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  1. #1
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    Armstrong On "Today"

    As Armstrong might say, you will either love the interview or hate it. He is still Armstrong. Shades of Gray?



    https://www.today.com/news/lance-arm...candal-t144620
    Last edited by Akirasho; 6 Days Ago at 05:33 AM.

  2. #2
    pmf
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    Watching it this morning. He says 'half the room says stop, you've apologized enough .. and the other half says you can't apologize enough'. My wife looks at me and says 'I've never heard him apologize'.

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    WTF - A freight train with only 3 cars??? I live near a track and the typical freight train is 2-3 miles long.

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    Its kind of an intransigent thing really. Armstrong dominated in a time of doping and the cycling establishment took him down. When you see him interviewed he seems like a perfectly rational guy. He believes he would have won either way...with doping...he was the doping champion as good at doping as he was at bike riding...or without doping....if the rest of the peloton didn't dope.

    I kind of see his side. It was the the do gooders near him I presume who wanted some of his fame that threatened to blow the whistle. What did they have to lose versus Armstrong? They had nothing to lose and Armstrong had everything to lose because he was the big winner.

    Many layers to this. It comes down to how ruthless Armstrong was to protect the canard that he raced clean and cycling was clean. Neither was true.

    On one level certainly not fair to Armstrong because so many doped but many believe Armstrong's ruthless tactics were so beyond the pale he deserved to be taken down.

    Pretty clear, Armstrong believes he won those 7 TdF's and people asking for contrition either don't understand what happened or don't accept it. I am sure Armstrong feels he is being scapegoated for doping in cycling and of course had a big target on his back because he both won and was an American competing in the backyard of the Tour in France.

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    Lots of sociopaths have legions of sycophants.

    Nothing to see here.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by 11spd View Post
    Its kind of an intransigent thing really. Armstrong dominated in a time of doping and the cycling establishment took him down. When you see him interviewed he seems like a perfectly rational guy. He believes he would have won either way...with doping...he was the doping champion as good at doping as he was at bike riding...or without doping....if the rest of the peloton didn't dope.

    I kind of see his side. It was the the do gooders near him I presume who wanted some of his fame that threatened to blow the whistle. What did they have to lose versus Armstrong? They had nothing to lose and Armstrong had everything to lose because he was the big winner.

    Many layers to this. It comes down to how ruthless Armstrong was to protect the canard that he raced clean and cycling was clean. Neither was true.

    On one level certainly not fair to Armstrong because so many doped but many believe Armstrong's ruthless tactics were so beyond the pale he deserved to be taken down.

    Pretty clear, Armstrong believes he won those 7 TdF's and people asking for contrition either don't understand what happened or don't accept it. I am sure Armstrong feels he is being scapegoated for doping in cycling and of course had a big target on his back because he both won and was an American competing in the backyard of the Tour in France.
    Probably one of your best posts, IMHO. As you said, it is a circumstance with many nuances, but ultimately it comes down to (for me, and I suspect many others) that part in bold.

  7. #7
    pmf
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    I don't buy the 'they were all doing it so the playing field was level' argument. It's not like everyone was getting the same shot, pill or patch. He was a mediocre rider and an exceptional doper. Had everyone been clean back in that day, he would not have won the TDF 7 times ... or probably even once. He had his own doping doctor and the entire team was on the program. I never believed that he was racing clean from the get go.

    I must admit though, watching those TDF races from back then was pretty exciting compared to these days. I barely pay attention to it anymore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlazingPedals View Post
    WTF - A freight train with only 3 cars??? I live near a track and the typical freight train is 2-3 miles long.
    well this is misplaced comment!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmf View Post
    Watching it this morning. He says 'half the room says stop, you've apologized enough .. and the other half says you can't apologize enough'. My wife looks at me and says 'I've never heard him apologize'.
    You are married to Betsy Andreu?
    There I was...

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    What about the sh8t that Sky is doing? Armstong may be a cheat, but IMO he doesn't need to apologize to the public seeing how doping is still rampant. I know if I were in his position, I wouldn't apologize to the public. However, on personal level, I would try my best to make mends with the others like Lemond, Betsy, Hamilton. Bottomline is he's damaged good, he knows it, public knows it, opinions have already been formed and solidify. No need to him to try to mend with the public by any apology at this point. Time to move on with life (which he's doing).

    But Sky....

  11. #11
    pmf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clipped_in View Post
    You are married to Betsy Andreu?
    No, she wasn't throwing stuff at the TV screen.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by 11spd View Post
    Its kind of an intransigent thing really.
    Is that the word you meant to use?

