Tiso 12 speed wireless electronic group
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  1. #1
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    Tiso 12 speed wireless electronic group

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  2. #2
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    lol just read it over at WW forum (and bikeRadar) and I was just making the same comment... I wouldn't know what to do with an 11th speed, more so with a 12th !!! ;)

  3. #3
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    Remote control lol... I'm gonna change my gears from the couch!
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrSmile View Post
    Remote control lol... I'm gonna change my gears from the couch!
    Or you can change your buddies gears when he ain't looking.

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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    Or you can change your buddies gears when he ain't looking.
    finally I'm gonna win that field sprint!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by metoou2 View Post
    finally I'm gonna win that field sprint!

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    Quote Originally Posted by velodog View Post
    Or you can change your buddies gears when he ain't looking.
    I don't think that's the case. If you pair with another Bluetooth device, I believe it will only communicate with that device. However, regardless of whether it is 2.4GHz or Bluetooth, all you have to do is turn them off like your smart phone.

    Anyway, after riding EPS and subsequently lusting after it, to me wireless brings very little to the party other than some additional potential problems. AAA's? Really?
    Last edited by flatlander_48; 12-13-2012 at 10:02 AM.
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  8. #8
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    Interesting in it's own way, but this particular entry will flatline. IMO they'd have had better luck if they hadn't tried for wireless. One battery to charge every now and then? OK. A set of them to fuss with, that'll need recharging / replacement at different rates? seems like a pain.

    Any word on what carrier they're shoving 12 cogs onto? Did they invent the negative-dish wheel yet?
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  9. #9
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    I'll wait until they come out with an 11-23

    PS "D-Cells" would last longer
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR_GRUMPY View Post
    I'll wait until they come out with an 11-23

    PS "D-Cells" would last longer.
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    Yes, but you can't package them as efficiently...
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    Quote Originally Posted by danl1 View Post
    Any word on what carrier they're shoving 12 cogs onto? Did they invent the negative-dish wheel yet?
    I was wondering the same thing... And if its the same carrier, they are they using an even thinner chain?

  12. #12
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    They're using thinner spacing and thinner Ti cogs on a standard 10 speed hub. They use a Campagnolo 11 speed chain! Also an 11-29 cassette is mentioned, my guess would be 11-12-13-14-15-17-19-21-23-25-27-29.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by danl1 View Post
    Interesting in it's own way, but this particular entry will flatline. IMO they'd have had better luck if they hadn't tried for wireless. One battery to charge every now and then? OK. A set of them to fuss with, that'll need recharging / replacement at different rates? seems like a pain.

    Any word on what carrier they're shoving 12 cogs onto? Did they invent the negative-dish wheel yet?
    I would imagine that you would replace them as a pack. In the past I've had devices that had 4 rechargeable C batteries. I used them as a group and charged them as a group. Besides, unless you put a meter on each battery, you wouldn't be aware of a possible difference anyway.

    However, to me the issue is recharging, assuming that the batteries are not alkalines. All of the chargers that I remember will accomodate 2, 4 or 6 bateries. If the Tiso battery pack requires more than that, you would need more than one charger or charge serially with one charger.
    2016 Ritchey BreakAway (carbon)
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    BeBop Pedals

    Previous:
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  14. #14
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    Twelve cogs are overkill. I hardly find enough use for my ten-speed cassette.

    Short answer to your question: No. It will not make you faster. It's about gear ratios and your power output. Moreover, the added mass might slow you down a bit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SauronHimself View Post
    No. It will not make you faster. It's about gear ratios and your power output. Moreover, the added mass might slow you down a bit.
    might want to check your sarcasm meter............me thinks it's broke

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    I apologize if the question is elementary:

    I often wonder; Since pro tour bikes have a minimum required weight, wouldn't putting a triple be easier than trying to squeeze in more cogs?


    Since it's possible to skip gears while shifting (Like with Campagnolo shifters), couldn't a set up (gears) be designed to achieve similar results?

    Have the two largest chainrings to be, for example, a 54T and a 50T while the smallest chainring be the usual 39T.


    You math wizards and gears experts help me out here!


    Have it to where an 11 speed is set up so that the middle chainring acts like a gear splitter, for example. Of course that would mean the left shifter will be used much more than before. I can definitely see gear splitting being beneficial while climbing as well as TT'ing.

    With e-shifting, that would be a sweet set up !
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by cda 455 View Post
    I apologize if the question is elementary:

    I often wonder; Since pro tour bikes have a minimum required weight, wouldn't putting a triple be easier than trying to squeeze in more cogs?


    Since it's possible to skip gears while shifting (Like with Campagnolo shifters), couldn't a set up (gears) be designed to achieve similar results?

    Have the two largest chainrings to be, for example, a 54T and a 50T while the smallest chainring be the usual 39T.


    You math wizards and gears experts help me out here!


    Have it to where an 11 speed is set up so that the middle chainring acts like a gear splitter, for example. Of course that would mean the left shifter will be used much more than before. I can definitely see gear splitting being beneficial while climbing as well as TT'ing.

    With e-shifting, that would be a sweet set up !
    I'd think the higher risk of chain dropping says nay to triples (Andy Schleck screams "nooooo!"). That, and dumping a cassette is faster than changing rings in some scenarios.

    For the whole "12 is teh uselessness!!!11!1!"....as long as it's reliable, a 12-25t with the 18t and 20t cogs (so 12,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21,23,25) would be pretty nice imo. In climbing situations, just having that more exact gear could make all the difference.

