John. E. Football.
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    John. E. Football.

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    Boobies. Repeat, boobies. That is all.
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    next year: corner back in the nfl?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cygnus View Post
    next year: corner back in the nfl?
    Don't go giving him too much credit now!

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    two blown PI calls on Duke's final drive...

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    Johnny Football may be a good college QB, but he's going to be another Tim Tebow in the NFL, which stands for Not For Long. And that's about all Johnny Football will last. He's reckless the way he carries the ball. The defensive players will knock it out of his hand in a heartbeat. Ans all those fancy moves and running plays and scrambling he does, will land him on the IR just like RGIII. And in my opinion, RGIII is just a mediocre QB. Another example of a good college QB just turning into an "Average Joe" in the NFL. Again, Not For Long...

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by adjtogo View Post
    Johnny Football may be a good college QB, but he's going to be another Tim Tebow in the NFL, which stands for Not For Long. And that's about all Johnny Football will last. He's reckless the way he carries the ball. The defensive players will knock it out of his hand in a heartbeat. Ans all those fancy moves and running plays and scrambling he does, will land him on the IR just like RGIII. And in my opinion, RGIII is just a mediocre QB. Another example of a good college QB just turning into an "Average Joe" in the NFL. Again, Not For Long...
    The problem with Tebow is that he had terrible throwing mechanics and relied on his athleticism/running ability to bail him out of bad situations.

    In college, it worked. In the NFL... well, Timmay learned the hard way that NFL defenses are faster.

    I haven't watched Manziel enough to know if he's almost as limited in his repetoire as Tebow was, or if he's a legit long-term NFL QB. But I don't think he's going to be rushing 10-20 times a game in the NFL like he does in college.

    If he does, he's probably going to get banged up real quick.
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    Johnny Football runs with the ball in one hand and doesn't protect it. In the NFL, defensive players will have a field day knocking that ball out of his grip.

    He's too quick to try to run the ball instead of displaying patience and finding an open receiver. Just look how dinged up Michael Vick has been the past few years as well as RGIII. Defensive players love to punish running QB's. Not many running QB's have a long career in the NFL.

    And if Johnny Football goes to the NFL after only two seasons in college, he's not going to be ready maturity-wise and physically. He's too small to be an NFL QB.

    And in my opinion, he's just a spoiled brat from a rich family with a bad, immature attitude. Punk!

    And I personally believe there was some type of Payola for him signing autographs and memorabilia, and a joke the way the NCAA handled it.

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    I've been working on a parody song about Johnny Manziel, sung to the tune of "Johnny Angel." I'm calling it "Johnny Football":

    "Johnny Football, how I love him,
    And I hope he's gonna throw to me,
    Can't he see that I'm as open as I can be?"

    Johnny Football, how I want him,
    How I tingle when he signs my ball,
    And I know he's gonna make the call,
    That sends a pass to me."

    ...rough cut, but I'll work on it....

    [from a previous post, but I'm still working on it]

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    Pretty much. He should stay in college and soak it up for another year. If he goes to the NFL though he'll get paid and he may want to grab it while the grabbing is good.
    He'd probably have a decent 1st year in the NFL, then lose it and level off as mediocre in the following years. He ain't no Fran Tarkington that's for sure.

    It was an exciting game, we even stayed up to watch the finish of the game, didn't see the ball drop though.


    Quote Originally Posted by adjtogo View Post
    Johnny Football runs with the ball in one hand and doesn't protect it. In the NFL, defensive players will have a field day knocking that ball out of his grip.

    He's too quick to try to run the ball instead of displaying patience and finding an open receiver. Just look how dinged up Michael Vick has been the past few years as well as RGIII. Defensive players love to punish running QB's. Not many running QB's have a long career in the NFL.

    And if Johnny Football goes to the NFL after only two seasons in college, he's not going to be ready maturity-wise and physically. He's too small to be an NFL QB.

    And in my opinion, he's just a spoiled brat from a rich family with a bad, immature attitude. Punk!