  13. #13
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    Armstrong was a jackass and a bully. I was elated when that clown got his titles taken away.

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    Apologizing isn't enough. That's getting off easy.

    To show real contrition, there has to be RESTITUTION. Instead, everyone else gets nothing, Lance retains his millions.

  15. #15
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    When will he just STFU and disappear, like Shoeless Joe Jackson and Pete Rose (mostly) did?
    "L'enfer, c'est les autres"

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    Quote Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    When will he just STFU and disappear, like Shoeless Joe Jackson and Pete Rose (mostly) did?
    thank dog that OJ knew when to STFU.

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    can't spare any contempt or disdain for LA, Trump gets all of it...
    Ancient Astronaut theorists say, 'YES!'

  18. #18
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    One of the things that still bother me in his case is the lack of a positive test (as defined by the standards of the day).

    I'm not a lawyer but outside of a world created by various cycling agencies, doping agencies and the country of France, a prosecutor might only have had a flimsy circumstantial case in a purely US court. Indeed, it sometimes seems as though "the evidence showed that the only way he could have won 7 tours was by doping".


    Also, I've been suspicious of the apparent size of such a conspiracy especially over such a long timespan.


    FREE MEEK MIL.. I MEAN LANCE ARMSTRONG!!!

  19. #19
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    so the doping forum is in here now? No longer in the 'doping forum'?
    Faith is pretending to know things you don't know

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCSaltchucker View Post
    so the doping forum is in here now? No longer in the 'doping forum'?
    It's better than Politics. Oh wait, someone mentioned Trump up the line in their insightful post.

    IMO Armstrong was unconditionally the most talented and greatest Tour de France Rider ever. Period.

    Some agree with me. Some disagree. Others are somewhere in between. Those that make it a life or death level debate need help.

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    Very few of us saw or recall seeing him race before his cancer. I did, and he was mediocre. Watched him finish dead last in Montreal.

    Like someone else here said, when his TDF successes came around, I never had a doubt that he was on the programme.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 11spd View Post
    Its kind of an intransigent thing really. Armstrong dominated in a time of doping and the cycling establishment took him down. When you see him interviewed he seems like a perfectly rational guy. He believes he would have won either way...with doping...he was the doping champion as good at doping as he was at bike riding...or without doping....if the rest of the peloton didn't dope.
    The shades of history don't favor his views... He was an absolute nobody before he doped and now he's pretty much a nobody after he doped and the whole world found out. He's the guy you see at the local crit track that was middle of the pack and would be a one hit wonder before he got on the juice... but he's the same guy you see come back after 6months and know that they're on the juice but due to the lack of drug testing you can never prove anything.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1500SLR View Post
    The shades of history don't favor his views... He was an absolute nobody before he doped and now he's pretty much a nobody after he doped and the whole world found out. He's the guy you see at the local crit track that was middle of the pack and would be a one hit wonder before he got on the juice... but he's the same guy you see come back after 6months and know that they're on the juice but due to the lack of drug testing you can never prove anything.
    aaaaahh, I remember the Festina scandal, with Virenque's tearful interviews... maybe that is Armstrong's failing... not enuff tears.


    Looks as those of you using Uber, saved Armstrong.


    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/lanc...ved-my-family/
    Last edited by Akirasho; 5 Days Ago at 04:20 AM.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akirasho View Post
    aaaaahh, I remember the Festina scandal, with Virenque's tearful interviews... maybe that is Armstrong's failing... not enuff tears.


    Looks as those of you using Uber, saved Armstrong.


    Lance Armstrong: Uber investment 'saved' my family | Cyclingnews.com
    There's always one guy, who is probably from Texas, who believes in Lance. His wiki says it all though really. Before Johan Bruyneel Lance had one rainbow jersey and was considered a mediocre tour rider. I'm sure he also has plenty of millions to support his family though... Who I feel sorry for is the one person who test after test has not proved to be on the gear and that's Australia's Cadel Evans who should have had an extra grand tour win and maybe a couple more with his second place in 2007 and 2008.

    At the [1993] Tour de France, in the stage from Châlons-sur-Marne to Verdun. [Lance Armstrong] was 97th in the general classification when he retired after stage 12.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lance_Armstrong
    Last edited by 1500SLR; 5 Days Ago at 05:00 AM.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    well this is misplaced comment!
    Really! I'm not sure how it got in this thread!

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