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Thread: Dogma F8!

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaxRomana View Post
    Stiffness and power transfer?!?

    Have you actually ridden the 65.1? it's rock solid stiff and the power transfer is immediate. Not sure what "IMPROVEMENT" could be made there.
    I'm not sying the 65.1 isn't any of those things, what I am saying is that Pinarello, Jaguar, and the guys from Sky are suggesting the F8 is better in each of those departments FWIW.

    Take a look at Team Sky's new Pinarello Dogma F8 bike! - YouTube

    DOGMA F8 - Bernie Eisel Team SKY - YouTube
    Last edited by Rashadabd; 05-29-2014 at 10:23 AM.
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  2. #27
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    I really like everything about it but the colors....have to see one in person. everything else looks good. If I read a bunch of reviews that say its way better than the 65.1 I might be tempted!
    Dogma, synapse disc, caad 10, de rosa neo primato, felt CX, epic, fat bike

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donn12 View Post
    I really like everything about it but the colors....have to see one in person. everything else looks good. If I read a bunch of reviews that say its way better than the 65.1 I might be tempted!
    yeah I like white bikes.. and well their white one is pretty ho hum with the red/black mixed in. The F8 is the new flagship, so of course they are going to say it's better... another 100g lopped off would have been nice but seems it would be pretty easy to get a sub15 pound anyways. I'll consider but really like the AX lightless EVO-D right now....only if there was white.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdntrxi View Post
    yeah I like white bikes.. and well their white one is pretty ho hum with the red/black mixed in. The F8 is the new flagship, so of course they are going to say it's better... another 100g lopped off would have been nice but seems it would be pretty easy to get a sub15 pound anyways. I'll consider but really like the AX lightless EVO-D right now....only if there was white.
    First ride review:

    First Ride: 2015 Pinarello Dogma F8 Race Bike | Bicycling Magazine
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  5. #30
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    The other colors are also up on the Pinarello site. There are some lighter options available. It looks like you can can customize the color of your F8 through Pinarello's custom paint program as well.
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rashadabd View Post
    First ride review
    Typical Bicycling garbage, first comment sums it up perfectly:
    "One year you're gushing about the bike and the next year you pan it"

    Seriously, it was Bike of the Year, now they call it "heavy, not very lively, a dated ride."

    I really don't think any of the hacks there have ever ridden a bicycle. Much less a Pinarello.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cinelli 82220 View Post
    Typical Bicycling garbage, first comment sums it up perfectly:
    "One year you're gushing about the bike and the next year you pan it"

    Seriously, it was Bike of the Year, now they call it "heavy, not very lively, a dated ride."

    I really don't think any of the hacks there have ever ridden a bicycle. Much less a Pinarello.


    I just read the first ride report in Bicyling.com's website as well . They almost start off trashing the previous model and then extoll the virtues of the new one. So typical, but with a production cycle of two years, would you really want to hear your new f-8, wasn't as good as you were supposed to think in just 24 months. Apparently bicycling now says the predecessor was complicated, too heavy, a dated ride and a front that was not smooth or compliant. An older review from the same publication called it a "a highly responsive bike, but one that’s also compliant enough for long rides". Are these reviews written by sockpuppets?

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cinelli 82220 View Post
    Typical Bicycling garbage, first comment sums it up perfectly:
    "One year you're gushing about the bike and the next year you pan it"

    Seriously, it was Bike of the Year, now they call it "heavy, not very lively, a dated ride."

    I really don't think any of the hacks there have ever ridden a bicycle. Much less a Pinarello.
    Are you really surprised man? I don't think it's Bicycling.com, I think it's the industry and how large scale retail works in general. As someone trying to sell a product, you have to create a sense of urgency and a reason why consumers need your newest and latest product even though they have a perfectly fine similar product at home (Apple does the same thing with the iPhone doesn't it? As does Nike with each version of Jordan shoes). So, some of this is just sales in my mind. I think some reviewers just get caught up in the hype and excited about a new product (and other reviews are bought).

    However, that doesn't it make all of the praise fiction in my mind. I wouldn't call Froome or Eisel hacks and they said pretty much the same thing (but in a nicer way). I am sure the F8 is an improvement in some ways (weight, stiffness, etc.), but I don't think Dogma fans should take praise of the F8 as an insult about the 65.1. They are different bikes and in some ways the F8 will likely be superior for certain riders and 65.1 may be for others. I don't have a dog in this fight at all since there is literally a 0% chance of me buying this bike, but I like the design and I think the F8 seems like cool update. I don't see why people are getting so upset.
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rashadabd View Post
    Are you really surprised man? I don't think it's Bicycling.com, I think it's the industry and how large scale retail works in general. As someone trying to sell a product, you have to create a sense of urgency and a reason why consumers need your newest and latest product even though they have a perfectly fine similar product at home (Apple does the same thing with the iPhone doesn't it? As does Nike with each version of Jordan shoes). So, some of this is just sales in my mind. I think some reviewers just get caught up in the hype and excited about a new product (and other reviews are bought).

