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  1. #26
    tlg
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Kunich View Post
    Apparently you can't read. Just saying my claims haven't been substantiated does not mean that there is any value at all in your ignorance.
    But.... your haven't substantiated your claims.

    You do know what substantiate means right?

    sub·stan·ti·ate
    verb
    provide evidence to support or prove the truth of.


    Feel free to substantiate your claims instead of childish name calling.
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  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Kunich View Post
    Apparently you can't read. Just saying my claims haven't been substantiated does not mean that there is any value at all in your ignorance. I see that you have a lot of dots in your reputation. Yet nowhere have I seen one single intelligent thing you've ever said.

    Tell you what, I will leave you little children to your own ends such as using emojis and anonymous names so that you do not have to be held personally accountable for your postings that any 5 year old could make out on the kindergarten playground.

    There appears to be no one here seeking information and that says a very great deal for Road Bike Review and one I will be very happy to pass on.

    That's your second flounce-off in less than a year (cf. https://forums.roadbikereview.com/bi...ml#post5363555

    Suggest you contact your physician(s); post-concussion effects can include memory loss, as well as irritability.

    And as you've said, you've taken quite a blow to the head. Recovery is a very long journey. Best of luck.
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  3. #28
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  4. #29
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    Well, OP, you weren't clear if you were talking about MC or bicycle helmets, so I'm going to respond to both and refute that helmets don't save lives. I have been involved in crashes 4 times on motorcycles while racing - 2 times high siding and 2 times low siding. I wasn't concussed on any of those occasions but without a helmet even on the least severe low side at 140mph without a helmet I would have been killed because my helmet hit the ground hard enough to crack it, not just scuff it. The high side incidents only one time was a knocked out and after a ride to the local hospital (because I couldn't remember what year it was) a CT scan showed I didn't have a concussion. Any of those incidents without a helmet I'm sure if not dead I would have been disabled from the impact permanently.

    I've not wrecked cycling but a couple friends have and they both had concussions and spent time in the hospital. I'll agree bicycling helmets are not at all built like MC helmets, and they don't need to be built like them due to the speeds involved. However to say they don't reduce injury just doesn't make any sense to me at all, and I would like to see any studies you can find to substantiate that claim. I fully believe they do reduce injuries which implies saving lives as well, and they don't need to be the new Bontrager Wave design to do that, nor do I think there's a substantial amount of data supporting that the wave design from Bontrager is substantially better at the typical head reducing injuries cycling. Please show me the data supporting your points, and I may be influenced.
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  5. #30
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    Srode: I've never ridden a motorcycle so can't comment on how MC Helmets may or may not save lives.

    Unlike you, I have wrecked on bicycles both training and racing and, but for wearing a Spiuk Nexion when I crashed during a fast training ride in June, 2007, I likely would not be alive. I don't remember any of the specific details of the crash, fortunately, but friends have told me that it basically went down like this: We were a group of about 20 doing about 25mph+ when my front tire hit a chunk of concrete block about the shape and size of a pack of cigarettes and it instantly flatted. I'm told that I went over the bars and slid on the road with my feet straight in the air supported by three contact points: (i) my helmet/right side of my face and chin, (ii) my right glove holding my brake lever....the knuckle was lacerated down to the tendons on my middle finger, and (iii) the flesh on the crook of my right elbow where I still have no pigment from the abrasions. I came to rest on the side of the road and the first thing I remember is that two or my riding buddies, both ER docs were arguing over whether my jaw was broken and whether or not I could have water.

    My helmet was basically shredded at an angle just as if one had taken an aggressive wood rasp to it and filed at an angle with my right cheek and chin. Luckily, I was taken to a local trauma center, diagnosed with "just" severe road rash on all those contact points and got 2-3 stiches in my right chin. I raced in a national race two weeks later in Louisville, KY in the National Sr. Olympics.....needless to say, I finished near DFL in all my heats but I was determined to be there.

    Pretty sure I wouldn't be typing this today had it not been for my Spiuk helmet.....I wore them constantly afterwards until they stopped importing them from Spain about 7-8 years later.

  6. #31
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    Anyone that is proposing not riding a helmet should.
    Stand up, fall over backwards without bending your legs or putting your hands back and land with your head on a piece of concrete.
    Take pictures and report back.

    ..and that doesn't involve a moto or bike. See if it hurts!
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  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by duriel View Post
    Anyone that is proposing not riding a helmet should.
    Stand up, fall over backwards without bending your legs or putting your hands back and land with your head on a piece of concrete.
    Take pictures and report back.

    ..and that doesn't involve a moto or bike. See if it hurts!
    This involves drinking, doesn't it?
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    @Coolhand.
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  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by duriel View Post
    Anyone that is proposing not riding a helmet should.
    Stand up, fall over backwards without bending your legs or putting your hands back and land with your head on a piece of concrete.
    Take pictures and report back.
    Tom REALLY should do this. It would be an excellent way to substantiate his claims.

    But he shouldn't take pictures and report back. (there's a good chance he won't be able to) He should live stream it on YouTube.

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  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Kunich View Post
    You aren't particularly smart are you? In the one case I said that doping doesn't IMPROVE human performance. And it doesn't - it improves your endurance which is what professional bike racers need in long races such as the grand tours. They don't need to take drugs in the spring classics though they certainly used to take things like testosterone which caused you to be more aggressive. That neither gave you more strength nor more endurance. But as seems to be the problem with you, you don't understand the problem and so talk about something else.

