Merckx 753 years?
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  1. #1
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    Merckx 753 years?

    What years did Merckx make Reynolds 753 frames? I ask because I recently got one, and I'm anxious to know its likely year of manufacture. Gita says its most likely a 1986, or so, frame, as that was the only year they made them in 753, but I could have sworn they were were also made later. This isn't meant to be a knock on Gita. Based on the 126mm rear spacing, that date sounds about right; I just thought for sure I recalled seeing them in a later catalog.

    Thanks!

    Robert

  2. #2
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    Have you checked the serial number at this site? It can also give you a range for the model year.

    http://www.cadre.org/Merckx/

  3. #3
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    1985

    Well as you can see by my sig file, I have what I think to be an 1985 753 Professional. I'm getting this information from the Cadre site though, so the only thing I'm sure of is that my frame is a 753 frame. While I re-did mine, the frame was almost certianly original when I got it, and I took special notice of the decals, replacing them exactly with duplicates I got off of eBay.

  4. #4
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    Other than a sticker, is there any way to visually differentiate a 753 Professional frame from one built with Columbus SL? I ask because my recently acquired '85 Mercx Professional was refinished by CyclArt sometime in the past and is missing the tubeset sticker.

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    I'll get back with ya

    I will pull the seat post from both my 753 and Corsa SL and see if there is any noticeable difference. I don't think there will be though. I understand that the SLX has internal ribbing but externally, both my 753 and my SL Merckx frames look pretty much identical other than they have slightly different bottom brackets. The Lugs look the same.
    Quote Originally Posted by clalor
    Other than a sticker, is there any way to visually differentiate a 753 Professional frame from one built with Columbus SL? I ask because my recently acquired '85 Mercx Professional was refinished by CyclArt sometime in the past and is missing the tubeset sticker.

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    Martin, thank you. I look forward to the results. Just for fun, I snapped a picture of the underside of the BB on my bike:



    Not pictured is the rear portion of the seat tube lug that has a similar cutout as the down tube cutout.

  7. #7
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    My 753, the one Gita says is a 1985/86 model, has a very different bottom bracket. There is a center drain hole like your's. However, the cables run through eyelets on the bracket, not grooves or channels like your's. It also doesn't have the four L-shaped recesses. Its pretty much a plain bottom bracket.

    Robert

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    still haven't taken off the seat posts....

    I'm still in my jammies, but will get to it when I start moving around but the picture of your bottom bracket (this is on your Professional right?) is exactly like my 85 - 753 Pro bottom bracket. BTW I'm liking the color. So I'm guessing you have a 61 cm frame? that or a 51cm.... according to the "" stamped next to the "A" on the bottom bracket.

    EDIT: Still haven't taken off the seatpost but I just measured the seat stays OD and found a huge difference in diameter. At the point where the seat stay is brazed onto the seat lug, the tubing has been cut with an angle and (I'm assuming an oval plate brazed on with an EM emblem on it. At the botton edge of this angled edge where the tubing starts to just become totally round again I measured;
    on the SL Corsa: 14 mm OD.
    On my 753 I measured 16.26mm OD.
    This is a really large difference in diameter and I don't think I have to worry about differences in paint thickness or anything. This converts to just over 1/2" (.55)on the Corsa to about 5/8" (.62") on the 753. You should be able to measure that with the tools you have at home.
    Last edited by martinrjensen; 08-21-2010 at 09:02 AM.

  9. #9
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    I've been looking at BB pictures of the '80-'88 bikes on Cadre and there just aren't enough photos to notice a pattern, and definitely not enough photos of the Reynolds frames. However, given the photos that are there, it seems like BBs were mixed between years on the Columbus frames. I've seen mid-80's frames with the same BB that you mention aptivaboy, a couple that are completely smooth with no eyelets, and one or two a year or so later that look like mine.

    Thanks, it's my frame and I'm really liking the color myself. It's a 61 cm and it's a "P" stamp, just turned 90 degrees.

    Interesting, I measured the same point on my seat stays and they measure 16.25 mm. It flares out slightly to 16.43 mm at just above the brake bridge, then tapers down to 11.51 mm just above the chain hanger.

    What do the rear brake bridges and top tube cable routing look like on your Reynolds bikes?

    EDIT: Posted more pictures of my frame here.
    Last edited by clalor; 08-21-2010 at 10:25 AM.

  10. #10
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    Here are a couple pics. It's sounding like that is a 753 what with the diameter of the seat stays being the same and all. I think that's a significant difference from my Corsa.
    Quote Originally Posted by clalor
    I've been looking at BB pictures of the '80-'88 bikes on Cadre and there just aren't enough photos to notice a pattern, and definitely not enough photos of the Reynolds frames. However, given the photos that are there, it seems like BBs were mixed between years on the Columbus frames. I've seen mid-80's frames with the same BB that you mention aptivaboy, a couple that are completely smooth with no eyelets, and one or two a year or so later that look like mine.

    Thanks, it's my frame and I'm really liking the color myself. It's a 61 cm and it's a "P" stamp, just turned 90 degrees.

    Interesting, I measured the same point on my seat stays and they measure 16.25 mm. It flares out slightly to 16.43 mm at just above the brake bridge, then tapers down to 11.51 mm just above the chain hanger.

    What do the rear brake bridges and top tube cable routing look like on your Reynolds bikes?
    Attached Images Attached Images

  11. #11
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    The routing is aero, and the rear brake bridge looks the same. I'll try to take a few pics and figure out how to post them.

