For Those Using 12-speed Road Already...
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  1. #1
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    For Those Using 12-speed Road Already...

    ...how's it holding up? Chain wear any worse than 10/11 spd? Is it staying in adjustment? Is the chainline driving you nuts? Noisier? More FD rub? Or is it all pretty much copacetic?

    Inquiring minds want to know.
    .
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

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  2. #2
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    I changed my bike with 2018 Chorus 11 over to the new Chorus 12, as soon as it became available in July. I liked it so well that a bought another groupset to change out my other bike with older Chorus 11.

    The front shifting is improved. The chainline is not an issue, but I don't use either of the two largest sprockets with the big ring. Even with 11 speed, you get a lot more chain noise using those sprockets.

    Campy's new maximum smoothness coated shift cables definitely improved the rear shifting on my frame with internally routed cables.

    Riding the steep foothills and mountains of Colorado, I opted for the new 48/32 crank and 11-34 cassette.

    It's too early to gauge chain life, but I don't expect much change. I'm also trying the new SRAM AXS chain, in addition to the Campy 12 chain. It's supposed to be SRAM's longest lasting chain.

    The standard bike chain is a #40 design with a maximum roller diameter of .306 inch. For some reason, SRAM decided to make their chain fit the #41 chain standard, that has the same 1/2 inch pitch, but a .3125 (5/16) inch maximum roller diameter. In theory, it won't work with other brands of chainrings or sprockets. It seems to work fine with Campy chainrings and sprockets.

  3. #3
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    I have something like 4000 km on Record 12, 52/36 and 11-29/32. Rear shifting is improved to my old SR 11. Chain life seems to be equal to 11 speed. I change now to preserve cassette life. Front gearing has one more click for full cross chaining. I don't mind.
    They do anything just to win a salami in ridiculous races. I take my gear out of the car and put my bike together. Tourists and locals are watching from sidewalk cafes. Non-racers. The emptiness of those lives shocks me. It was the illest of times, it was the dopest of times. And we looked damn good. Actually the autobus broke down somewhere on the Mortirolo.

  4. #4
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    A thank you to kbwh and C40 for your experiences thus far with 12-spd road.

    Kinda surprised it’s only you two weighing in though. Thread is closing in on 400 views.

    Aka ‘The lurker is strong with RBR.’
    .
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Sys: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that the children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  5. #5
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    Who cares about 12? 13 is the new thing.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmach View Post
    Who cares about 12? 13 is the new thing.
    I'm holding out for 14.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmach View Post
    Who cares about 12? 13 is the new thing.
    Rotor’s 13-spd MTB drivetrain? Eh, whatevs.
    .
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Sys: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that the children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  8. #8
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    Anyone else? Or is the 12-speed adoption wave pretty slow?
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Sys: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that the children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  9. #9
    Matnlely Dregaend
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    I'm hesitant to switch because I prefer 12-XX cassettes which aren't available (yet?). Granted the 48 large ring would make up for it up top, but I'm still holding out for a 12-29 and a 12-32 cassette with an 18...
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  10. #10
    Adorable Furry Hombre
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    Quote Originally Posted by SystemShock View Post
    Anyone else? Or is the 12-speed adoption wave pretty slow?

    Well, Shimano is taking their sweet time...Only Campag and SRAM users.
    "Refreshingly Unconcerned With The Vulgar Exigencies Of Veracity "

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrSmile View Post
    I'm hesitant to switch because I prefer 12-XX cassettes which aren't available (yet?). Granted the 48 large ring would make up for it up top, but I'm still holding out for a 12-29 and a 12-32 cassette with an 18...
    Does make sense to at least try to go that route. Though the component makers probably won't, sad to say.

    The SRAM 12-spd road cassettes for instance start with a 10t, which is less efficient than larger cogs, due to the tighter bend on the chain and the higher frictional forces that causes. Yes, they've tested such things.

    Though I'd bet the resulting efficiency still beats things like internally-geared hubs and the like.

    But yeah, SRAM seems dedicated to 10t-XX for road 12-speed, and Campy likes 11t-XX for it. Shimano would have to be the eventual savior then, but I'd bet they'll go 11t-XX only.

    It's like it doesn't even occur to them that many riders don't want or need an 11t (much less a 10t), they want the xtra cog to go towards smaller jumps within the cassette, or a lower bailout gear.

    Yeah, yeah, we get it... some ppl are starting to run sub-50t large chainrings (or at least are considering it), and tiny cogs are necessary to get big top gears there.

    But that's far from everyone, and much of the rest of the crowd would happily have say a 50x12 or 52x12 top if it meant small jumps combined with a nice low bailout gear.

    When did things get so weird and racer-wannabe that 52x12 is considered 'too short' for non-pro riders?

