• 07-14-2019
    Phurious
    '75 Motobecane LeChampion or Mitts 912
    Not sure how to edit title, auto-correct did it's sneaky insertion.

    Title should be,

    "75 Motobecane LeChampion or Miyata 912"


    Greetings!

    And thank you to the forum.


    I've been looking to invest in a decent road bike, and was considering a nice Cannondale CAAD 6 with very decent upgrades for $800. But after some research I decided Steel was the way to go. I'm wondering if you guys think if this Motobecane is a good deal, or should I talk the price down? I offered $600 to begin from a best offer price tag, "$700 and it's mine he replies." But is now Willing to part with it for $650 if I'm serious. I've done some research and it seems a great bike. Want to get a second opinion.
    It's a 61cm (I'm 6'3 with long legs)
    Groupset is Campagnolo Nuovo Record
    Headset and bars are Phillipe Pro

    I'm Comparing it and value:price

    with a

    Miyata 912
    Shimano 600 Groupset, and an asking price of $299.

    What do you guys think? I'll post pictures of both. Please and thank you for any advice!

    -Phurioushttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...2a260471a3.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...023051ae94.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...389784f806.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...3baf21b4da.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...12d2f5fbcd.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...723f1b0a67.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ff3d2616df.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...f40bf520bb.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...31045d0890.jpg

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  • 07-14-2019
    No Time Toulouse
    Well, if you are looking for "classic steel", I'd say the Miyata might be the way to go. But in no way is the Motobecane worth $600. Maybe $300? That's a 40 year old bike. The Miyata might be worth $300 IF it were well-maintained, but that rusty chain says otherwise. This one is only a 35 year old bike.

    Just wondering why you discarded the idea of a more 'modern' Cannondale for a couple ancient bikes with 6-speed technology and friction shifters? Are you looking for an antique, or are you looking for a modern road bike? I mean, I have a couple 'classic' road bikes, but somehow I doubt that a newbie really wants this sort of old iron.
  • 07-14-2019
    duriel
    I would look inward and not at the bike. Who are you and where are you going to ride? That gearing would be brutal anywhere but florida.
    Are you going to hang it on a wall or ride it?
    35 years of technology is a good thing.... there is a reason why no one rides those bikes!
  • 07-14-2019
    Phurious
    I'm a rookie rider, but a newbie when it comes to hardware.
    I live in Florida at the moment,
    And intend on doing a lot of riding.
    The reason I started to lean towards steel was because of its rigidity and because of what bike I choose will be replacing a vehicle. Becoming a daily rider+fitness trainer.
    Also if I move or visit to another city with potentially harsh roads/pot holes etc.
    Steel seeming to be the most recommended and sought after because of these reasons.
    Comfort and And Strength.


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  • 07-14-2019
    duriel
    If you plan on doing a lot of riding, parts for those bikes may be hard to find. I would get a bike that would handle minimum 28mm tires, that would be my highest priority.

    If it's going to be your primary vehicle, get something you can hang a bunch of stuff on.
  • 07-14-2019
    Phurious
    I'd look towards titanium if there were anything available right now. Most of anything available right now in 60cm+ are Steel, and Aluminum

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  • 07-14-2019
    Phurious
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by duriel View Post
    If you plan on doing a lot of riding, parts for those bikes may be hard to find. I would get a bike that would handle minimum 28mm tires, that would be my highest priority.

    If it's going to be your primary vehicle, get something you can hang a bunch of stuff on.

    I've got a Cannondale H400 that I thought about converting/ for heavy loads. It's been a while since I've gotten to ride fast, and miss sprinting.

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  • 07-14-2019
    duriel
    With larger tires, the frame material is much less of a concern. Alum frames are generally considered stiffer than steel, but with the large tires that is not so critical.
  • 07-14-2019
    Oxtox
    $650 for that Moto is a great deal...for the seller.
  • 07-14-2019
    PBL450
    Frame material is nearly irrelevant considering design and geometry. Donít consider the material as a factor. Consider function. As primary transportation you want comfort. You want reliability. You want fenders. You want indexed shifting. You want 50/34 even in Florida. You want 28s. A 61 seems in the ballpark.
  • 07-15-2019
    No Time Toulouse
    FWIW, you can get a MODERN steel roadbike ("Motobecane", even) for about what that first guy was trying to overcharge you for, which comes with modern components (you know, like the sort of things that you can actually find parts for) online. Probably will even weigh less.....