  12. #12
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    Pics, yes!

    Can't wait to see them!

  13. #13
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    Agreed, more pics, more better!

  14. #14
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    Okay, here 'ya go! Please excuse the mess, the kitty toys, the clothes strewn haplessly around my little condo.

    https://s231.photobucket.com/albums/...aboy/Bicycles/

    Not shown is the 2000 Lemond Zurich with Chorus and Superbe Pro (my current ride in the garage) and the 1986 Specialized Allez SE.

    Some of these are waiting for restoration and total repaints. I had hoped to have enough cash to take care of the Allez and the Montagner this summer, but a strike, pay cut, etc., all got in the way.

    Robert

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    Hmm, it looks like your seat stays are a bit smaller in diameter that what Martin measured on his. How do your stays attach to the lug?

  16. #16
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    I just uploaded a couple of images of the seat lug to the same Photobucket account. Does it look like there's an extra point in the lugs? I'm looking laterally, literally down the halfway of the lug.

  17. #17
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    I have doubts

    the BB on that Professional is 1985. The early Merck's 84-86 had over the BB cable routing
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    one nation, under surveillance with liberty and justice for few

    still not figgering on biggering

  18. #18
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    Well, I'm just going on what Gita told me via email:

    The A along with the numbers is the serial number and the A indicates that
    the frame is 86 - 87. If it is the Reynolds 753 it would be the Grand Prix
    model which is the only model they did with that tube set. I hope this
    helps.

  19. #19
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    I'm getting confused. I have a couple of confirmed 1985 Professionals. They both have a Z as the date code, and an A as the model code. They both have under the bottom bracket cable routing. I also have an earlier Professional that has a similar date and serial number as the one atpjunkie posted, which is an early 80's Professional. The E in atp's picture is an early 80's date code, not the later mid 90's date code.

    Until martinrjensen posted his bike, I had never seen a 753 that wasn't a Gran Prix, and had the engraved seat stay caps. He pointed out this catalog scan from the Bulgier site that shows a 753 tubed bike that is not a Gran Prix, but doesn't give a clear explanation of what it is. A Criterium, perhaps?
    https://bulgier.net/pics/bike/Catalo..._merckx3/4.jpg

  20. #20
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    The reason I am calling it a Professional model is that it has a "P" for a model designation and on the Cadre site that is listed as a Professional. Mine had no model name on the original paint job. in fact before the frame as blasted I didn't even see the P on the bottom bracket. The link I posted is exactly what my bike looked like originally also, and there is no model designation on that page for the bike. a lot of mystery....
    EDIT: All I can say is that it is a great riding bike. Boneman has a similar looking frame as mine only his is pink.

  21. #21
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  22. #22
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    Thanks, that's a nice color. When ya gonna get it built up? I love riding mine. It's not too stiff or anything, a very nice riding frame, stiffer that my Serotta, or at least i will say my Serotta feels a little smoother (the Serotta does have a carbon fork), but a nice comfortable ride. You know, I'm almost thinking after seeing all different types of bottom brackets, that Merckx just grabbed off the shelf, whatever bottom bracket they had sitting there. Not that it's a bad thing, but I have seen several different styles on essentially the same year and model of bike.

  23. #23
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    It won't get built up for awhile. It needs a full repaint and money is very tight. There are some rust spots and a small dent that will need to be rolled and filled. It also needs a fork. I'm toying with the idea of a reverse 7-11 scheme, with the red and green panels reversed. I'm hoping maybe next summer? I'd like to build it up with old Mavic parts. The 631 spider crank is here, but Mavic shifters are rare. We'll see.

    You're certainly right about Merckx using whatever was lying around. I've also never seen another Merckx with seat stays that attach quite the way that mine do. Also, check out the seat lug; it looks like there's an extra point there on the lateral sides, a small shallow point that I don't recall seeing anywhere else, so the seat lug actually has four points. One thing that I've never understood was the L-shaped indentations or cutouts on the bottom brackets. What purpose did they serve?

  24. #24
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    yes, I just realized your seat stays don't have the embossed signature on the tops of them. They are definitely different than mine. I agree about the BB too. Don't have a clue other than maybe the bottom bracket is sleeved for some reason. That 7-11 paint scheme is great. Reverse would be too. I went modern on my components. It's 10 speed Chorus.
    Quote Originally Posted by aptivaboy
    It won't get built up for awhile. It needs a full repaint and money is very tight. There are some rust spots and a small dent that will need to be rolled and filled. It also needs a fork. I'm toying with the idea of a reverse 7-11 scheme, with the red and green panels reversed. I'm hoping maybe next summer? I'd like to build it up with old Mavic parts. The 631 spider crank is here, but Mavic shifters are rare. We'll see.

    You're certainly right about Merckx using whatever was lying around. I've also never seen another Merckx with seat stays that attach quite the way that mine do. Also, check out the seat lug; it looks like there's an extra point there on the lateral sides, a small shallow point that I don't recall seeing anywhere else, so the seat lug actually has four points. One thing that I've never understood was the L-shaped indentations or cutouts on the bottom brackets. What purpose did they serve?

  25. #25
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    I would like to go modern, but the rear spacing is 125-126 mm, I believe, so I'm stuck with older drivetrain components. As for the 7-11 scheme, I've always thought that while the Merckx 7-11 paintwork was pretty, that the colors, especially the green, were too dark. I might go for a somewhat lighter red and green, more like the colors that Serotta used when he made the 7-11 team bikes.

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