gun laws: do you people not understand?
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  1. #1
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    Angry gun laws: do you people not understand?

    they only restrain those who obey the law???

    jeebus pole dancer.

    would you prefer:

    1) law abiding citizens carrying, with at least eight hours of training...they get local and fed background checks, etc...and a good 3-4 hrs about the laws regarding use of lethal force...coupled with armed felons/would-be felons on the streets?

    OR

    2) law abiding citizens unarmed...coupled with armed felons/would-be felons on the streets?

    wtf?
    One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got into my pajamas I'll never know.

  2. #2
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    I found some really good tips on gun control here.

    http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/ayoob85.html

  3. #3
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    Undies Jr. says:

    "Gun control means hittin' your target!"
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  4. #4
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    I'll take #1 please.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by haiku d'etat
    they only restrain those who obey the law???

    jeebus pole dancer.

    would you prefer:

    1) law abiding citizens carrying, with at least eight hours of training...they get local and fed background checks, etc...and a good 3-4 hrs about the laws regarding use of lethal force...coupled with armed felons/would-be felons on the streets?

    OR

    2) law abiding citizens unarmed...coupled with armed felons/would-be felons on the streets?

    wtf?
    Did someone come by your house today and try to take your guns? Just wondering what might have precipitated this...a story, a governmental action...something. Because as far as I knew...gun laws in some states such as Florida and Texas were becoming more liberalized (in the classic sense) rather than restrictive. And as far as I know, not a single state as gone so far as to repeal the 2nd amendment.
    In the time of battle you don't rise to the occasion you resort to the level of your conditioning...

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by thatsmybush
    more liberalized (in the classic sense) rather than restrictive. And as far as I know, not a single state as gone so far as to repeal the 2nd amendment.
    Welcome to Massachusetts. You simply cannot get a liscense to carry in many places in Mass, especially in the areas where you'd need it the most.
    Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth.

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  7. #7
    Quiet, daddy's drinking
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    What are we talking about here?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbrumm
    Welcome to Massachusetts. You simply cannot get a liscense to carry in many places in Mass, especially in the areas where you'd need it the most.

    Is it the right to own firearms or is it the right to wear one on your hip and pretend to be in the wild, wild west? If it's the latter I don't think that you will get much support for that position from law enforcement.
    Just because you won't listen to reason does not mean I have to listen to idiocy.

    No collusion with the delusion

    “Nationalism always breaks its promises because nationalists hate enemies in their countries more than they hate the enemies of their countries" The Guardian.

  8. #8
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    We're

    Quote Originally Posted by Turtleherder
    Is it the right to own firearms or is it the right to wear one on your hip and pretend to be in the wild, wild west? If it's the latter I don't think that you will get much support for that position from law enforcement.

    talking concealed carry permits, and most states allow it. I know several guys who don't GO ANYWHERE without a sidearm.
    "I never meant to say that the Conservatives are generally stupid. I meant to say that stupid people are generally Conservative. I believe that is so obviously and universally admitted a principle that I hardly think any gentleman will deny it." John Stuart Mill, 1866

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  9. #9
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    what if

    Quote Originally Posted by Turtleherder
    Is it the right to own firearms or is it the right to wear one on your hip and pretend to be in the wild, wild west? If it's the latter I don't think that you will get much support for that position from law enforcement.
    What if it were for a 98 pound female prosecutor with plenty of enemies? Ok to carry, then?

  10. #10
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    Here in Chicago handguns are a plague on society without question. The news is bloody as hell every day.

    It bugs me that lowdown slimy gun dealers are catching a break from the Republican Congress. This is not about protecting someone's rights under the Constitution--it's about the NRA, which is against any reasonable laws governing handguns and automatic weapons. The NRA is the enemy--very bad for the country and society.



    "The Call of the Gun Lobby

    Published: June 19, 2006 [NYT]


    It is a ghastly fact of public safety that for the past three years the most basic information about illegal gun trafficking in America has been hermetically classified as a state secret — kept off limits to the public and the news media. The nation used to be told, for example, that 57 percent of crime guns came from just 1 percent of gun dealers, and something should be done about that. But — shhh — not any more: not since a malleable Congress and administration buttoned up reams of vital information by putting the privacy of unscrupulous gun dealers over the safety of the public.


    And now the Republican-led House is preparing to make the secrecy restrictions even more lunatic by actually leaving police officers subject to felony conviction if they dare to share interesting data on illicit dealers with colleagues in other departments.

    The criminalizing of peace officers for swapping federal data beyond their narrow jurisdictions is only one of the provisions in a pair of treacherous bills quietly on the move, in another sweeping triumph for the gun lobby. The bills would gut what is left of initiative in the hamstrung bureau that's supposed to control firearms. They would roll back laws for stopping illicit gun traffickers, water down criminal definitions and penalties, and snuff out the current notification to concerned police officials about the virtual fire sales of multiple guns to single buyers by dealers arming the underworld.

