Proof that e-Bikes ARE Motorcycles
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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Proof that e-Bikes ARE Motorcycles

    Harley-Davidson shows off new electric bike design ó as in electric bicycle



    Harley first introduces and electric motorcycle called the "LiveWire" and what-do-you-know, a "electric bicycle" is then produced. Hmm...

    I'm of the opinion that just because e-bikes have pedals on them that they aren't really bicycles, they're under-powered motorcycles. Bicycles require a human to power then, motorcycles do not. That's traditionally been the distinction between the two, especially considering the first motorcycles were nothing more than bicycles with motors on them.

    Well, if nothing else, at least this gives wanna-be Harley owners a chance to say, "I own a Harley" for a lot less money than their actual motorcycles.
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    If you want an electric motorcycle with pedals, this is a lot closer than those.

    https://www.erockit.de/?fbclid=IwAR3...149xwI2qpwXrMU

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    I hope those suckers arenít nearly as loud as their ear-splitting motorcycles! 😁

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    Quote Originally Posted by azpeterb View Post
    I hope those suckers arenít nearly as loud as their ear-splitting motorcycles! 😁
    As their motorcycles' main function is making noise with horsepower as a side effect, will their quieter e-bikes inversely be speed and torque monsters?

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    I'm of the opinion that just because e-bikes have pedals on them that they aren't really bicycles, they're under-powered motorcycles. Bicycles require a human to power then, motorcycles do not.
    Does the terminology that someone else uses to describe what they ride really matter that much to you? I ride bicycles powered by my feet on the pedals (and at age 69 I hope that I'll continue to be able to do that for a long time to come), but if someone else rides a bike that provides some assistance from an electric motor, it doesn't hurt me in any way if they choose to call it a "bicycle."
    "None of us knows for sure what's out there; that's why we keep looking. Keep your faith; travel hopefully. The universe will surprise you, constantly." The 13th Doctor.

  6. #6
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    Perhaps even more proof of Harley-Davidson going belly up.
    "Refreshingly Unconcerned With The Vulgar Exigencies Of Veracity "

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Perhaps even more proof of Harley-Davidson going belly up.
    That was my first thought.

    The sales guy at my LBS made a distinction between the term 'electric bike' and 'pedal assist bike'. The latter requires you to pedal it a little to engage the motor. 'a little' is the operative word.

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    The Triumph motorcycle company is working on an ebike that leaks oil and has electrical components made by Lucas, the prince of darkness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SPlKE View Post
    The Triumph motorcycle company is working on an ebike that leaks oil and has electrical components made by Lucas, the prince of darkness.
    Finally, an e-bike that's more exercise to ride than a bicycle.
    Too old to ride plastic

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    Quote Originally Posted by pmf View Post
    That was my first thought.

    The sales guy at my LBS made a distinction between the term 'electric bike' and 'pedal assist bike'. The latter requires you to pedal it a little to engage the motor. 'a little' is the operative word.
    Even that is overly simple...

    States first added "ebike" as a category of vehicle to road law...now they're having to add multiple "classes" to cover all the different ways people/OEMs blur/erase the lines in an effort to produce bigger power numbers. Since we all know, bigger numbers sell more units.

    https://electricbikereview.com/forum...-matter.22738/
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    Oh neat. This again.

    Where'd we leave off? Oh yeah - I'll summarize:
    - bicycle + motor = motorcycle
    - motorcycle + pedals = moped
    - bicycle + no motor = still a bicycle
    - ebike... because moped sounds 70s and ebike sounds so much ecocooler and hip.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldZaskar View Post
    Oh neat. This again.

    Where'd we leave off? Oh yeah - I'll summarize:
    - bicycle + motor = motorcycle
    - motorcycle + pedals = moped
    - bicycle + no motor = still a bicycle
    - ebike... because moped sounds 70s and ebike sounds so much ecocooler and hip.
    If we try real hard, we can get as much mileage out of ebikes as we've gotten out of disk breaks!