    And I personally believe there was some type of Payola for him signing autographs and memorabilia, and a joke the way the NCAA handled it.
    "I felt bad because I couldn't wheelie; until I met a man with no bicycle"

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    Re: John. E. Football.

    Quote Originally Posted by adjtogo View Post
    Johnny Football may be a good college QB, but he's going to be another Tim Tebow in the NFL, which stands for Not For Long. And that's about all Johnny Football will last. He's reckless the way he carries the ball. The defensive players will knock it out of his hand in a heartbeat. Ans all those fancy moves and running plays and scrambling he does, will land him on the IR just like RGIII. And in my opinion, RGIII is just a mediocre QB. Another example of a good college QB just turning into an "Average Joe" in the NFL. Again, Not For Long...
    Likely correct. But also likely to get drafted in the first round and get a big pay day. His stock is unlikely to improve in college.

    Take the money and run. Spend 2 or 3 years in the NFL. Then either play in Canada, the Arena League or go into coaching or broadcasting.

    What does he gain from another year in college?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SystemShock View Post
    I haven't watched Manziel enough to know if he's almost as limited in his repetoire as Tebow was, or if he's a legit long-term NFL QB. But I don't think he's going to be rushing 10-20 times a game in the NFL like he does in college.
    He's a slower, smaller version of Tebow without the morals.

    J.M. has to be the luckiest player I've ever seen on the field. He's just scrappy enough to get out of an arm tackle, which then gets the other players off speed and taking bad angles ... they end up over running the play, thus opening the field up for him to run. Sometimes it almost seems as if he puts himself in bad situations just so he can try and get out of them to make himself look better and be more marketable in the end.

    I really hope he goes to the pro's this year ... at least the we won't have to hear about the "Ass Hat" in the college game any longer. He will quickly find out his skill set is "Very" limited and likely won't ever start a game. With that said, some stupid NFL team will take a 1st/2nd round flyer on him, much like Tebow expecting him to save their team only to have another coach/GM fired over it because the owner wanted the name on his team.
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  13. #13
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    Wow - lots of negativity - all he does is lead his team and put on a great show - what a game !
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wborgers View Post
    Wow - lots of negativity - all he does is lead his team and put on a great show - what a game !
    He does put on a good show and, no matter how good you are, you won't look much better than the team around you on the scoreboard. The thing is, most of the negative stuff being said is true. I've watched him scrambling for his life many times when there was nobody near him or even really after him. He has more than his fair share of luck with the scramble, huck it and hope play... but that isn't going to work as well in the NFL. It took most teams exactly one time playing against him to figure him out, he had a much more difficult time being Johnny Football this year than he did last year. Once they figured him out, they started getting to him and he wasn't holding up too well to being put on the ground on a regular basis. He'll have to make some adjustments to his playing style real fast in the NFL or he's going to spend a lot of time injured. There's no doubting he's talented though. He was flashier last year but I think he actually improved as a quarterback this year. This year, when the flash wasn't working, he actually seemed to slow it down and figure out what he needed to do. It didn't always save the day but it showed that he can take on the leadership role when he needs to. I haven't written him off for the NFL yet but I think he's going to have a tough road from where he's at right now.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJBiker72 View Post
    What does he gain from another year in college?
    An education, so he can do something with his life after he's out of football in 2-3 years.
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

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    Re: John. E. Football.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mel Erickson View Post
    An education, so he can do something with his life after he's out of football in 2-3 years.
    He can always go back if he so chooses. Doubt the education gets him much compared to an NFL contract. What is he majoring in basket weaving?

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    he's elusive. he's quick. he has guts. he has intangibles. he has good arm strength. he feels pressure and gets the hell out of dodge just before the pocket collapses ON, not around him. and he's tough and fearless. all the attributes of an excellent quarterback.

    in college.

    at the nfl level, he's going to have a lot of problems. most conspicuously, he is small. small NEVER works. there's a reason the average nfl career lasts only four years. you can protect the small qb, but only for so long, and especially if he has to scramble to get out of trouble. eventually he's going to get hit. at some point, he's simply not going to be able to get up. size is a major, major issue, there are (next to) no small and successful qb's in the nfl, look at the playoffs, manning six six, kapernick six four, Rodgers six two, Dalton six two, rivers six five, the only small guy is brees. and brees is a smart and disciplined qb exception to the rule. that much I definitely DONT see from john e football. a nice story, sure. but nice guys finish last in the national football league. give him a shot and god bless him, but I don't see it, definitely wouldn't risk a first round pick unless I were desperate for a solution...

