave View Post
    I've used Ones, G-Ones, and Pro Ones with Stan's with no issue, but it looks like mystery solved otherwise.

    Which brings up another question that I've been meaning to float. And I bring this up with some grave hesitation because I know that opinions run strong on the whole tubeless debate, but here goes...

    Anecdotally, it seems that tubeless road tires have a higher rate of sidewall gashes than regular tube tires. By which I mean straight line, looks like it was cut with a razor, oriented more or less exactly along a 45* axis to the tire. My perception is that I hear a lot of people relating that a lot of the times when sealant wouldn't solve an issue was such an occurrence (and almost always joined with a "but a tubed tire would have had the same level of destruction in such an incident"). So the thing I'm wondering is whether that rejoinder is actually accurate, in that such gashes are indeed far more prevalent among tubeless tires in the first place?

    Personally, I have had one sidewall gash lifetime, and it was on a tubeless tire, as described. My response was also exactly as described - "that would have killed any tire!" But it looked so razor clean, like Freddy Krueger himself had done it, that I was sure I'd find the offending implement right there. Didn't. Fortunately I was not more than 300' from home when it happened.

    The only notable incidents of tubed tire sidewall gashes I'm aware of are that they were identified with a run of Continental GP4000s, and there have been some open tubulars that haven't played nice with carbon clinchers. As I'm aware, both of these would run along the direction of the bead, not in a 45* to it.

    I swear I have no horse in this race, just curious to find better info on whether this is a thing or not.
    I've had exactly three sidewall cuts in my lifetime - all three of them on the same set of tires (one was replaced under warranty from my shop). I was an early adopter of the Schwalbe Pro One tubeless when they first came out, and was interested in giving Tubeless a try - I had my bike shop order me a set, and withing the first 10 miles I had cut a sidewall. I was riding a very popular gravel rail trail that I have ridden hundreds of times on 28mm conti 4 seasons and never even had a flat, let a lone a cut. None the less, I chalked that up to bad luck and bought a new tire. A couple of rides later, I cut the other tire on a different trail. Same type of cut (not as clean as Dave describes, but it was a fairly clean cut of wall as if something sharp had been poked into it). I talked to the shop manager and she offered me a warranty replacement. Not a week later I cut the font again in similar circumstances. That was enough for me - I put my 4 Seasons back on and didn't look back.

    I have Clement MSO tubeless on my dedicated gravel bike, and, while I don't have a ton of miles (maybe 500), they have been flawless. Never a flat of any kind riding some pretty rough/sharp gravel.

    I was put off by my experience with the Pro Ones and stayed away from Schwalbe for a while - but recently decided to run tubeless on an alternate set of wheels on my road bike, and opted for the new Schwalbe G-One Speed (700x30). I've not had a chance to ride them yet, but I'm hoping they aren't as fragile as those first Pro Ones were.

  19. #19
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    This seems like a good place to ask this question.

    I'm a relative newb to Tubeless - two sets of road tires - never had a MTB.

    Aside from replacing due to damage or tire wear, what is the maintenance required for sealant?

    How long does it last before it becomes ineffective? I assume the bike that's been sitting in the garage all winter needs to have it's tires pulled and fresh sealant applied?

    Can it be freshened up by adding more sealant? I assume at some point you have to pull the tire off and clean and replace the sealant?

    What is the best way to clean the old sealant off? I'm guessing that once its gummed up, it's no longer water soluable?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    I've had exactly three sidewall cuts in my lifetime ...
    When Schwalbe first came out with these tires they were billed as "race-day" tires. For some reason they seemed to have walked back from that language, and IMO they are being very disingenuous about it's durability.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    This seems like a good place to ask this question.

    I'm a relative newb to Tubeless - two sets of road tires - never had a MTB.

    Aside from replacing due to damage or tire wear, what is the maintenance required for sealant?

    How long does it last before it becomes ineffective? I assume the bike that's been sitting in the garage all winter needs to have it's tires pulled and fresh sealant applied?

    Can it be freshened up by adding more sealant? I assume at some point you have to pull the tire off and clean and replace the sealant?

    What is the best way to clean the old sealant off? I'm guessing that once its gummed up, it's no longer water soluable?
    That's a loaded question. All these effect sealant longevity:

    - Brand
    - Temperature
    - Ambient humidity
    - Tire casing porosity

    Using butyl lined tires (Maxxis Padrone originals), I've had sealant last 6+ months until I changed the tires. For more porous tires without a butyl liner (ie. "Tubeless ready" tires like IRC RBCCs) during CO arid summers, sealant might only last me 1-2 months before it completely dries out. Personally I've never cleaned sealant before changing worn out tires, I just throw in more sealant as needed.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migen21 View Post
    I've had exactly three sidewall cuts in my lifetime - all three of them on the same set of tires (one was replaced under warranty from my shop). I was an early adopter of the Schwalbe Pro One tubeless when they first came out, and was interested in giving Tubeless a try - I had my bike shop order me a set, and withing the first 10 miles I had cut a sidewall. I was riding a very popular gravel rail trail that I have ridden hundreds of times on 28mm conti 4 seasons and never even had a flat, let a lone a cut. None the less, I chalked that up to bad luck and bought a new tire. A couple of rides later, I cut the other tire on a different trail. Same type of cut (not as clean as Dave describes, but it was a fairly clean cut of wall as if something sharp had been poked into it). I talked to the shop manager and she offered me a warranty replacement. Not a week later I cut the font again in similar circumstances. That was enough for me - I put my 4 Seasons back on and didn't look back.

    I have Clement MSO tubeless on my dedicated gravel bike, and, while I don't have a ton of miles (maybe 500), they have been flawless. Never a flat of any kind riding some pretty rough/sharp gravel.

    I was put off by my experience with the Pro Ones and stayed away from Schwalbe for a while - but recently decided to run tubeless on an alternate set of wheels on my road bike, and opted for the new Schwalbe G-One Speed (700x30). I've not had a chance to ride them yet, but I'm hoping they aren't as fragile as those first Pro Ones were.
    This is interesting because I had the exact opposite experience! I used to ride only Continental 4 Seasons and I went through like 3 sidewall failures and have been riding various tubeless brands without issue (been on the One since it came out tubeless, and Pro One after that, and my commuter has the S/G One).

    FYI, I have about 1600 miles commuting on the S-Ones (now rebranded ot G one?) and they have been lovely to me. Running them on Pacenti SL25s at around 60 PSI, combined bike+rider weight probably around 185 or so. Here's how the rear tread looks (keep in mind my commute is all asphalt, no gravel, unfortunately...)

    ...and ten minutes later, i'm done trying to get the image to upload. this forum should be able to handle a normal 3.4 MB file from a smartphone picture

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