  13. #13
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    This makes as much sense as Cannondale making motorcycles.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPlKE View Post
    The Triumph motorcycle company is working on an ebike that leaks oil and has electrical components made by Lucas, the prince of darkness.
    LOL!!! I spent lots of time with Nortons, BSAs and Triumphs. Literally LOL! The new Triumphs are the best looking bike on the market. I was next to one chatting with itís owner at a long light recently. Gorgeous. I freaking hate Harleys. Awful, loud, slow ass poser POS. I thought they made their money in a military engine division? Iíll go look. As fussy as those English cafe racers were, they were a joy to ride.
    To date, philosophers have merely interpreted the world in various ways. The point however is to change it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBL450 View Post
    LOL!!! I spent lots of time with Nortons, BSAs and Triumphs. Literally LOL! The new Triumphs are the best looking bike on the market. I was next to one chatting with itís owner at a long light recently. Gorgeous. I freaking hate Harleys. Awful, loud, slow ass poser POS. I thought they made their money in a military engine division? Iíll go look. As fussy as those English cafe racers were, they were a joy to ride.
    "I freaking hate Harleys. Awful, loud, slow ass poser POS." As my dear old mom would say... That's the god's honest truth.

    My Amal Monobloc 389 carb is sitting on my workbench, soon to be rebuilt and bolted back onto my 1959 [made by Royal Enfield] Indian Apache 700cc thumper. I bought it in 1973 when I turned 18. Been riding it ever since. Royal Enfield - Redditch, England... Made Like A Gun. (not to be confused with the "Royal Enfield" junk made in India today)

    It still leaks oil until it's dry (a feature, not a bug) and the electrics are still as weak and unreliable as the day they were manufactured by Lucas 60 years ago.
    Last edited by SPlKE; 3 Weeks Ago at 05:22 PM.

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    Living just outside of Milwaukee, WI, I'm a little too aware of the presence of Harley Davidson and their "loud pipes saves lives" claims (?!?!)

    Anywho, the following bike in their museum in Milwaukee is claimed to be one of the first Harley "motorcycles"...



    Note the bicycle crank arms and sprocket on this "motorcycle". Substitute that internal combustion engine with an electric motor, and we have an "e-bike"... i.e., a modern motorcycle being passed off of a bicycle.

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    I almost had a head-on collision with e-bicycle a week ago on a local MUT. It wasn't a teenager doing such stupid thing, it was a woman in her 40's, riding while checking out the scenery on the side of MUT. If I didn't yell "watch!!!", she would have slammed into me head-on. She missed by about 6 inches. Weighing over 45 lbs and cruising over 15 MPH on MUTs is a very bad idea in the hands of those who are inexperienced. These things make it easier for novices to just hop on and start going over 15 MPH.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    Weighing over 45 lbs and cruising over 15 MPH on MUTs is a very bad idea in the hands of those who are inexperienced. These things make it easier for novices to just hop on and start going over 15 MPH.
    That's a pretty interesting point I never thought of... i.e., bicycle vs e-bike collisions. Since it's pretty easy to ride quite fast on an e-bike with little effort, many e-bike riders do ride fast. I'm going to make the unverified assumption that most e-bike riders are not seasoned cyclists with exceptional bike handling skills. Yes, a few are, but I'm pretty sure they are the minority. I already know a handful of e-bike owners that haven't ridden an actual bicycle since they were a kid.

    Take an inattentive driver off the road and put him or her on a e-bike and now even the bike trails aren't safe anymore

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    Quote Originally Posted by azpeterb View Post
    I hope those suckers arenít nearly as loud as their ear-splitting motorcycles! 
    And to think some small towns have noise ordinance against cars with loud exhausts, but not for Harleys.

    My 5.0 exhaust is nowhere near as loud as a Harley.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBL450 View Post
    LOL!!! I spent lots of time with Nortons, BSAs and Triumphs. Literally LOL! The new Triumphs are the best looking bike on the market. I was next to one chatting with itís owner at a long light recently. Gorgeous. I freaking hate Harleys. Awful, loud, slow ass poser POS. I thought they made their money in a military engine division? Iíll go look. As fussy as those English cafe racers were, they were a joy to ride.
    I'm with you.. hate Harleys.. actually in general I don't like cruisers. I've been looking at the Speed Triple RS, or the Street Triple RS (I like the fact that the Speed has a single side rear swingarm and corner ABS, but it's a $5k premium over the Street, and also far more power than I need....)

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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    I almost had a head-on collision with e-bicycle a week ago on a local MUT. It wasn't a teenager doing such stupid thing, it was a woman in her 40's, riding while checking out the scenery on the side of MUT. If I didn't yell "watch!!!", she would have slammed into me head-on. She missed by about 6 inches. Weighing over 45 lbs and cruising over 15 MPH on MUTs is a very bad idea in the hands of those who are inexperienced. These things make it easier for novices to just hop on and start going over 15 MPH.
    I think having the bike do the work of bike riding FOR people will encourage them to distract themselves with sightseeing, texting, the whole nine yards of a crash waiting to happen.