    These two bills would give crooked dealers more — not less — leeway in interstate trafficking. The Justice Department has warned that the worst provisions would have a "chilling effect" on gun control and law enforcement. If they had been in effect during the deadly spree of the Washington, D.C., snipers, the dealer who peddled the murder rifle and scores of other crime guns could never have been shut down under federal law.

    The gun lobby will do almost anything to deny basic information about the gun mayhem that Mayor Michael Bloomberg of New York and 60 other mayors are properly pursuing through the courts. The bills answer the question of how craven Congress can get in catering to its demands."
    Last edited by BadHabit; 06-20-2006 at 06:51 AM.

  11. #11
    Back from the dead
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    How do I know that you obey the law?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by kpcw
    Pry my lightsaber from cold, dead hands.
    No thank you. That has to be code for...something.

  13. #13
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    Can I have one of these babies?............I'll never have to worry about home defense again. I can even tow it behind my car....."just in case".......
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  14. #14
    Quiet, daddy's drinking
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixed
    What if it were for a 98 pound female prosecutor with plenty of enemies? Ok to carry, then?

    Are we going to go down the "what if" road? There is a big difference between the regular guy on the street living in suburbia and a prosecutor that has had death threats made against her. So yes, if she gets the training then she can carry.
    Just because you won't listen to reason does not mean I have to listen to idiocy.

    No collusion with the delusion

    “Nationalism always breaks its promises because nationalists hate enemies in their countries more than they hate the enemies of their countries" The Guardian.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turtleherder
    Are we going to go down the "what if" road? There is a big difference between the regular guy on the street living in suburbia and a prosecutor that has had death threats made against her. So yes, if she gets the training then she can carry.
    So, you have finally figured out the random violence algorithm?? Call Nobel now! That is fantastic.... I don't want to be too selfish or anything, but since you seem to know when, where, and who random violence will effect, am I in the clear? how about the wife and kids? my parents?

    I am anxiously awaiting your answer.
    Tyler, you are by far the most interesting single-serving friend I have ever met.

  16. #16
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    I'd prefer if nobody had to own guns for protection. I know you live in the wild west down there, but around here it's pretty safe without having to pack heat.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixed
    What if it were for a 98 pound female prosecutor with plenty of enemies? Ok to carry, then?
    Taser or pepper gas would be safer and just as effective.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by haiku d'etat
    they only restrain those who obey the law???

    jeebus pole dancer.

    would you prefer:

    1) law abiding citizens carrying, with at least eight hours of training...they get local and fed background checks, etc...and a good 3-4 hrs about the laws regarding use of lethal force...coupled with armed felons/would-be felons on the streets?

    OR

    2) law abiding citizens unarmed...coupled with armed felons/would-be felons on the streets?

    wtf?
    No2 works fine in the UK. More die in a month in the US than in a year in Britain. Even if you compare it on a per capita basis, in the US there is almost 30 times the chance of being murdered with a gun! You're 5 times less likely to get murdered with a gun in Canada and I hear they love guns!

    http://www.guncontrol.ca/Content/Cda-US.htm

  19. #19
    Quiet, daddy's drinking
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    Quote Originally Posted by handsome rob
    So, you have finally figured out the random violence algorithm?? Call Nobel now! That is fantastic.... I don't want to be too selfish or anything, but since you seem to know when, where, and who random violence will effect, am I in the clear? how about the wife and kids? my parents?

    I am anxiously awaiting your answer.

    O.K., you will not be the victim of random street violence. The odds of it happening to any given person are very low unless you engage in activities that can lead to acts of violence. So unless you are crack head, drug dealer or gang banger you are probably in the clear. I hope that eases your mind.
    Just because you won't listen to reason does not mean I have to listen to idiocy.

    No collusion with the delusion

    “Nationalism always breaks its promises because nationalists hate enemies in their countries more than they hate the enemies of their countries" The Guardian.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turtleherder
    O.K., you will not be the victim of random street violence. The odds of it happening to any given person are very low unless you engage in activities that can lead to acts of violence. So unless you are crack head, drug dealer or gang banger you are probably in the clear. I hope that eases your mind.
    So bad things only happen to bad people.....

    BTW, How are things in Pleasantville??
    Tyler, you are by far the most interesting single-serving friend I have ever met.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bocephus Jones II
    Taser or pepper gas would be safer and just as effective.