    Noq I don't mean to bash Tiso, but they made an incredibly meaningless product (regards to wireless) as an attempt to have their breakthrough in the component industry. The finish on the levers and RD is a joke. Sounds like it can create more problems than solve. The big 3 will show up with their 12 speed whenever they feel it necessary.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ventruck View Post
    I'd think the higher risk of chain dropping says nay to triples (Andy Schleck screams "nooooo!"). That, and dumping a cassette is faster than changing rings in some scenarios.

    For the whole "12 is teh uselessness!!!11!1!"....as long as it's reliable, a 12-25t with the 18t and 20t cogs (so 12,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21,23,25) would be pretty nice imo. In climbing situations, just having that more exact gear could make all the difference.

    Noq I don't mean to bash Tiso, but they made an incredibly meaningless product (regards to wireless) as an attempt to have their breakthrough in the component industry. The finish on the levers and RD is a joke. Sounds like it can create more problems than solve. The big 3 will show up with their 12 speed whenever they feel it necessary.
    Good points on the chain drop issue.


    Thanks for the feedback.
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  19. #19
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    I don't think it would help the pros that much. They tailor the cassette to the given conditions; something most recreational riders rarely do. Also, when there is a lot of climbing along the course, some will opt for compact set ups, not triples.


    Quote Originally Posted by cda 455 View Post
    I apologize if the question is elementary:

    I often wonder; Since pro tour bikes have a minimum required weight, wouldn't putting a triple be easier than trying to squeeze in more cogs?


    Since it's possible to skip gears while shifting (Like with Campagnolo shifters), couldn't a set up (gears) be designed to achieve similar results?

    Have the two largest chainrings to be, for example, a 54T and a 50T while the smallest chainring be the usual 39T.


    You math wizards and gears experts help me out here!


    Have it to where an 11 speed is set up so that the middle chainring acts like a gear splitter, for example. Of course that would mean the left shifter will be used much more than before. I can definitely see gear splitting being beneficial while climbing as well as TT'ing.

    With e-shifting, that would be a sweet set up !
    2016 Ritchey BreakAway (carbon)
    Full Campagnolo drivetrain - Chorus 11sp (50, 34 & 12-29)
    Zonda wheels
    Lezyne Super GPS w/Cateye speed/cadence & HR sensors
    Ritchey fork, stem, headset, bars and seatpost
    Fizik Arione VSX saddle
    Cinelli bar tape

    BeBop Pedals

    Previous:
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    2004 Giant TCR-2, Shimano 105 2x9 (sold)
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  20. #20
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    The writeup I saw didn't explain the full battery config, but I'm assuming there's one battery pack that powers both mechs, and something else to manage the shifters. Sensibly, the shifter batteries could go a lot longer without charging than the mechs. If someone cared to maximize the life of their batteries, they'd want to wait until they were more nearly discharged, so charging differently.

    Yeah, for the sake of a few AA rechargeables, that's probably absurd. OTOH, that would mean at least 6 cells, and 4 is a more common number for chargers, and we can probably futz over the front battery case and what to do with it so it's reasonably discrete but readily accessible.

    Given the choice, I'd have a wire.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by danl1 View Post
    The writeup I saw didn't explain the full battery config, but I'm assuming there's one battery pack that powers both mechs, and something else to manage the shifters. Sensibly, the shifter batteries could go a lot longer without charging than the mechs. If someone cared to maximize the life of their batteries, they'd want to wait until they were more nearly discharged, so charging differently.

    Yeah, for the sake of a few AA rechargeables, that's probably absurd. OTOH, that would mean at least 6 cells, and 4 is a more common number for chargers, and we can probably futz over the front battery case and what to do with it so it's reasonably discrete but readily accessible.

    Given the choice, I'd have a wire.
    The BikeRadar article said AAA batteries...
    2016 Ritchey BreakAway (carbon)
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    Zonda wheels
    Lezyne Super GPS w/Cateye speed/cadence & HR sensors
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    Fizik Arione VSX saddle
    Cinelli bar tape

    BeBop Pedals

    Previous:
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    2004 Giant TCR-2, Shimano 105 2x9 (sold)
    2005 Ritchey BreakAway, Campagnolo Centaur 2x10 > 3x10 (stolen)

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by metoou2 View Post
    might want to check your sarcasm meter............me thinks it's broke

    (my comment is NOT sarcasm. use as directed. results may vary)

    My post wasn't sarcastic. Maybe I just made too much sense.

  23. #23
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    So it does - I misread AA somewhere, and that seemed consistent with the DT control box in the pic.

    Either way, the complaint is still there, wrt to the battery box to power the shifters - unless they're managing to bury them in the lever bodies. but that sounds like a potential PITA for charging, and even more batteries than are really needed. Still thinking that a wire is a better solution here.
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  24. #24
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    I'm not really one for 12 speed, or electric, but I like this kind of thinking,
    "...Tiso does specifically mention that the system can be set to work with current Shimano, SRAM and Campagnolo 10- and 11-speed drivetrains, too."
    Don't mind me, it's just the online disinhibition effect typing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ventruck View Post
    I'd think the higher risk of chain dropping says nay to triples
    Why would this be? I ride both, and haven't seen any difference. Are the limit screws harder to set on a triple? (no, of course not). Is the chain line worse? Not really. Maybe I've just been lucky?


    (Andy Schleck screams "nooooo!").
    He was running a triple when he dropped his chain?

    That, and dumping a cassette is faster than changing rings in some scenarios.
    This I can believe.

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