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJBiker72 View Post
    He can always go back if he so chooses. Doubt the education gets him much compared to an NFL contract. What is he majoring in basket weaving?
    He'd get the oppurtunity to mature physically, emotionally and football wise.

    I think its a tough call for athletes. Risk staying in an extra year but maybe you get injured. Risk coming out and wish you had the maturity when you hit the NFL.

    I haven't seen enough of him playing to say much. I agree that there aren't many small QBs. He seems immature and arrogant off the field, which can get you in trouble in the NFL. Defenses enjoy putting cocky young QBs in their place.
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    I don't follow college football, but I was interested in the talk of Manziel's lack of morals, so I looked him up on Wikipedia. I didn't see anything there that indicated any lack of morals. Sure, he's a dumb teenager, brash and egotistical, but the charge of lack of morals seems to require more than that, or most all of us are guilty. The autograph signing thing might be against NCAA rules, but it seems far more likely to me that the NCAA rules are immoral than that Manziel is for breaking them.

    He's small for an NFL QB, but the internet says he's 6'1" and 210, which makes him bigger than Russell Wilson and Drew Brees and about the same size as Andy Dalton. There are plenty of really big guys that are injury prone in the NFL, and as I understand it, NFL coaches don't want their QBs taking hits no matter how big they are. If you get hit a lot in the NFL, you get hurt, so I always thought the NFL preference for bigger QBs was about seeing over the linesman, not about susceptibility to injury.

    As for him having a more difficult time being Johnny Football this year compared to last, on about the same number of passing attempts as last year, he had a higher completion percentage (nearly 70%), 400 more yards, higher average yards per attempt, 11 more touchdowns with 4 more interceptions, and a higher QB rating. I didn't watch a single college football game, so I don't know whether he's a worse player this year than last--his rushing yards were down 650 yards, which is big--but his passing numbers sure look better., FWIW.

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    Quote Originally Posted by harlond View Post
    I don't follow college football, but I was interested in the talk of Manziel's lack of morals, so I looked him up on Wikipedia. I didn't see anything there that indicated any lack of morals. Sure, he's a dumb teenager, brash and egotistical, but the charge of lack of morals seems to require more than that, or most all of us are guilty. The autograph signing thing might be against NCAA rules, but it seems far more likely to me that the NCAA rules are immoral than that Manziel is for breaking them.

    He's small for an NFL QB, but the internet says he's 6'1" and 210, which makes him bigger than Russell Wilson and Drew Brees and about the same size as Andy Dalton. There are plenty of really big guys that are injury prone in the NFL, and as I understand it, NFL coaches don't want their QBs taking hits no matter how big they are. If you get hit a lot in the NFL, you get hurt, so I always thought the NFL preference for bigger QBs was about seeing over the linesman, not about susceptibility to injury.

    As for him having a more difficult time being Johnny Football this year compared to last, on about the same number of passing attempts as last year, he had a higher completion percentage (nearly 70%), 400 more yards, higher average yards per attempt, 11 more touchdowns with 4 more interceptions, and a higher QB rating. I didn't watch a single college football game, so I don't know whether he's a worse player this year than last--his rushing yards were down 650 yards, which is big--but his passing numbers sure look better., FWIW.
    good big man always better than good little man. and its not about his height at six one in itself being a problem, although from what I understand he's a hell of a lot closer to five eleven than six one. its about his running out of the pocket and trying to make stuff happen on the run. that's dangerous enough as it is, and very very few qb's, in fact, no qb's in the nfl try to make a living off it. those that try soon wind up in the hospital. then they don't try it anymore. playing qb in the nfl is dangerous enough as it is, not only does size enable someone to see over the line, but it also helps preserve the quarterback's health when he gets hit. which he invariably will. my point is you cant use a small guy who tells you up front, hey I am small, I get that, and I am also quick, they wont get me. but the history of the league is they do get you, and it usually doesn't take long.

