Fake Dogmas will be harder to spot - Page 2
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  1. #26
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    main reason is 99% of general public won't be able to tell or even care about the difference. Personally I can't tell, especially when the bike is moving. besides those who own the fake are 100% satisfied with their purchase knowingly paying a measly $500 for fake carbon frame.

    Do you know how BORED a regular person would be if you point out the difference between Dogma and Prince/Paris, yet along the difference between the fake and the real Dogma? Majority of people just care about aesthetics, a guy here has a real Rolex diver's watch and a fake one. He wears the real one on special occations and the fake one on a daily basis. He's happy with both, does not worry about ruining the fake one and he's proud to wear the real deal when it counts.

    ride the bike, don't regret/get pissed. just be happy if you have the real deal. you are not missing anything on the fakes. I'd be more worried not to get a chain suck or crash on the real Pinarello's, so maybe get a fake ones as a beater?
    every 3 seconds, a child dies of hunger. how much did you spend on your bike?

  2. #27
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    You can copy design but you cant copy quality.

    The reason the fakes appear is becuase the orginals are just way overpriced.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by vladvm View Post
    you are not missing anything on the fakes. I'd be more worried not to get a chain suck or crash on the real Pinarello's, so maybe get a fake ones as a beater?
    Like this guy??
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  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by BunnV View Post
    So, I saw another Chinarello sell for almost $2000 on eBay and I noticed that the seller used the term "OEM" (original equipment manufacturer) in his title, along with "Pinarello Dogma 60.1" I think adding "OEM" is the sellers sneaky way of disclosing that it is a fake without saying it's a fake. OEM's make products for many different brands. I don't know if I'm right or wrong, it still doesn't make the seller any less of a scum bag.
    Agreed! And Ebay should be held accountable as well for letting this go on on their auctions.. They do pull some auctions but many go through until the end and buyers are getting ripped off thinking they have bought the real deal..

  5. #30
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    Pinarrello quality is a myth and warranty is a joke. My close friend had two of the same model and year because the first frame broke around the seat tube exactly after the 2 year warranty period. He liked the model so well that he bought another one. And guess what happened. One month after the warranty that frame broke around the seat tube exactly the same. He had all his paperwork and he even still had the first frame and he went to the dealer. Even the dealer agreed that Pinarello should accept some responsiblity but Nope. If you actually believe that you are getting more because you are paying more you are a fool. And as for Chinese quality, I can argue that one all day because I have a Chinese frame and I've beat the crap out of it for a year now. It's holding up just fine. As for Chinese warranty, who cares, I can buy alot of frames and still not touch the price of one frame from Pinarello.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRFIXALL4 View Post
    Pinarrello quality is a myth and warranty is a joke. My close friend had two of the same model and year because the first frame broke around the seat tube exactly after the 2 year warranty period. He liked the model so well that he bought another one. And guess what happened. One month after the warranty that frame broke around the seat tube exactly the same. He had all his paperwork and he even still had the first frame and he went to the dealer. Even the dealer agreed that Pinarello should accept some responsiblity but Nope. If you actually believe that you are getting more because you are paying more you are a fool. And as for Chinese quality, I can argue that one all day because I have a Chinese frame and I've beat the crap out of it for a year now. It's holding up just fine. As for Chinese warranty, who cares, I can buy alot of frames and still not touch the price of one frame from Pinarello.
    Well good luck to you (and your Chinese frame!) but I don't understand why you feel obliged to come onto this forum and moan about Pinarellos despite the fact that you don't own one! There seems to be a "reverse snobbery" from people who buy cheap frames and then feel that everybody else is obliged to as well! What people forget is that there is also real pleasure to be gained from just owning a nice bike in the same way as owning a piece of art or a nice car!

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnthonyL88 View Post

    Whenever you're [snip] the best [/snip] a popular, high-priced brand people will always try to make fake products. Rolex, Louis Vuitton, Prada, Pinarello, Colnago etc.
    Fixed it for you

    Rolex? Best? [giggle]
    Last edited by RJP Diver; 12-18-2011 at 11:59 AM.
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  8. #33
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    My post was in response to T-Dog saying that you can copy design but you don't get the quality. I wonder who has done any testing to back that up. Lets see the proof. And so you understand why I moan it's because of the price. I just can't imagine what idiot thinks a bicycle can be worth $16,500 unless it's trimmings are 24kt gold. And as for the Dogma there's nothing there that makes this bike stand out from any other machine. It's not like a sports car either, it won't help you get noticed by any hot girls at a club ride. So what's the attraction that would make someone spend that much money?

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRFIXALL4 View Post
    And as for the Dogma there's nothing there that makes this bike stand out from any other machine.
    Now that's just nonsense - whether you love or hate the Dogma (and I can understand why people might hate it!) there is no way you could say that it doesn't stand out!

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRFIXALL4 View Post
    My post was in response to T-Dog saying that you can copy design but you don't get the quality. I wonder who has done any testing to back that up. Lets see the proof. And so you understand why I moan it's because of the price. I just can't imagine what idiot thinks a bicycle can be worth $16,500 unless it's trimmings are 24kt gold. And as for the Dogma there's nothing there that makes this bike stand out from any other machine. It's not like a sports car either, it won't help you get noticed by any hot girls at a club ride. So what's the attraction that would make someone spend that much money?
    With that attitude it clearly shows you drive a honda and snub your nose to those who drive ferraris. Get on a real pin and understand why people pay for the real deal.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by vontress View Post
    I've never seen any kind of chinese fake that was the same as the original. It might be good enough for some, but it's not the real thing. They copy it because it's a fantastic product. People buy it because they are envious. Just be glad your riding a highly sought out bike that many wish they could have. None of these buyers chose this bike over the pinnarello. Schwinn should be upset, that's who's customer was stolen.
    I also think the fakes affect those wanting to sell their legit Pinarellos. I'm a big fan of buying used bikes, but I would only buy a Pinarello from an authorized retailer. It would be more expensive, but at least I know it was legit.