    Not necessarily, I've seen patients who were brought in by the police who had to be shot because the taser failed. Recently I saw one who was high on PCP.....unfortunately, the adrenocortical axis shift that occurs renders them impervious to pain...he was shot three times in the chest....none of which stopped him as he was charging the police.....fourth shot stopped him....it was in the head. Not much for me to do....except call the coroner.
    "I never meant to say that the Conservatives are generally stupid. I meant to say that stupid people are generally Conservative. I believe that is so obviously and universally admitted a principle that I hardly think any gentleman will deny it." John Stuart Mill, 1866

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  22. #22
    Quiet, daddy's drinking
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    Quote Originally Posted by handsomerob
    So bad things only happen to bad people.....

    BTW, How are things in Pleasantville??
    Not necessarily. But it sure increases your odds of something happening if you hang around bad people. And I might add I looked up the stats on violent crime as reported to the government. If you take the number of violent crimes and divide by the population you end up with a percentage chance of being a victim of a violent crime. The number is .0053507. So what types of crimes to you see happening to your family? And are these fears based on specific acts that have happened in your neighborhood or are they based on your imagination or movies you have watched?
    Just because you won't listen to reason does not mean I have to listen to idiocy.

    No collusion with the delusion

    “Nationalism always breaks its promises because nationalists hate enemies in their countries more than they hate the enemies of their countries" The Guardian.

  23. #23
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    Please retract that spurious citation. Here is your "quote" as described in a pro-gun website:

    BOGUS, FAKE & QUESTIONABLE QUOTES
    FALSELY ATTRIBUTED TO THE
    FOUNDING FATHERS


    Even though the Founding Fathers and their contemporaries were quite clear about their support for the individual right to keep and bear arms, some overzealous people have attempted to falsely attribute a few additional quotes to their legacy in order to defeat the gun grabbers. Creating bogus quotes is wrong and counterproductive. It harms the rest of the message sent by any person utilizing a proven fake quote, even if the person is unintentionally and unknowingly repeating a made-up statement.

    The fact is that the gun haters lie enough for everyone involved in the gun control debate. Resorting to their methods only lowers us to their level, and therefore it is best to keep our side honest.

    While it is impossible to prove that these are phony quotes, no historian has been able to verify the original citation required for authenticity. It is better to be safe than sorry. Check out how an anti-gun judge discredited a letter writer by clicking on this sentence.

    For this reason, if you locate any websites innocently citing any of the following quotes, please forward the URL of this page to that page’s webmaster. Furthermore, if you can locate proof that one of these quotes is in fact valid, please forward the information HERE!

    George Washington


    Perhaps the most ‘infamous’ bogus saying attributed to a Founding Father is the ‘liberty teeth’ quote alleged to have been said by George Washington. One version of this tale reads:



    Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence. The church, the plow, the prairie wagon, and citizen's firearms are indelibly related.


    From the moment the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to ensure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable.
    Every corner of this land knows firearms, and more than 99 99/100 percent of them by their silence indicate they are in safe and sane hands.


    The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference; they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.


    When firearms, go all goes; we need them every hour.


    This has several variations including "hour" for "moment" and sometimes added as part of an actual Washington quote "A free people ought not only to be armed…" The various citations are even more numerous than different wordings: Address to the Second Session of the First U.S. Congress; Speech to Congress of January 7, 1790, printed in the Boston Independent Chronicle, January 14, 1790; The Federalist No. 53; Debates and Proceedings in the Convention of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, 1785.


    The problems with this quote are many. (1) Prairie wagons were not being utilized and the prairies were uninhabited by European settlers at the time. (2) The percentage use and other modern English phrases such as "safe and sane" are suspicious and atypical for the time period. (3) The bold proclamation of needing firearms is odd since nobody was considering gun control against law-abiding people at the time. (4) Too many convenient topics are covered in one passage.


    Despite all these problems, could parts of this quote be true? Maybe. But until it can be properly documented, stick to the many proven pro-gun quotes from George Washington and other Founding Fathers.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by physasst
    Not necessarily, I've seen patients who were brought in by the police who had to be shot because the taser failed. Recently I saw one who was high on PCP.....unfortunately, the adrenocortical axis shift that occurs renders them impervious to pain...he was shot three times in the chest....none of which stopped him as he was charging the police.....fourth shot stopped him....it was in the head. Not much for me to do....except call the coroner.
    well there are always extreme examples. If I lived in a war zone I'd consider packing for sure, but I'm guessing that PCP-crazed criminals charging me in Boulder would happen about as often as me winning the lottery.
    "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark." -S. Hawking

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadHabit
    Despite all these problems, could parts of this quote be true? Maybe. But until it can be properly documented, stick to the many proven pro-gun quotes from George Washington and other Founding Fathers.
    I've never heard the "quotes" listed in that article.


    supervillain

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