    Reminds me of the bad old days of 42x21 bailout gears. It's amazing how designers so often fail to spec gearing with the typical rider in mind (but with marketing/'the aspirational rider' very much in mind)... and they've been failing at this for at least 30-40 years now(!). Bleah.
    .
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Sys: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that the children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by C-40 View Post
    The standard bike chain is a #40 design with a maximum roller diameter of .306 inch. For some reason, SRAM decided to make their chain fit the #41 chain standard, that has the same 1/2 inch pitch, but a .3125 (5/16) inch maximum roller diameter. In theory, it won't work with other brands of chainrings or sprockets. It seems to work fine with Campy chainrings and sprockets.
    Hey C40,

    Is the SRAM AXS chain working out OK? I just bought a Chorus 12 group for a bike and I got one Camp chain with the group. I bought 1 AXS to try after reading your post. I use your age old scheme of running 5 chains and one cassette swapping chains every 1100 miles, riding 3 cycles, so 3300 miles per chain, 16500 on the cassette. I even have a couple bikes with 6 chains in the loop, even one with 7. I think the cassettes will go the distance!! But I'm 73 years old now and I may not live long enough to find out with 6 bikes in this system!!!

    Nice to see you around, before cx showed up, and you sort of faded a bit (not sure which happened first, been a while!), you were the MAN here, especially in the Camp world!!

  13. #13
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    12 is a downgrade since neither Campagnolo nor SRAM makes cassettes with 17-18-19 cogs.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Eckhardt View Post
    12 is a downgrade since neither Campagnolo nor SRAM makes cassettes with 17-18-19 cogs.
    Riding since 5 speed, not the concern for me it seem to be

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Eckhardt View Post
    12 is a downgrade since neither Campagnolo nor SRAM makes cassettes with 17-18-19 cogs.
    Agreed. The 12 speed crap is a fail for me. Cassette choices are trash. I'll stay 11 speed.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by thosj View Post
    Riding since 5 speed, not the concern for me it seem to be
    I’ve also been riding since the 5-spd days... and I would like an 18t cog, actually.

    Why, with 12-spd, they can’t give you a cassette that has one, is beyond me.

    Maybe Shimano will finally stop the fail-train on this, when they go to 12-spd road.
    .
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Sys: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that the children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  17. #17
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    Proper cassettes will probably come when 12 speed comes in sub Chorus range in Campagnolo world.

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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by SystemShock View Post
    I’ve also been riding since the 5-spd days... and I would like an 18t cog, actually.

    .
    As an "old" guy I've devolved to 34-50 with 10 and 11. Went 32-48 for this 12. So......34/18 and 32/17 are .002 ratio apart. My old legs will surely NOT be able to detect that difference.

  19. #19
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    I tend to stay one iteration behind the times (mostly for budget reasons). I am just now trying out 11sp cassettes. But then, I run 1X on my road bikes so I'm an odd duck.

    Personally, I'd like to see more affordable options for completely a la carte cassettes that allow you to choose your range to suit your individual needs. Probably too niche a market to make it viable though. I know Miche makes some interesting combos, but even then you're limited to the ranges they choose.
    Last edited by Opus51569; 3 Weeks Ago at 07:45 AM.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by thosj View Post
    Hey C40,

    Is the SRAM AXS chain working out OK? I just bought a Chorus 12 group for a bike and I got one Camp chain with the group. I bought 1 AXS to try after reading your post. I use your age old scheme of running 5 chains and one cassette swapping chains every 1100 miles, riding 3 cycles, so 3300 miles per chain, 16500 on the cassette. I even have a couple bikes with 6 chains in the loop, even one with 7. I think the cassettes will go the distance!! But I'm 73 years old now and I may not live long enough to find out with 6 bikes in this system!!!

    Nice to see you around, before cx showed up, and you sort of faded a bit (not sure which happened first, been a while!), you were the MAN here, especially in the Camp world!!
    I quit cycling for 8 years because my knees were shot, but I now have new knees and I'm cycling again. The AXS chain works fine, but I decided to mainly use Campy Chorus chains. I have 6 chains, in total now, that I'm alternating between two bikes with Chorus 12. The 48/32 and 11-34 work great for the terrain that I ride.

    A gear inch chart will show that the 14-15-16-17 range covers the same general range as a 53 chain ring with the 16-17-18-19. I've got all of the close gear spacing that I need, plus additional low gears for the really steep grades of up to 12% that I ride.

    My favorite new thing is my waxed based home brew chain lube. I combine 3 ounces of paraffin with one ounce of high quality lubricating oil, like auto gear lube and dissolve with naptha (camp stove fuel). It requires at least 3 ounces of naptha to each ounce of the wax/oil mixture. It's extremely clean, like hot waxing, without all the hassle. I tend to relube after 3 rides of 40-50 miles.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by thosj View Post
    As an "old" guy I've devolved to 34-50 with 10 and 11.

    Went 32-48 for this 12. So......34/18 and 32/17 are .002 ratio apart. My old legs will surely NOT be able to detect that difference.
    That is the other option... going with a smaller crankset.

    But, new cranks are more expensive than a new cassette, all else being equal.
    .
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Sys: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that the children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Opus51569 View Post
    Personally, I'd like to see more affordable options for completely a la carte cassettes that allow you to choose your range to suit your individual needs.
    Me too. That's really the Holy Grail™ of cassette-dom.

    We had it in the old days, would be great if it ever came back. Though I doubt it'll happen.
    .
    MH: I want to go like my Dad did, peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    Sys: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that the children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind.


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