Two tire failures, need some advice
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  1. #1
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    Two tire failures, need some advice

    My son has suffered 2 tire failures that have me looking for a root cause. The bike is a Jamis Quest. New this season. I swapped out the OEM tires for a set of the new Pirelli P Zero Velo's, 700X25, using the OEM tubes. All good for about 6 weeks. He went out for a ride, and just before getting home, heard a loud pop, and had a rear flat. Inspection of the tire revealed a split sidewall, on the non-drive side, that was radial (perpendicular to the brake track) and about a 1/2 inch in size. When I took it all apart, did not notice anything unusual with the wheel. I chalked it up to a manufacturing defect, and replaced both tires with Conti Grand Prix 4 Seasons. One or two rides later, the exact same failure, in the same location (rear, non-drive side, radial split in the sidewall).

    When I installed the Conti's, I used new tubes, but they were 700X18-23, instead of 700X23-25. The Conti's were new, old stock, having spent about 3 years in my basement. My son weighs about 150 lbs and we were running 90 psi for pressure.

    Any thoughts on what might be going on here would be much appreciated.

    Jim D

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    Quote Originally Posted by desaljs View Post
    My son has suffered 2 tire failures that have me looking for a root cause. The bike is a Jamis Quest. New this season. I swapped out the OEM tires for a set of the new Pirelli P Zero Velo's, 700X25, using the OEM tubes. All good for about 6 weeks. He went out for a ride, and just before getting home, heard a loud pop, and had a rear flat. Inspection of the tire revealed a split sidewall, on the non-drive side, that was radial (perpendicular to the brake track) and about a 1/2 inch in size. When I took it all apart, did not notice anything unusual with the wheel. I chalked it up to a manufacturing defect, and replaced both tires with Conti Grand Prix 4 Seasons. One or two rides later, the exact same failure, in the same location (rear, non-drive side, radial split in the sidewall).

    When I installed the Conti's, I used new tubes, but they were 700X18-23, instead of 700X23-25. The Conti's were new, old stock, having spent about 3 years in my basement. My son weighs about 150 lbs and we were running 90 psi for pressure.

    Any thoughts on what might be going on here would be much appreciated.

    Jim D
    Friendly warning, move post to tire section of forum.

  3. #3
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    Not sure. Hopefully Kerry Irons will chime in and perhaps a picture would help if you have one?

    0.5"=12.7mm or half the width of the tire. Where did the split start and end? You said NDS but, across the bead or is the bead intact? Lastly, did both failure occur at or very near the same location around the wheel? Meaning, for example, both failures happened 90 degree or 180 degrees etc...from the valve hole.

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    The split started close to the bead, but did not involve any part of the tire that clinches to the rim. It extended just short of the tread area. The bead was intact. Any yes, both splits occurred in about the same area, on the non-drive side of the tire. Loud pop both times. Hope this helps, and thanks!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by desaljs View Post
    The split started close to the bead, but did not involve any part of the tire that clinches to the rim. It extended just short of the tread area. The bead was intact. Any yes, both splits occurred in about the same area, on the non-drive side of the tire. Loud pop both times. Hope this helps, and thanks!
    I'm obviously not sure but, the only time I ever had a tire do this there was a bur or some imperfection on the rim somewhere near the bead. (EDIT) on the inside of the brake track or facing the tire surface...if that makes sense.

  6. #6
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    Sounds like either a combination of bad luck or not using tires suited for the terrain. Simple case of hitting something that cut the sidewall. I had that happen several times with those conti tires. I wouldn't even look at a gravel road with those.


    I would have suggested brake rub as a possibility but "perpendicular to the brake track" kills that theory.

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    Sorry about posting this in the wrong section. Not sure how to move the post.

    Jim D

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    Quote Originally Posted by desaljs View Post
    Sorry about posting this in the wrong section. Not sure how to move the post.

    Jim D
    I prefer you post it here but there is another guy that, well.................

  9. #9
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    It sounds like he's running over a piece of metal or something, that's cutting the tire.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlazingPedals View Post
    It sounds like he's running over a piece of metal or something, that's cutting the tire.
    The op stated the two cuts have happened not only in the same spot across the tire (radially), similar sized, but also in the same location around the rim as referenced from the valve hole. The chances of hitting something in the same spot same orientation same length must be astronomical.

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    brake pad rubbing tire?

  12. #12
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    Might want to look at the wheel, not the tires/tubes. Take the tire/tube off and take a look at wobble & hop. I bet your wheel has a big hop in it. The tires will overheat after riding at that one hop and kablueeee. You can ask how I know.
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  13. #13
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    A lot of tube pops happen near the valve, if the problem happens to have to do with wrong pressure. i used to be really good at filling up tubes with co2, but lately I have gone a bit too far, and the tube either bulges right around valve, or pops. Also, the construction is different at the valve relative to the rest of the tube. But I really cannot think of defects in more than one tube. Maybe harming tube with tire lever, in some systematic way, i.e. same place same technique, when mounting tire?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by factory feel View Post
    brake pad rubbing tire?
    A number of things can cause brake pad rotation to be misaligned (front or trailing edge of pad can extend past the very top of the brake surface where it interfaces with the tire).

    It can happen quite easily if you don't pay attention and just installed new pads and say went from a 23 to a 25mm tire or went to a new wider type wheel and tried to squeeze the tire between the pads. They (pad holders) can easily rotate just enough to cause the pad to rub the tire...an easy fix with a hex wrench or two but, it does happen.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by factory feel View Post
    brake pad rubbing tire?
    another troll comment?

    This is ridiculous!
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by factory feel View Post
    I prefer you post it here but there is another guy that, well.................
    Why should he post a question about TIRES in a section other than WHEELS & TIRES? So he can turn into a troll like you?
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by duriel View Post
    another troll comment?

    This is ridiculous!
    Ludicrous I say!!!

    Is there anywhere that might have a track for a gate or something that's attached to the ground? That your son happens to run over on his regular ride? That's the only thing I can think of now that would cause damage like that more than once. We have a rail that our gate rolls on at the shop, the rail is triangular in section and about an inch high...I could see that causing tire damage if hit hard enough.
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    Quote Originally Posted by duriel View Post
    another troll comment?

    This is ridiculous!
    and outrageous!

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Why should he post a question about TIRES in a section other than WHEELS & TIRES?
    so you don't cry about it?

  20. #20
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    Are there railway tracks he runs over? The high speed impact could produce a blow out like that. Maybe a bridge with an uneven approach? I am thinking the same as CX here. It's probably a rider induced stress. How old is your son?

  21. #21
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    My son is 20. Good rider. We do have some railroad tracks on the route, and few bridge expansion joints that are a bit rough. We do hop or unload weight as we cross those. Also, some fresh tar and chip on some roads.

    Appreciate the input. I'm thinking road hazard, but will take a very close look at the inner surface of the rim. Just waiting for new tires to arrive. The wheel is true. No hops. No brake rub either.

    Jim

  22. #22
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    what kind/model of rim?
    Yossarian: don't worry. nothing's going to happen to you that won't happen to the rest of us.

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    Ritchey Comp Zeta 20/24 with DT spokes.

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