    However, that doesn't it make all of the praise fiction in my mind. I wouldn't call Froome or Eisel hacks and they said pretty much the same thing (but in a nicer way). I am sure the F8 is an improvement in some ways (weight, stiffness, etc.), but I don't think Dogma fans should take praise of the F8 as an insult about the 65.1. They are different bikes and in some ways the F8 will likely be superior for certain riders and 65.1 may be for others. I don't have a dog in this fight at all since there is literally a 0% chance of me buying this bike, but I like the design and I think the F8 seems like cool update. I don't see why people are getting so upset.
    To start with the article was timed with the release of the new bike. Pinarello clearly loaned bicycling an advanced model with certain expectations. Secondly these magazines thrive on ad revenue, not subscription revenue. The point of the magazine is to sell bikes. For the most part reviews are puffery written by sockpuppets. Road bikes are sold and marketed much the same way autos are done. The reader of the reviews is not the customer but the product. I'm sure bicycling is disecting hits, and demographics and resonses and selling them back to Pinarello as well.

  10. #35
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    Reading Bicycling magazine for the reviews makes about as much sense as buying Playboy for the articles.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaxRomana View Post
    Reading Bicycling magazine for the reviews makes about as much sense as buying Playboy for the articles.
    Whoa there buddy….It was just the first ride review released on the bike thus far (other than Froome's and Eisel's reports) and I thought I would share it since someone mentioned wanting to read a review. Is it automatically worthless because of the publication it's from if it is consistent with what everyone else says about the bike though? Just curious...
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  12. #37
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    I've ridden the 65.1 quite a bit and have two friends that own them. I think the front end is too harsh. I agree with their criticism of the bike in terms of too much frontal stiffness and not enough vertical compliance. I don't think they're just bashing the old model because that's what first ride reviews do. However I think the article is trash none the less.

    That being said, they didn't really say anything about riding the bike. They just made a long mumbled press release, not a ride report. The article is titled first ride. Well where's the review of the ride? A picture caption? I want to hear about the frontal stiffness comparison you're complaining about. I want to hear about the less than lively ride that you're hoping this new bike will fix. What about the compliance on the new one? They don't really say anything. It's a worthless read when hoping to find out something about the ride. It's just a regurgitation of the press release.

    So yeah, that "review" is worthless and if that magazine writes all of it's first ride reports like that than the publication is also worthless aside from showing pictures.
    use a torque wrench

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMsRepBike View Post
    I've ridden the 65.1 quite a bit and have two friends that own them. I think the front end is too harsh. I agree with their criticism of the bike in terms of too much frontal stiffness and not enough vertical compliance. I don't think they're just bashing the old model because that's what first ride reviews do. However I think the article is trash none the less.

    That being said, they didn't really say anything about riding the bike. They just made a long mumbled press release, not a ride report. The article is titled first ride. Well where's the review of the ride? A picture caption? I want to hear about the frontal stiffness comparison you're complaining about. I want to hear about the less than lively ride that you're hoping this new bike will fix. What about the compliance on the new one? They don't really say anything. It's a worthless read when hoping to find out something about the ride. It's just a regurgitation of the press release.

    So yeah, that "review" is worthless and if that magazine writes all of it's first ride reports like that than the publication is also worthless aside from showing pictures.
    Regardless of wheher the think 2 criticism is valid, and it probably is, the fact that they didn't voice it in their previous reviews, at least the ones I read, makes their objectivity more than suspect. I agree with the op who effectively called them worthless. Playboy has more value.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMsRepBike View Post
    I've ridden the 65.1 quite a bit and have two friends that own them. I think the front end is too harsh. I agree with their criticism of the bike in terms of too much frontal stiffness and not enough vertical compliance. I don't think they're just bashing the old model because that's what first ride reviews do. However I think the article is trash none the less.

    That being said, they didn't really say anything about riding the bike. They just made a long mumbled press release, not a ride report. The article is titled first ride. Well where's the review of the ride? A picture caption? I want to hear about the frontal stiffness comparison you're complaining about. I want to hear about the less than lively ride that you're hoping this new bike will fix. What about the compliance on the new one? They don't really say anything. It's a worthless read when hoping to find out something about the ride. It's just a regurgitation of the press release.