    Also, when you get down to it, if you want rigidity, you want aluminum or carbon fiber. Butted steel is noted for flexibility, not rigidity. You seem to have an odd understanding of cycling hardware.
  • 07-15-2019
    Phurious
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    FWIW, you can get a MODERN steel roadbike ("Motobecane", even) for about what that first guy was trying to overcharge you for, which comes with modern components (you know, like the sort of things that you can actually find parts for) online. Probably will even weigh less.....

    Also, when you get down to it, if you want rigidity, you want aluminum or carbon fiber. Butted steel is noted for flexibility, not rigidity. You seem to have an odd understanding of cycling hardware.

    I think flexibility is the word I needed.

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  • 07-15-2019
    Jay Strongbow
    If I was "replacing a vehicle" with a bike I could want:
    -ease of rack mounting
    -ease of fender mounting
    -room for tires bigger than 25mm,
    -immediate availability of replacement parts.
    -slow handling
    (in other words a modern touring bike more or less)

    I don't know those bikes but I suspect they are none of that. But then again 'replacing a vehicle" might mean something different to you.
  • 07-15-2019
    No Time Toulouse
    After reading through your post, and what you need a bike for, I realized that my Specialized Awol is probably the sort of bike you need. Also, from looking at your wild selections of bikes you've already considered, that you don't have a clue as to what will work for yourself. You really need to go to a bike shop first.

    I'm 6'2" and love my Awol in "L" size, but I'm longer in the trunk. With your long legs you'd likely need the "XL" size, which needs to be special-ordered in most places. A good shop that has used used bikes may have a bike or 2 in your size, but the reality is that probably 97% of all bikes available are too small for you. Larger sizes cost more.

    Don't forget, if you plan to use a bike for nearly ALL transportation, you will quickly find out just how limited a ROADbike is for that. A touring bike, however, is much more practical. When I was in college, I commuted most days on a Cannondale touring bike, outfitted with rear and front racks and panniers. I commuted 6 or 7 wiles with a half-dozen textbooks, notebooks, rain clothes, etc. Couldn't do that with my roadbike and just a backpack.
  • 07-15-2019
    Phurious
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    After reading through your post, and what you need a bike for, I realized that my Specialized Awol is probably the sort of bike you need. Also, from looking at your wild selections of bikes you've already considered, that you don't have a clue as to what will work for yourself. You really need to go to a bike shop first.

    I'm 6'2" and love my Awol in "L" size, but I'm longer in the trunk. With your long legs you'd likely need the "XL" size, which needs to be special-ordered in most places. A good shop that has used used bikes may have a bike or 2 in your size, but the reality is that probably 97% of all bikes available are too small for you. Larger sizes cost more.

    Don't forget, if you plan to use a bike for nearly ALL transportation, you will quickly find out just how limited a ROADbike is for that. A touring bike, however, is much more practical. When I was in college, I commuted most days on a Cannondale touring bike, outfitted with rear and front racks and panniers. I commuted 6 or 7 wiles with a half-dozen textbooks, notebooks, rain clothes, etc. Couldn't do that with my roadbike and just a backpack.

    I've currently got a Cannondale H400 with racks that is fairly comfortable with 28c tires. I use this for heavy hauls, including trailer hauling, and general commuting.
    I am looking for a road bike, for joy riding, fast frivolous travels, athletic conditioning, and high speeds.
    Planning to do a lot of miles.
    Hence my concern of steel over aluminum.
    More in case I crash for some reason.
    Concerned about denting higher end aluminum frames.
    But, I think I'm just going to try out a CAAD 5 R3000 SI I just saw at a pawn shop.
    Might be the one I end up getting.
    It's 62cm I believe.
    If not that, then I'll be getting the Miata.
    Maybe both.
    Also considering getting the CAAD 6 when the owners return from travels in October.
    Will have some riding by then.

    [emoji106]

    Thanks for all the helpful insight to all.
    I'll update my with my purchase if any might be interested.
    Also open to any and all advice.

    Thank you again.

    -Phurious
    https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...73946ca516.jpg

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  • 07-15-2019
    Phurious
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    FWIW, you can get a MODERN steel roadbike ("Motobecane", even) for about what that first guy was trying to overcharge you for, which comes with modern components (you know, like the sort of things that you can actually find parts for) online. Probably will even weigh less.....