  12. #37
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    If I were to go with the real deal it would be Colnago. At least they stand behind their product. More history and fame. And their bikes don't resemble crooked sticks.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by antihero77 View Post
    With that attitude it clearly shows you drive a honda and snub your nose to those who drive ferraris. Get on a real pin and understand why people pay for the real deal.
    HEY, HEY! What's wrong with a Honda??? (not that I drive one of course )
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  14. #39
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    There's nothing wrong with driving a Honda, I wouldn't mind driving a NSX =).

    There are many beautiful frames to choose from, it's just which frame do you like better? Colnago, Pinarello, Wilier, Time and Look etc.

    I almost bought the Colnago C59 frame, but decided on the Pinarello Dogma 2 di2 frame.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by revolator View Post
    HEY, HEY! What's wrong with a Honda??? (not that I drive one of course )
    Nothing wrong with my S2000 or my FP5 (especially since I put a complete new 11 speed Campag groupset on it this week!)

  16. #41
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    There is nothing wrong with driving a Honda. I just don't c what the point is going on a pinarello discussion to bash the bike.

  17. #42
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    This is what happens when you sell your soul for profits and move your framebuilding offshore. Pinarello has no one to blame but themselves for this mess. Their designs are their soul, their intelectual capital, yet for a quick buck they're prepared to hand these over to a bunch of foreigners and turn their IP into cookie cutters for everyone else to rip off.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by zacolnago View Post
    This is what happens when you sell your soul for profits and move your framebuilding offshore. Pinarello has no one to blame but themselves for this mess. Their designs are their soul, their intelectual capital, yet for a quick buck they're prepared to hand these over to a bunch of foreigners and turn their IP into cookie cutters for everyone else to rip off.
    Pinarello Dogma frames are made in Italy. Other Pinarello frames are made in Taiwan, just like majority of the bike companies. A lot of stuff which aren't made in China are copy by the Chinese.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnthonyL88 View Post
    Pinarello Dogma frames are made in Italy. Other Pinarello frames are made in Taiwan, just like majority of the bike companies. A lot of stuff which aren't made in China are copy by the Chinese.
    I thought that was the case that Dogma frames are built in Italy but somewhere I read that now all frames are made in Taiwan but the Dogmas are painted in Italy. That's why Pinarello can get away with the "made in Italy" stamp because according to EU rules if a certain amount of work is done in a particular country it can be labeled as such, even if it wasn't
    entirely made in that particular country (Italy in this case).

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by savechief View Post
    If you wanted to reward yourself with "the best", and feel that a real Pinarello meets this criteria, then your money has been well spent.

    In my mind, there are two camps of consumers that should be upset about the existence of OEM/fake Pinarellos:

    1) Those that bought a Pinarello for the look and to show off. Most of the people they are trying to impress probably couldn't tell a real from a fake, so their money was not well spent.

    2) Those that bought their Pinarello for the performance, but are concerned that the fakes aren't too far off in terms of performance and their skill/ability/fitness wouldn't allow them to discern the differences between the real and the fake in a blind ride (don't try this at home...far too dangerous).

    Both of these groups of people wonder if maybe...just maybe...they would have satisfied their goals by saving several thousand dollars and picking up a fake instead. Just one guy's opinion.

    You forgot
    3) Those who don't own a Pinarello, but are sickened by the existence of fake Pinarellos and the people who buy them. Those who despise theft and counterfeiting. And those who detest people who want the look of something good and real but think they should be able to get it for next to nothing, so they buy this crap.
    Other countries need to stop hatin' or we'll unfriend them. - Christine

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  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by PlatyPius View Post
    You forgot
    3) Those who don't own a Pinarello, but are sickened by the existence of fake Pinarellos and the people who buy them. Those who despise theft and counterfeiting. And those who detest people who want the look of something good and real but think they should be able to get it for next to nothing, so they buy this crap.
    Very well said sir. I just had a discussion with a couple of my ride buddies who do not understand the concept of why I don't patronize FAKE goods. What you said above succinctly captures my philosophy.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnthonyL88 View Post
    Pinarello Dogma frames are made in Italy.
    Bare carbon Dogma frames are made in Taiwan, this is well known and acknowledged by Pinarello themselves.

    A certain amount of value is added to the frame in Italy, and it qualifies as "Made in Italy" under EU rules.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by mykol77 View Post
    I thought that was the case that Dogma frames are built in Italy but somewhere I read that now all frames are made in Taiwan but the Dogmas are painted in Italy. That's why Pinarello can get away with the "made in Italy" stamp because according to EU rules if a certain amount of work is done in a particular country it can be labeled as such, even if it wasn't
    entirely made in that particular country (Italy in this case).
    I sent Pinarello in Italy an email and they said the Dogma frame is Made in Italy (Not just painted in Italy). I asked the owner of Wrench Science where is the Dogma frame being made, he told me the Dogma frame is 100% made in Italy. I bought my Dogma 2 frame from Wrench Science.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnthonyL88 View Post
    I sent Pinarello in Italy an email and they said the Dogma frame is Made in Italy (Not just painted in Italy). I asked the owner of Wrench Science where is the Dogma frame being made, he told me the Dogma frame is 100% made in Italy. I bought my Dogma 2 frame from Wrench Science.
    That's my understanding of the 2011 Kobh as well.

  25. #50
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    AnthonyL88, Will you post that e mail?
    Last edited by BunnV; 12-22-2011 at 07:53 AM. Reason: add name
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