    So yeah, that "review" is worthless and if that magazine writes all of it's first ride reports like that than the publication is also worthless aside from showing pictures.
    Now, this I don't have a problem with. I actually agree that it is a poorly structured article and that they spend too much time talking about what can be found elsewhere for something called a first ride review. They do, however, discuss their experiences in bits and pieces outside of the picture caption (but not nearly enough as you pointed out).

    "As for weight, Pinarello claims it shed 80 grams from the frame, bringing it down to 860 grams (54cm frame, unpainted). Fork weight is a claimed 360 grams. Additionally, Pinarello says the F8 is more compliant than the 65.1 Think 2 and we agree. Based on our initial test rides at the launch, this is among the biggest differences from the previous version."

    "Geometry, at Sky’s request, has not changed, but we’d have guessed otherwise. The F8 is much more reactive and lively than the 65.1 Think 2. It loses none of its stability, but gains a lighter, more precise feel."
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  15. #40
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    I thought the article was definitely more press release than test.
    Dogma, synapse disc, caad 10, de rosa neo primato, felt CX, epic, fat bike

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donn12 View Post
    I thought the article was definitely more press release than test.
    I couldn't agree more. With that article they contradict themselves with many previously written stuff. I also find it funny that with their newly released review of the latest edition of the Rokh they actually mention how it extols some the Dogma's virtue. In a good way. They are apples and oranges and react totally different.

    Weight? They bring up the how heavy the previous Dogma weighed? Seriously? To the best of my knowledge Pinarello has never used the light weight frame card as a selling point. In fact, I believe it was Bicycling that did an interview with Giovanii and he stated light weight frames are not something he is fond of.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rashadabd View Post
    Whoa there buddy….It was just the first ride review released on the bike thus far (other than Froome's and Eisel's reports) and I thought I would share it since someone mentioned wanting to read a review. Is it automatically worthless because of the publication it's from if it is consistent with what everyone else says about the bike though? Just curious...
    Bicycling magazine doesn't do "reviews". They do industry press releases. Their "opinions" are completely worthless and should be treated as such.

    Who is this "everyone else" saying anything about the new Dogma? It hasn't even come out.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaxRomana View Post
    Bicycling magazine doesn't do "reviews". They do industry press releases. Their "opinions" are completely worthless and should be treated as such.

    Who is this "everyone else" saying anything about the new Dogma? It hasn't even come out.
    You are a little too uptight about this IMO man. Ok, you hate Bicycling Magazine and their reviews. Fair enough…. As for your other comment, pretty much every cycling site and publication has released an article on the F8 at this point, as has Pinarello and Team Sky. This is the only one that calls itself a review so far.
    Every climb has its end, for verily with difficulty there is relief...

  19. #44
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    Dogma F8!

    Wrench science .. Whopping up charge for white.. Damn them
    PO is a liberal echo chamber.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdntrxi View Post
    Wrench science .. Whopping up charge for white.. Damn them
    the fact that is the one you wanted, means they were on to something. looks nice to me too, bt that price pushes it past Colnago c-60 pricing.

  21. #46
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    Dogma F8!

    Quote Originally Posted by Trek_5200 View Post
    the fact that is the one you wanted, means they were on to something. looks nice to me too, bt that price pushes it past Colnago c-60 pricing.
    I agree.. I'd probably opt for a c60 if the price is the same..
    PO is a liberal echo chamber.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdntrxi View Post
    I agree.. I'd probably opt for a c60 if the price is the same..

    Pinarello seems to be taking a page from the auto manufacturers. BMW has one price, but then charges more money for the nicer colors. Used to be a few hundred for metalic paint, but now they charge even more for a few color schemes.

  23. #48
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    So isn't the price of the white one basically a My Way frame price?

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trek_5200 View Post
    the fact that is the one you wanted, means they were on to something. looks nice to me too, bt that price pushes it past Colnago c-60 pricing.
    Look like Pinrello stole a page from the auto makers. BMW has long since charged extra for metallic paint. They charge even more for the hot color schemes.

  25. #50
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    I saw the F8 today at Freshbikes. I sincerely hoped it would not look great....but it does. They said the black with red will be the only color until the fall. I will have to ride one or see what it is all about. I am tempted
    Dogma, synapse disc, caad 10, de rosa neo primato, felt CX, epic, fat bike

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