"I frankly would rather ride 8-speed Dura Ace than 11 speed 105 or 10-speed Tiagra"
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  1. #1
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    "I frankly would rather ride 8-speed Dura Ace than 11 speed 105 or 10-speed Tiagra"

    Your thoughts on this? This quote comes from tocycles.com, a seller of 2nd-hand high end bikes. It's in the "Groupset" section here:

    FAQs - TOCycles

    The page's argument is that for the same amount of money (say $1500), you can get a much better ride from a used bike compared to a new bike, primarily because of the quality of the components. They may be used, but they are superior to equivalently-priced new components.

    Given trickle-down technology, at what point does current lower-end components match up with old-school DA and Ultegra? I don't think 105 is at 11 speed quite yet (that's not the exact point), but "is" 8-speed DA really superior to modern 105?

    I ask these questions cause I'm thinking of changing my 10-speed ultegra drivetrain (6500) to a triple, and I have the opportunity to swap it for a 9-speed ultegra triple. Just wondering if I'll lose a lot (or any) performance in terms of the crispness/quality of the shifting since the 10-speed is obviously newer and hence presumably better designed. If the quality of DA (and hence ultegra kinda) is basically future-proof, then I'd be more inclined to make this switch.

  2. #2
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    Last year I bought a used trek 5200 with 9 speed Ultegra (3x9). I could have spend more on new bike and got 2x10 Tiagra, but chose instead the older bike an components.

    BTW... I paid $500 for this 2001 carbon bike and $500 in new market would have gotten me nothing like it. The bike has been a very good runner over the 1400 miles I have put on it. I am happy I bought it instead of new. Back in 2001 this bike was just one step below top of the line Trek 5900 with dura-ace.
    Joe
    Road Bike - Specialized Venge | MTB - 2018 Specialized Epic - Vassago Verhauen Steel SS - 2013 Santa Cruz 5010

  3. #3
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    my backup bike with DA8 is sweet.

    since it's only ridden a few hundred miles a year now, tend to forget how nice it shifts and stops.

    Tiagra? phhht....I'll take the DA any day.
    Ancient Astronaut theorists say, 'YES!'

  4. #4
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    The word used doesn't specify how used so it's really a pointless discussion to have.

  5. #5
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    It was my understanding that for the most part, companies like Shimano "trickle down" their technology. I'm going to just chuck this one out but it would be something like:

    2013 105 = 2010 Ultegra = 2007 Dura Ace...

    Again, I may be wrong and those dates are completely made up but I thought this is how it works...

  6. #6
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    Bear in mind that drive train components don't have infinite service lives. Stuff wears out and/or gets damaged. Although I'm not going to be shopping for NOS 8 speed Dura Ace components in this lifetime, and have no idea of what's available, I would suspect that the supply of new replacement parts is dwindling for 8 speed Dura Ace.

  7. #7
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    I don't think you'd feel much difference between 6500 and whatever model number 3x9 would have been. I also don't think the 8th and 9th cog add that much to the function of the drivetrain. But, I can say the same thing about a third chainring.

    I feel like you have a real question, "How do I get my available gear ratios to meet my needs better?" that you're presenting as a question about one possible solution you have in mind.

    At risk of being kind of a jerk, let me propose a couple other options that may solve your problem without having to replace so many parts or try to hunt down bits and pieces of NOS high-end drivetrains.

    Depending on what cassette you've got, you might consider a wider range. I like 12-27 a lot. Right now, I actually have an 11-32, though in 9-speed, I do notice a couple of the jumps sometimes.

    Depending on what two chainrings you have, you might consider going smaller. I've done that too on this bike - it has a 34 and a 46. Great for climbing, and 46/11 is plenty high for me. You can actually go even lower if you want to.

  8. #8
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    OK - I've read several suggestions about going to a compact crank and I'm on board. I also want to shorten my crank arms cause they are theoretically too long for me (I'm 5'6 with average dimensions). I currently have 172.5 FSA Gossamers. I've found a compact ultegra 6700 crank at 165 in good shape. Images here:

    https://imageshack.us/a/img703/9818/5gbo.jpg
    https://imageshack.us/a/img843/1397/vkhl.jpg

    Is there anything else I need to buy to switch my crankarms over? Any sizing concerns I have to look out for? (e.g. are BB's basically all standard size?) Do I need a new cassette? The current RD is a 6500 Ultegra 10 speed.

  9. #9
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    Your chainrings need the same BCD. I'm a bit of a Shimano fanboy with regard to their chainrings, so I'd be thinking about getting a whole crankset, not just the arms and BB. Is your existing BB English-threaded? There are a few standards now.

    What chainrings do you have now? If they're 53/39, they probably also have a 130 BCD, while compact means 110. Also, is that the 6700 crank or the 6750? I ask because first you say compact sounds attractive, but 6700 is a standard crank, and wouldn't accept those rings.

    Be cautious of theories about crank arm size and rider height. Nobody's been able to show a correlation in the lab. It certainly seems intuitive, but so did the idea that the Sun orbits the Earth. FWIW, I'm happy enough on everything from 165 to 175, though I do notice it's a little harder for me to dial in saddle height when I have 175s on my bike.

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