  22. #22
    pmf
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoorInRichfield View Post
    That's a pretty interesting point I never thought of... i.e., bicycle vs e-bike collisions. Since it's pretty easy to ride quite fast on an e-bike with little effort, many e-bike riders do ride fast. I'm going to make the unverified assumption that most e-bike riders are not seasoned cyclists with exceptional bike handling skills. Yes, a few are, but I'm pretty sure they are the minority. I already know a handful of e-bike owners that haven't ridden an actual bicycle since they were a kid.

    Take an inattentive driver off the road and put him or her on a e-bike and now even the bike trails aren't safe anymore
    That's my issue with them on the bike trails I ride on. Its like giving a 16 year old kid a muscle car. More than once, I've been passed by this moron going the other direction on the 14-th street bridge over the Potomac. Its pretty narrow and he's hauling @ss doing at least 20 miles an hour on some ebike with enormous tires. The thing must weigh 50 lbs.

    I can't tell you how many times I see them going around blind corners and doing other dumb stuff. Yeah, real bike (rbike?) riders do dumb stuff too, but it seems like a lot less often.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SPlKE View Post
    I think having the bike do the work of bike riding FOR people will encourage them to distract themselves with sightseeing, texting, the whole nine yards of a crash waiting to happen.
    Around me, there are also problem with rental bicycles all over the city. Though it's not as fast as e-bicycle, it makes it easier for novices and tourists who aren't familiar with local roads and safety issues to pay a few dollars, just hop on a bike and start riding around. I've seen so many accidents lately on bike lanes.

    Yesterday, I saw a rental bike on kickstand in the middle of bike lane and I thought which ignoramus would just put a bike there..., then as I was passing by slowly, I saw a guy in his early 30's (with shaved head) sitting down on the sidewalk next to that bike surrounded by 3 people in their 50's, well dressed (probably visitors to a performing art theater which the main entrance was just off of the sidewalk). Those visitors must've been crossing the bike lane without looking and the bike rider (with shaved head) must've been going fast. What I saw was the aftermath of bike crash because the rider had a swelling spot on the side of his head as if he had a walnut under the scalp and the scalp was scraped and bleeding little. Yes, he didn't wear a helmet.

    Despite the city spending good bit of money on extra bike lanes and improvements for the cyclists, it's gotten worse over last 10 years around where I am.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    Around me, there are also problem with rental bicycles all over the city. Though it's not as fast as e-bicycle, it makes it easier for novices and tourists who aren't familiar with local roads and safety issues to pay a few dollars, just hop on a bike and start riding around. I've seen so many accidents lately on bike lanes.

    Yesterday, I saw a rental bike on kickstand in the middle of bike lane and I thought which ignoramus would just put a bike there..., then as I was passing by slowly, I saw a guy in his early 30's (with shaved head) sitting down on the sidewalk next to that bike surrounded by 3 people in their 50's, well dressed (probably visitors to a performing art theater which the main entrance was just off of the sidewalk). Those visitors must've been crossing the bike lane without looking and the bike rider (with shaved head) must've been going fast. What I saw was the aftermath of bike crash because the rider had a swelling spot on the side of his head as if he had a walnut under the scalp and the scalp was scraped and bleeding little. Yes, he didn't wear a helmet.

    Despite the city spending good bit of money on extra bike lanes and improvements for the cyclists, it's gotten worse over last 10 years around where I am.
    Same situation in downtown philly. Lots of bike lanes. Great. But also lots of absolutely clueless bike riders, the worst being on those Indigo bikes.

    Those Indigo bikes give me the willies.

    Downtown philly is a grid of narrow one-way streets, with and without bike lanes. When I'm in my car and I have to turn right across a bike lane, or any street for that matter, I practically want to stop and get out and look for any clueless Indigo rider I could accidentally right-hook as they're texting while riding and not paying any attention to traffic, as though the bike lane is a magic portal of safety.

    That said, at least the Indigo bike riders are mostly slow enough to not be a danger to themselves and pedestrians, as long as drivers (and pedestrians) are being careful. Clueless ebike riders zooming along, helmetless, and looking at their phone? Not so much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Methodical View Post
    And to think some small towns have noise ordinance against cars with loud exhausts, but not for Harleys.

    My 5.0 exhaust is nowhere near as loud as a Harley.
    And then there is the subgroup of Harley riders who insist on playing their radios/sound systems full blast so that the rider can hear the music. The rest of us are left with a deafening combination of an obnoxiously loud motorcycle paired with ridiculously loud music. And to top if off, the music is usually from the 60's or 70's. Makes me want to chew on glass!

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