    "scrambling" quarterbacks in the nfl do. not. survive. period.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by harlond View Post
    As for him having a more difficult time being Johnny Football this year compared to last, on about the same number of passing attempts as last year, he had a higher completion percentage (nearly 70%), 400 more yards, higher average yards per attempt, 11 more touchdowns with 4 more interceptions, and a higher QB rating. I didn't watch a single college football game, so I don't know whether he's a worse player this year than last--his rushing yards were down 650 yards, which is big--but his passing numbers sure look better., FWIW.
    As I said, he looked like a better quarterback this year. He was less a never-ending highlight reel ("Johnny Football") though. He still had his moments and made sure nobody forgot what he can do but the competition better knew what they were up against this time which put him in more situations where he had to put his head down and try to figure out how to get the job done. The Johnny Football thing is fun to watch but what he was doing more of this year looked closer to what he's going to need to do to have any chance at surviving in the NFL.
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    I think the quote was he is Tim Tebow without the morals. He may not be a terrible person, but its hatd to live up to the shinning example of Saint Tim.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mel Erickson View Post
    An education, so he can do something with his life after he's out of football in 2-3 years.
    College is overrated those days. Only good for the social life if you ask me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by easyridernyc View Post
    good big man always better than good little man. and its not about his height at six one in itself being a problem, although from what I understand he's a hell of a lot closer to five eleven than six one. its about his running out of the pocket and trying to make stuff happen on the run. that's dangerous enough as it is, and very very few qb's, in fact, no qb's in the nfl try to make a living off it. those that try soon wind up in the hospital. then they don't try it anymore. playing qb in the nfl is dangerous enough as it is, not only does size enable someone to see over the line, but it also helps preserve the quarterback's health when he gets hit. which he invariably will. my point is you cant use a small guy who tells you up front, hey I am small, I get that, and I am also quick, they wont get me. but the history of the league is they do get you, and it usually doesn't take long.

    "scrambling" quarterbacks in the nfl do. not. survive. period.
    I think height does matter. Can you see over defenders? Do you have a high release to cut down on batted balls? Or do you have to look / throw in passing lanes?

    Brees can waive his ring and say 'short QBs can get it done.' But Brees has perfected other skills, decision making and accuracy spring to mind, which give him that edge. I don't think it is impossible for smaller QBs to succeed, I think they just have to work harder than the guys who are 6'-4" or 6'-6".
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluenote View Post
    I think height does matter. Can you see over defenders? Do you have a high release to cut down on batted balls? Or do you have to look / throw in passing lanes?

    Brees can waive his ring and say 'short QBs can get it done.' But Brees has perfected other skills, decision making and accuracy spring to mind, which give him that edge. I don't think it is impossible for smaller QBs to succeed, I think they just have to work harder than the guys who are 6'-4" or 6'-6".
    Yes. But Brees doesn't just 'get it done', he's one of the three or four best QBs on the planet. Period.

    Also, as others have noted, Russell Wilson is 5'11". Also, Aaron Rodgers and Andy Dalton, both at 6'2" and around 220, aren't giants.

    You don't have to be some 6'5", 245 lb monster QB to make it in the NFL. History is littered with 'big athletic QBs' who never really lived up to their initial hype.... Daunte Culpepper, Tim Tebow, Ryan Leaf, JaMarcus Russell etc.

    It's a slight advantage, sure, and for the reasons you note. But it's sure not a deal-breaker if you're not a certain height, except maybe in certain coaches/scouts' minds. Probably the same coaches/scouts who used to think that white dudes couldn't play wide receiver at a very high level in the NFL... until guys like Welker, Nelson, Decker, Hartline, etc. showed otherwise. Some perceptions are only that, perceptions.

    Also, smaller QBs tend to be more agile/elusive. I guess you have to be.
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