    Also, when you get down to it, if you want rigidity, you want aluminum or carbon fiber. Butted steel is noted for flexibility, not rigidity. You seem to have an odd understanding of cycling hardware.

    I think density might have been a better word for what I was thinking.

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  • 07-15-2019
    blackfrancois
    if it's a le champion, the moto is full 531. and it has a lot of campy record on it. definitely worth $400. if it were fully rebuilt, maybe $600. the thing holding it back is the paint. if the paint were perfect, it's worth well over $650.

    i have a 912 and love it. mine has a tange champion fork, though. i think the original fork is hi-ten.

    there's a reason these bikes are still around -- they were built to last.

    it's very easy to rebuild these bikes and make them like new...
  • 07-15-2019
    Fredrico
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by blackfrancois View Post
    if it's a le champion, the moto is full 531. and it has a lot of campy record on it. definitely worth $400. if it were fully rebuilt, maybe $600. the thing holding it back is the paint. if the paint were perfect, it's worth well over $650.

    i have a 912 and love it. mine has a tange champion fork, though. i think the original fork is hi-ten.

    there's a reason these bikes are still around -- they were built to last.

    it's very easy to rebuild these bikes and make them like new...

    Yep. Parts are still out there, threaded BBs, 1" headsets, 6 speed freewheels, 1/4" wide chains, compatible brake pads, 32 or 36 spoked aluminum rims, etc.

    The gearing on the bikes pictured would be fine in FL.

    OP, use the Cannondale H400 for commuting; free up the steel bike for unloaded pleasure rides. The Moto looks like it'll take 28mm tires, but the Miyata looks like any tire larger than 23mm will hit the seat tube. $300 is a more reasonable price. Moto seller is trying to make money off the Campy components. They have little value to anyone other than collectors, but they'll last forever. Ask me how I know! :D. Reynolds 531 was the tubing of choice for long distance bikes. Very comfortable without losing response.

    Ask the Moto owner about miles and repairs. Are the bearings smooth and quiet? Might need fresh grease. New chain and freewheel would cost around $50.

    The Miyata looks like it has less miles on it, but being old, probably needs the same overhaul, and it might not even take 25mm tires unless that's what's already on there.
  • 07-15-2019
    No Time Toulouse
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by blackfrancois View Post
    if it's a le champion, the moto is full 531. and it has a lot of campy record on it. definitely worth $400. if it were fully rebuilt, maybe $600. the thing holding it back is the paint. if the paint were perfect, it's worth well over $650.

    i have a 912 and love it. mine has a tange champion fork, though. i think the original fork is hi-ten.

    there's a reason these bikes are still around -- they were built to last.

    it's very easy to rebuild these bikes and make them like new...

    What BB would a mid-70's 'Becane use?
  • 07-15-2019
    blackfrancois
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    What BB would a mid-70's 'Becane use?

    depends on the crank, of course.

    the le champion original would be campy record for road double.

    my moto has a sugino for road double. i think mine is swiss thread.

    you could replace it with a cartridge bearing unit, but i wouldn't. they normally work fine when overhauled.
  • 07-15-2019
    blackfrancois
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Fredrico View Post
    New chain and freewheel would cost around $50.

    yeah, the great thing about vintage rides is you can replace stuff like that on the cheap.

    a new chain is under $10. a new freewheel is under $15.
  • 07-15-2019
    Phurious
    So I ended up getting the

    Cannondale R3000 SI CAAD5

    Paid $500+ tax. $535 Total.

    Seemed about right?

    Mavic Ksyrium Elite wheelset
    Easton Carbon Seatpost
    Selle Italia Saddle.
    ..... and as I'm writing this, I just noticed dent on the top tube!

    Dang it!

    Thought I checked it out pretty well. Of course I missed it.

    [emoji37]

    Is this the kind of dent that can get worse?

    Man. A bit upset.

    Should've gotten one of the Steelies. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...1cf2aaee62.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...abbd49f358.jpg

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  • 07-15-2019
    Phurious
    Really thought I did a good run over looking for dents.

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  • 07-15-2019
    Phurious
    How funny.

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  • 07-15-2019
    blackfrancois
    i'd call that a ding, not a dent.

    no, they don't worsen.

    just forget it and ride.