    As for the other case - They have started fixing that problem several ways. The Chinese simply build the framesets heavier. Carbon fiber is so light that you can add quite a bit of strength for almost no weight penalty. Look solves the problem by having extremely good quality control using ultrasound scans of the material to avoid folds, tears and voids. Time solves the problem by adding some layers of Kevlar which has a much longer thread length and hence doesn't tear like carbon fiber does. And Trek uses two heavy pressure molds to prevent the appearance of folds, creases or voids and then puts the frame together in pieces similar to lugged construction on a steel bike.

    You must enjoy talking about things you don't understand and don't want to understand.
    Tom, you seem like you would like to engage in wide ranging discussions, but all to often you resort to childish insults when challenged. That is not cricket. Please stop so that you may continue to post here and have those discussions.

  11. #36
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    all of you unworthy types need to back off...

    Tom is an ENGINEER, ferchrissakes!

    that means his shite is not odiferous.
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  12. #37
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    ...oh yea? ... how many state is he registered professional in?

    .. you don't need to be an engineer to know your head hurts.
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  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdhbrad View Post
    Srode: I've never ridden a motorcycle so can't comment on how MC Helmets may or may not save lives.

    Unlike you, I have wrecked on bicycles both training and racing and, but for wearing a Spiuk Nexion when I crashed during a fast training ride in June, 2007, I likely would not be alive. I don't remember any of the specific details of the crash, fortunately, but friends have told me that it basically went down like this: We were a group of about 20 doing about 25mph+ when my front tire hit a chunk of concrete block about the shape and size of a pack of cigarettes and it instantly flatted. I'm told that I went over the bars and slid on the road with my feet straight in the air supported by three contact points: (i) my helmet/right side of my face and chin, (ii) my right glove holding my brake lever....the knuckle was lacerated down to the tendons on my middle finger, and (iii) the flesh on the crook of my right elbow where I still have no pigment from the abrasions. I came to rest on the side of the road and the first thing I remember is that two or my riding buddies, both ER docs were arguing over whether my jaw was broken and whether or not I could have water.

    My helmet was basically shredded at an angle just as if one had taken an aggressive wood rasp to it and filed at an angle with my right cheek and chin. Luckily, I was taken to a local trauma center, diagnosed with "just" severe road rash on all those contact points and got 2-3 stiches in my right chin. I raced in a national race two weeks later in Louisville, KY in the National Sr. Olympics.....needless to say, I finished near DFL in all my heats but I was determined to be there.

    Pretty sure I wouldn't be typing this today had it not been for my Spiuk helmet.....I wore them constantly afterwards until they stopped importing them from Spain about 7-8 years later.
    Dang, that's a hard story to read due to the vivid details - ouch!
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  14. #39
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    Srode: Bike crashes like that one are hard to forget. I ride past where that happened every Saturday and always remember that day. I’ve got a few other locations that are equally “memorable.”
    What I’ll never forget though is the deep concern that the 2 ER Docs and everyone else on the ride showed for me that day and I still ride with many of them today.
    Last edited by cdhbrad; 1 Week Ago at 04:36 PM.

  15. #40
    xxl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    Dang, that's a hard story to read due to the vivid details - ouch!
    No doubt! That post ought to come with a disclaimer.

    cdhbrad, glad you survived, and made it back on the bike.

    I've had two incidents where my helmet saved my life, but neither quite so gruesome.

    Both helmets ended up on the wall of a bike shop I used, which kept customer's "used" helmets as a sort of memorial/sales tool, that the shop's employees could point to if customers were to ask if helmets were effective.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    all of you unworthy types need to back off...

    Tom is an ENGINEER, ferchrissakes!

    that means his shite is not odiferous.
    I'm no engineer, but my poop smells like roses anyway.
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  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdhbrad View Post
    Srode: and (iii) the flesh on the crook of my right elbow where I still have no pigment from the abrasions.
    Anytime you get road rash in the crook of your elbow, that's a bad wreck.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    I'm no engineer, but my poop smells like roses anyway.
    Engineer or not, THAT I will take your word on. No need to substantiate it!

  19. #44
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    Sorry about that, “trigger warning” isn’t a normal part of my vocabulary.
    Last edited by cdhbrad; 1 Week Ago at 04:51 PM.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Kunich View Post
    Does it hurt your feelings that I have $25,000 worth of bicycles and you have an old Schwinn?
    All dollars and no cents/sense.
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  21. #46
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    Ah... Perhaps I could be of some help here and suggest getting out on the road and taking an all out power ride.

  22. #47
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    My helmet mist likely saved my life.

    Now has anyone ever been on a road that the layout let’s say at a redisgned intersection and it made no sense at all? How about where you work you have machines that you modified so they ran better or they were built but you can’t easily work on them but if some simple changes were made they would simple to work on.

    Those things were all done by engineers so being an engineer does make you the brightist in the room.

  23. #48
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    My helmet most likely saved my life.

    has anyone ever been on a road that the layout at a redisgned intersection made no sense at all? How about where you work you have machines that you modified so they ran better or they were built but you can’t easily work on them but if some simple changes were made they would simple to work on.

    Those things were all done by engineers so being an engineer does make you the brightest person in the room.
    Last edited by bmach; 1 Week Ago at 04:40 PM.

  24. #49
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    Take a look at that, the third try may be more understandable.
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    Blows your hair back.

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